(14 Aug 2013, 3:21 pm)gtomlinson wrote On the Consultations

The last Gateshead one.

For the X21 the 3 most requested stops were Low Fell Town Centre, Harlow Green and Birtley Station Lane. None of these are served.

1/3 of people wanted Pilgrim Street as a terminus as it was more convenient. Buses serve Eldon Square

52% were in favour of low floor single deck buses on the X21. Pronto is operated by double deck services.

60% of people thought it was a good idea to simplify fares to offer better value tickets - Angel Saver price rose.

81% of people DIDN'T CARE about the plans to shorten the Coaster Route and terminate it at Gateshead, but apparently they do now

Kibblesworth customers wanted more important links to Gateshead and Newcastle. Birtley and Chester Le Street were not important. - Waggonway diverted through Kibblesworth.

41% were against a Waggonway diversion to Kibblesworth - Waggonway serves Kibblesworth

Four key themes came out, one was

'Concerns over reliability and increased journey times on service 28A' - Since the changes the Waggonway is arguably GNE's most unreliable service (most likely due to stock)

When it comes to consultation, one of my favourites is always the first one they done - Metrolink. Baring in mind that the route was via Herrington Burn when it the consultation was ran.

Question : "We plan to increase the daytime frequency of service M1 to operate every 10 minutes during the daytimes Monday to Saturday between Heworth, Concord, Galleries and Houghton. What do you
think of this idea?"

Answer : "70% of respondents thought that our plan to increase the daytime frequency of the M1 to every ten minutes between Heworth and Houghton-le-Spring would create a ‘much more convenient’ service. Only 4% said that this would be ‘less convenient’ or ‘much less convenient’."

Result : M1 re-routed away from 1/3 of it's route, to work Fencehouses instead.

Potentially everyone who filled that survey in living in the Herrington/Philidelphia/Newbottle area would have been strongly for that increase in service. Who wouldn't be? If that's not misleading customers I don't know what is.

Worth pointing out a few other points too. After all it was the company that proposed these changes. Not the public.

"76% of people said that refurbishing the buses on the M1 and using bigger vehicles on the M2/M3 would be a ‘big improvement’ to the service." - yet to happen.

"82% of people said that providing ‘real-time’ information at M1 bus stops would be ‘extremely helpful’ or ‘very helpful’ when travelling." - yet to happen.

I think GNE's consultations are a waste of time the only survey I can think of Where they have significantly changed the original plans are the 'East Durham' & Peterlee one the questions were;

202
North of Westlea: We’re thinking about making some changes to this service. The route would continue to operate unchanged between Sunderland and Dalton Park, but then instead of operating to Peterlee would continue to Durham via Hetton le Hole. Peterlee would still be accessible on service 203.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

South of Westlea: We’re thinking about making some changes to this service. The route would continue to operate between Seaham and Peterlee via Murton, but from Seaham would instead operate to Houghton le Spring. Sunderland would continue to be served with a revised service.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

203
We’re thinking about making some changes to this service. The route would be largely unchanged between Houghton le Spring, Dalton Park and Peterlee, but would be diverted to serve Murton and South Hetton.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?


207/8
If we introduced a simple, regular half-hourly service rather than having one clockwise and one anti-clockwise loop each once per hour, would this make you travel more, less, or about the same as you do currently?


209/10
If we introduced a simple, regular half-hourly service rather than having one clockwise and one anti-clockwise loop each once per hour, would this make you travel more, less, or about the same as you do currently?

259-262
Sherburn: instead of the current mixture of services and frequencies, we’re thinking about operating a simple, regular hourly service through Sherburn Village to Durham.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

Belmont/Cheveley: instead of the current mixture of services and frequencies, we’re thinking about operating a simple, regular hourly service between Durham, High Grange, Cheveley Park, Belmont and Peterlee.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

High Pit/Low Pit: instead of the current mixture of services and frequencies, we’re
thinking about operating two simple, regular services to Durham.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?


65
Service 65 will continue to operate between Durham and Seaham every hour, but we would like to divert service 65 via Sherburn Village near Durham, via Northlea in Seaham, and extend it from Seaham to Sunderland. A revised service 260 and the 20 continue to serve Belmont.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?


Of those; only 209/210, 207/208, 259 & 260 changes took place, which were all pretty minor a better frequency for the 208, the simplified route for the 209 and a regular service for 25 & 260.
The 202 changes well I don't know what they really were thinking there at all, I can't work my head around what they were offering or why it would work. The 203 via South Hetton & Murton didn't go ahead I assume this was to cover the loss of the 202 if that was to go to Durham? The 65 again has changed quite a bit, via Sherburn, don't know why a diversion to Northlea was thought about and going to Sunderland was to cover the loss of the 202? No wonder they were changed they sound really bizare. I must admit I miss the 203 and 65, the 265 is now really packed a lot of time and for the life of me I can't stand them East Durham MPD's. The 203 was a good little route and was a quick link for Seaham-Dalton Park-Easington.

I can't remember this one, what year was it off?

(16 Aug 2013, 8:23 pm)Michael wrote I can't remember this one, what year was it off?

Peterlee Consultation from Jan 2013. Just before the march changes.

Ah right thanks
The one about the streetshuttle getting buses... its being ages... looks like they could finnaly get them

I like the idea for the 65 extending it to Sunderland but we got the x7 instead

(16 Aug 2013, 8:37 pm)Michael wrote Ah right thanks
The one about the streetshuttle getting buses... its being ages... looks like they could finnaly get them

The M2/M3 used to be busier before it was merged with the W2/W3. i.e. the M2 between Waterview Park and Heworth, and the M3 between CLS and Heworth. I'd say there was more of a demand for them then.

I wonder if they could make just 2 streetshuttle services by merging the M1/M2 and the W5/W6

Make them each every 15 mins

Odd Workings 15/08/13

8303 Drifter on the 38
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9527233188/

605 on the Short 39's
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9527245458/

524 on the M1
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9524457817/

3979 on the 38
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9524460981/

Odd Workings 16/08/13

OK Expressway 5232 spent the day on Loan to Gateshead and was in Service on the 95
Photo 1: http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9527235512/
Photo 2: http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9527234406/

Quaylink 8314 on the Orbit 52-Took about 25 photos of this, and only caught the blind once on this photo.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9527237198/

Crusader 5332 on the X66
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9527233790/

FAB57 5169 on the 97
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9524450789/

3964 is Now Fully Branded Real Radio and is seen on the 24
http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9524454255/

(16 Aug 2013, 8:36 pm)CatsFast101 wrote Peterlee Consultation from Jan 2013. Just before the march changes.

I live in Peterlee and I never saw any consulation, only found out after the consulation was finished, otherwise I would of handed them a 100 page document of proposed bus changes for the East Durham area lol.

I was told by GNE that there will be a consulation for the East Durham Brand coming up soon, so I waited for the consulation to come on GNE website, wasn't the East Durham consulation the first consulation not to be online and only done by on bus?.

The consultations have always been a sham, with questions phrased to get the answers GNE wanted. When they were online too many people from outside the area gave their views, some who knew what they were talking about like members of this Forum (haha). So then they distribute a few copies in libraries and perhaps on the local branded buses (which almost guaranteed they wouldn't be seen in the area they were intended for!). I completed a few on line ones and added quite a few comments which were all ignored. The only possible success I had with any of my views being taken into account was the one including the X3 (which I do use sometimes) and X36, which a friend managed to hunt down and found one copy in a local library. I said they needed to keep a Newcastle service via Fulwell Grange and East Boldon and pointed out the impossibility of their original plan for "connecting" a proposed 20 minute service 9 with a 30 min frequency via the 26 or X36 route at Boldon ASDA. The X3 continued, sort of, and the 9 remained every 30 minutes. Now GNE have lost the plot and ignore the concept of a overall bus SERVICE by cutting away at the edges odd journeys here and there ( the first journey from Durham on the 21 and the 1840 bus from Newcastle on the X21 being just two examples of many in the latest changes). And all these reductions at a time when Tyne & Wear ITA want any excuse to bring in the Quality Contracts, for which there is little logical reason and certainly no financial one, but Northern are playing into their hands.

The thing that always got me about the M1 consultation was the company's response when I kept challenging the misleading questions: "we're not obliged to consult". Yeah, well I acknowledge that, but do it in a honest way if you do.

Most of the time the changes are on VOSA before the consultation has finished.... so its pointless

(16 Aug 2013, 8:20 pm)CatsFast101 wrote I think GNE's consultations are a waste of time the only survey I can think of Where they have significantly changed the original plans are the 'East Durham' & Peterlee one the questions were;

202
North of Westlea: We’re thinking about making some changes to this service. The route would continue to operate unchanged between Sunderland and Dalton Park, but then instead of operating to Peterlee would continue to Durham via Hetton le Hole. Peterlee would still be accessible on service 203.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

South of Westlea: We’re thinking about making some changes to this service. The route would continue to operate between Seaham and Peterlee via Murton, but from Seaham would instead operate to Houghton le Spring. Sunderland would continue to be served with a revised service.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

203
We’re thinking about making some changes to this service. The route would be largely unchanged between Houghton le Spring, Dalton Park and Peterlee, but would be diverted to serve Murton and South Hetton.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?


207/8
If we introduced a simple, regular half-hourly service rather than having one clockwise and one anti-clockwise loop each once per hour, would this make you travel more, less, or about the same as you do currently?


209/10
If we introduced a simple, regular half-hourly service rather than having one clockwise and one anti-clockwise loop each once per hour, would this make you travel more, less, or about the same as you do currently?

259-262
Sherburn: instead of the current mixture of services and frequencies, we’re thinking about operating a simple, regular hourly service through Sherburn Village to Durham.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

Belmont/Cheveley: instead of the current mixture of services and frequencies, we’re thinking about operating a simple, regular hourly service between Durham, High Grange, Cheveley Park, Belmont and Peterlee.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?

High Pit/Low Pit: instead of the current mixture of services and frequencies, we’re
thinking about operating two simple, regular services to Durham.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?


65
Service 65 will continue to operate between Durham and Seaham every hour, but we would like to divert service 65 via Sherburn Village near Durham, via Northlea in Seaham, and extend it from Seaham to Sunderland. A revised service 260 and the 20 continue to serve Belmont.
Would this make you travel more, less or about the same as you do currently?


Of those; only 209/210, 207/208, 259 & 260 changes took place, which were all pretty minor a better frequency for the 208, the simplified route for the 209 and a regular service for 25 & 260.
The 202 changes well I don't know what they really were thinking there at all, I can't work my head around what they were offering or why it would work. The 203 via South Hetton & Murton didn't go ahead I assume this was to cover the loss of the 202 if that was to go to Durham? The 65 again has changed quite a bit, via Sherburn, don't know why a diversion to Northlea was thought about and going to Sunderland was to cover the loss of the 202? No wonder they were changed they sound really bizare. I must admit I miss the 203 and 65, the 265 is now really packed a lot of time and for the life of me I can't stand them East Durham MPD's. The 203 was a good little route and was a quick link for Seaham-Dalton Park-Easington.

I remember the last time GNE offered a Durham-Seaham-Sunderland route in the Wear Buses days, 254 I think it was, operated primarily by Metroriders.
I think it operated along the lines of the 202 and present 238 to Sunderland, along the Coast Road.

The 265 now is awful, the MPDs have no power, they struggle to get up the banks and are not comfortable at all...

Back in the days of the 65 when 3944/45/46 operated on the 65, I would moan about the use of deckers, they were normally reliable buses, but too big for the usage of the service...When we got the occasional Scania on the route, they performed well.

As for consultations, I don't know why they do them sometimes, the wording is a con some of the time, saying 'this is what we'd like to do' when it should say 'this is what we intend to do'

There was a broken down Streetshuttle getting a lift just beyond Heworth, heading towards Wardley a short while back and a Quaylink is in Shields as I type. Didn't catch service or fleet number, but chances are it's a Gateshead based service and there aint too many of them in Shields these days

(17 Aug 2013, 10:41 am)Andreos1 wrote There was a broken down Streetshuttle getting a lift just beyond Heworth, heading towards Wardley a short while back and a Quaylink is in Shields as I type. Didn't catch service or fleet number, but chances are it's a Gateshead based service and there aint too many of them in Shields these days

I would say it was on the 5? - But 8314 was working for Gateshead yesterday on the Orbit, so might be on the 27?

The quaylink is definetly operating service 5 today

Highhwayman 4948 is operating service 27

Unidentified loop is operating highwayman 97

Forgot to mention last night, that I spoke to a fellow bus spotter yesterday who works at Percy Main as an Engineer, And he told me the Cobalt Clipper 309/310 will be getting New Buses in January 2014, Not next Month which someone had said on Facebook and was reported on here about 2 Months ago.

Also the citaros for the M1 will be 2nd hand....

(17 Aug 2013, 12:26 pm)Michael wrote Also the citaros for the M1 will be 2nd hand....

No they are not and the new buses for 309/310 were never due for delivery next month.

Alright christ sorry, just what ive being told about the ciatros for the M1 was just sharing it with every one ..
What are the 309/310 getting

Just what someone said on Facebook, obviously it was lies as it was unreported prior to that and there is no way and order of new buses would be received in under 2 Months, The order would of have to of been made in January for the Delivery Date of September to be even possible. I said before January 2014 for 309/310 if what I was told is indeed true which I suspect it is.

As for the M1, I'm not even going to say whether they New/2nd Hand, as I have zero idea, This rumour seems to be going back and fourth constantly at the minute. And I certainly haven't heard/read anything confirmed yet as to whether they are new or not. I hope they are new as the M1 is one of my local routes and I use it Daily. To be fair though there isn't anything wrong with the Scanias on there currently.

Are the south tyne 5 cadets just undergoing maintenance as the quaylink versas have been operating a few days now along with solo 639 on Wednesday or Thursday it was.

(17 Aug 2013, 12:58 pm)Adam Malarkey wrote As for the M1, I'm not even going to say whether they New/2nd Hand, as I have zero idea, This rumour seems to be going back and fourth constantly at the minute. And I certainly haven't heard/read anything confirmed yet as to whether they are new or not. I hope they are new as the M1 is one of my local routes and I use it Daily.

Believe me.....brand spanking new

i'll take your word for it haha

(17 Aug 2013, 1:06 pm)citaro5284 wrote Believe me.....brand spanking new

We're holding you to that now.

As far as I'm aware, an order has not yet been placed for new vehicles for the 309/310. I believe we originally noted that new vehicles were planned but nothing had been ordered - which is likely why citaro5284 has not commented on vehicle type! When (if) something is ordered, I'm sure he will be able to confirm it if he so wishes.

(17 Aug 2013, 12:17 pm)Adam Malarkey wrote Forgot to mention last night, that I spoke to a fellow bus spotter yesterday who works at Percy Main as an Engineer, And he told me the Cobalt Clipper 309/310 will be getting New Buses in January 2014, Not next Month which someone had said on Facebook and was reported on here about 2 Months ago.

the name on Facebook is Lee Wardle his grandfather works for Percy Main thats how he knows before everyone he is a legend

(17 Aug 2013, 12:54 pm)Michael wrote Alright christ sorry, just what ive being told about the ciatros for the M1 was just sharing it with every one ..
What are the 309/310 getting

Volvo Wright Gemini 2 similar to the ones used on Ten 10/10A/10B question is where are Citaros and Ominicities off to i am sure somebody said 17/17A or 8/78/78A i think Citaros should go on X7 if it is getting popular

I can't find the post, but did someone confirm that GNE were looking at Geminis for the 56?

Just mere speculation/thinking out loud, but there's going to be about 25/26 displaced Volvo B7TL/Wright Eclipse Geminis (02 to 04 plates iirc) from Go Ahead London when the NB4Ls are delivered for route 11. Maybe worth a look for a short term replacement? The dual door operation may help with the loadings between Newcastle and Wrekenton on the 56 too.

Alternatively it may be worth them waiting for route 12 to get NBFLs. It's currently operated using a mix of Volvo B9TL and B5L Hybrid/Wright Eclipse Gemini 2s - all of which are 61 plates. The current PVR is 41.

Although not confirmed, we've got reports of Deckers for service 56 & 20 and new buses presumably also Deckers for the 309/310.
So IF this is true we could see 28 Scainas, 10 Omnicitys & 7 Ciatro's so it could be a lot of future fleet movements if this all goes ahead.