My Dad was telling me earlier that he saw a Tyne Tees Express on the 51 this morning. Don't know whether it was a B9 or the spare B7 though.

T q

(07 Sep 2013, 3:15 pm)Adam Malarkey wrote Some oddish working i have caught on SPD's over the past month with a few others on my Flickr profile.

8215
27 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9690816557/
57 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9694050604/
58 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9690815379/

8220
49A - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9694049348/

8222
35 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687228249/
60 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687227871/


8223
2A - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9690473148/
2C - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687233511/
36A - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687229017/

8225
64A - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9694048618/

8226
38 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9690471276/
20A - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687232447/

8227
26 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9694047128/
56 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9694055042/
Staff Shuttle - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9694055042/

8231
X3 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687229437/
61 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687229771/

8232
61 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9687230063/

8233
20 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9694043058/
39 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9690809203/

8239
1 - http://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalarkey/9690808229/

No offense, but this isn't relevant or newsworthy. No of those are odd at all!

(07 Sep 2013, 5:38 pm)W179SCU wrote T q
No offense, but this isn't relevant or newsworthy. No of those are odd at all!

Everyone has a different interpretation of what is Odd and what is not and I understand that. Just because it's a Northern Branded Spare, Doesn't mean it is not Odd for it to appear on certain route it doesn't often appear on

Have to agree with Tom on the above... The only "Northern" workings I'd consider 'rare' is if the service was meant to be allocated a Northern single decker, but a double decker appeared - and vice versa. Loans too, otherwise they're not rare at all...

Minus the 1, 2A/C, 60/61 - I'd say that the SPD workings you've given happen pretty much daily, if not every other day.
With Merits consumed on "Great Park" service X40 a lot recently due to 4950/1/2 being VOR a lot, it has been quite common for other Northerns to be used instead of the more common B10BLE, for example.

(07 Sep 2013, 6:16 pm)Daniel wrote Have to agree with Tom on the above... The only "Northern" workings I'd consider 'rare' is if the service was meant to be allocated a Northern single decker, but a double decker appeared - and vice versa. Loans too, otherwise they're not rare at all...

Minus the 1, 2A/C, 60/61 - I'd say that the SPD workings you've given happen pretty much daily, if not every other day.
With Merits consumed on "Great Park" service X40 a lot recently due to 4950/1/2 being VOR a lot, it has been quite common for other Northerns to be used instead of the more common B10BLE, for example.

I agree with that Daniel, even the 38 instead of a Cadet had an SPD on a few days ago, I have even seen the odd Vyking on also in past few weeks, which I would determine as odd. Whereas say an SPD on the 20 for example I know happens on a Daily Basis due to current problem with the Prince Bishops Buses, they were just used so I had something in for that particular Fleet Number, so they can be ignored I suppose.

But there is other examples out there i.e. SLF Dart 8289 on the 50 or an SPD on the WSS which I would also say is odd. Whereas Tom thinks because it is Northern Branded Spare that it doesn't count as an odd working which I fully understand, and he probably isn't the only person to think that.

those ruddy SPDs are awful

I think just because its branded in a fleet livery doesn't mean it can't be odd. That's like saying all arriva/stagecoach services can't have an odd working which isn't true. However a lot of your examples, Adam, aren't really that odd a SPD on the 60 is pretty regular, as is on the 2A/2C also both generally use an SPD in place of their respective vehicles. The 56, 20 and all Deptford services often use SPD's as Deptford have a few lying around. SPD's on northern branded services are not odd at all. The 1, 49, 61 are the only ones I'd consider slightly noteworthy.

Coaster Rebrands are starting to take shape with the following all being rebranded

5262 - NK56 KJX
5263 - NK56 KJY
5264 - NK56 KJZ
5266 - NK56 KKB
5267 - NK56 KKC

Link to Photos of the above - http://www.flickr.com/photos/nerbp/

(07 Sep 2013, 8:34 pm)CatsFast101 wrote I think just because its branded in a fleet livery doesn't mean it can't be odd. That's like saying all arriva/stagecoach services can't have an odd working which isn't true. However a lot of your examples, Adam, aren't really that odd a SPD on the 60 is pretty regular, as is on the 2A/2C also both generally use an SPD in place of their respective vehicles. The 56, 20 and all Deptford services often use SPD's as Deptford have a few lying around. SPD's on northern branded services are not odd at all. The 1, 49, 61 are the only ones I'd consider slightly noteworthy.

Aureolin made a brilliant post on this thread originally which was moved into the suggestions thread which was created so that this thread doesn't get too off-topic.
See here for said post.

Every operator, regardless of what colour the bus is, has unusual allocations. Every (big) operator has an allocation list, specifying what should be allocated to which service. It irritates me when cynics say, "Ditch branding - paint every bus red and get rid of branding..." Of course it is easier to spot a Go North East odd working to a Stagecoach North East/Arriva North East odd working (exception being if the bus is actually branded or in a special livery), but every operator does have its odd workings.
I find with Go North East that (assuming a depot's spare vehicle percentage can accommodate for this) Northern B10BLEs cover for more prestigious services which have Euro 5 vehicles usually. This is followed by Cadets, and in turn followed by SPDs. I've frequently seen Northern B10BLEs on the 2A/2C, but a SPD is used a lot less.
What do most define a GNE odd working as though? A branded vehicle appearing off-route. When it comes to Northerns, I just look at the vehicle type the service usually has when it is branded. If it's nothing similar at all, it's a 'rare Northern working'.
It is easier to judge rare Northern workings when it comes to unbranded services. A double decker appearing on the 39 is quite rare because it is usually allocated an MPD. An MPD being allocated to a service which runs off onto a scholar? Of course that will be rare too.

(07 Sep 2013, 8:51 pm)Daniel wrote Aureolin made a brilliant post on this thread originally which was moved into the suggestions thread which was created so that this thread doesn't get too off-topic.
See here for said post.

Every operator, regardless of what colour the bus is, has unusual allocations. Every (big) operator has an allocation list, specifying what should be allocated to which service. It irritates me when cynics say, "Ditch branding - paint every bus red and get rid of branding..." Of course it is easier to spot a Go North East odd working to a Stagecoach North East/Arriva North East odd working (exception being if the bus is actually branded or in a special livery), but every operator does have its odd workings.
I find with Go North East that (assuming a depot's spare vehicle percentage can accommodate for this) Northern B10BLEs cover for more prestigious services which have Euro 5 vehicles usually. This is followed by Cadets, and in turn followed by SPDs. I've frequently seen Northern B10BLEs on the 2A/2C, but a SPD is used a lot less.
What do most define a GNE odd working as though? A branded vehicle appearing off-route. When it comes to Northerns, I just look at the vehicle type the service usually has when it is branded. If it's nothing similar at all, it's a 'rare Northern working'.
It is easier to judge rare Northern workings when it comes to unbranded services. A double decker appearing on the 39 is quite rare because it is usually allocated an MPD. An MPD being allocated to a service which runs off onto a scholar? Of course that will be rare too.

So is the Cadet that has been on the M1 for a few days this week, classed as rare or not?
Just it's usually Renowns or SPD's if the Solars are missing...

(07 Sep 2013, 8:51 pm)Daniel wrote Aureolin made a brilliant post on this thread originally which was moved into the suggestions thread which was created so that this thread doesn't get too off-topic.
See here for said post.

Every operator, regardless of what colour the bus is, has unusual allocations. Every (big) operator has an allocation list, specifying what should be allocated to which service. It irritates me when cynics say, "Ditch branding - paint every bus red and get rid of branding..." Of course it is easier to spot a Go North East odd working to a Stagecoach North East/Arriva North East odd working (exception being if the bus is actually branded or in a special livery), but every operator does have its odd workings.
I find with Go North East that (assuming a depot's spare vehicle percentage can accommodate for this) Northern B10BLEs cover for more prestigious services which have Euro 5 vehicles usually. This is followed by Cadets, and in turn followed by SPDs. I've frequently seen Northern B10BLEs on the 2A/2C, but a SPD is used a lot less.
What do most define a GNE odd working as though? A branded vehicle appearing off-route. When it comes to Northerns, I just look at the vehicle type the service usually has when it is branded. If it's nothing similar at all, it's a 'rare Northern working'.
It is easier to judge rare Northern workings when it comes to unbranded services. A double decker appearing on the 39 is quite rare because it is usually allocated an MPD. An MPD being allocated to a service which runs off onto a scholar? Of course that will be rare too.

Yes I agree with that Daniel and it's sums it up perfectly. In recent weeks I have caught a few good examples of this, A Vyking/SPD on the 38 - Usually a Cadet, Northern MPD on the 26 - Usually a Vyking. That sort of thing I would determine as Odd. Minus the Past Month I'm rarely out so to me I may of miss interpreted what would be classed as a "Northern Odd Allocation" which some disagree with which I understand, which has sparked quite a debate over the past few hours since my original post.

(07 Sep 2013, 9:02 pm)Andreos1 wrote So is the Cadet that has been on the M1 for a few days this week, classed as rare or not?
Just it's usually Renowns or SPD's if the Solars are missing...

In my opinion it would be as it is always on the 88/88A on a Daily Basis otherwise, rarely sees action on another Washington Based Service.

I'd argue that an SPD/Cadet being used as a spare vehicle are interchangeable anyway, given their similar size. A B10BLE should be used to cover for a full size vehicle but if you have none of them available then next on the list should be used....
Most routes only have their PVR branded, so therefore there will usually be one bus off the road and unavailable for service whether that be due to breakdowns or just routine maintenance (or even 4 week exam), therefore Northern buses on branded routes shouldn't be classed as unusual, as that is exactly what they are for. Of course some routes don't have a brand, and therefore will receive Northern buses routinely. Some branded routes may have less than their PVR branded (the extra workings on the 39 would be a good example, albeit that route is obviously no longer branded!) where they don't work all day on the route. I know there used to be a few trips on the 27 which didn't work on there all day, just ran off a scholars service and covered for a bus that was away doing scholars elsewhere on the 27.

I guess (just like most things), not everyone will agree on everything - everyone will interpret how rare a Northern vehicle is on x service differently.
The Cadet on the M1 will be deemed rarer by some than others, as there isn't a major difference in capacity but it doesn't happen often.

So the because the Cadet is in Northern branding, then it isn't rare - but in the case of the M1, because it is the 4th choice vehicle for that particular service, it is rare...

Should we just leave it to the posters judgement whether they mention it or not?
If someone doesn't class it as rare, then they can just bit their lip eh?

At this rate we'll need a forum for the forum about the forum to talk about the forum

I appreciate the photos and I don't mind if they stay in this thread personally as long as it was one hyperlink instead of a page full. Just a linked sentence. Something simple.

Tynedale Links MPD 555 is on the 0830 74A departure from Newcastle, presumably meaning it worked the 0725 X84 service from Hexham.
Disappointing service launch...

(08 Sep 2013, 7:34 am)Daniel wrote Tynedale Links MPD 555 is on the 0830 74A departure from Newcastle, presumably meaning it worked the 0725 X84 service from Hexham.
Disappointing service launch...

I thought that might happen with there only being two buses each way on a Sunday. Run it as a service instead of running empty buses from Hexham to Newcastle, similar to how the Pronto X46 runs. To make matters worse your runs are 4 hours apart, so I'd hate to think what happens if the bus breaks down.

(08 Sep 2013, 8:40 am)aureolin wrote I thought that might happen with there only being two buses each way on a Sunday. Run it as a service instead of running empty buses from Hexham to Newcastle, similar to how the Pronto X46 runs. To make matters worse your runs are 4 hours apart, so I'd hate to think what happens if the bus breaks down.

I expected the 74A would utilise a branded Solar rather than it being the other way round though. 'Tis somewhat disappointing, as the 685 could seem so much more attractive on Sundays.

(08 Sep 2013, 8:59 am)Daniel wrote I expected the 74A would utilise a branded Solar rather than it being the other way round though. 'Tis somewhat disappointing, as the 685 could seem so much more attractive on Sundays.

It's really short sighted by GNE, and all about penny pinching - free Wi-Fi (except Sundays). I worry that most people other than OAPs would opt to use the TEN over this on a Sunday, despite it taking 10mins longer. I know if I was going to be sat on a bus for an hour I'd rather have Wi-Fi and to be able to keep my phone charged...

(08 Sep 2013, 8:59 am)Daniel wrote I expected the 74A would utilise a branded Solar rather than it being the other way round though. 'Tis somewhat disappointing, as the 685 could seem so much more attractive on Sundays.

Don't you mean the 85? On Sundays, the 685 is split with Arriva only operating the Hexham-Newcastle section hourly as the 85, while Stagecoach operate Hexham-Carlisle as the 685 every 3 hours (with a 31 minute layover on each trip on 685, and a 27 minutes layover on the 85). So, the X84 doesn't have a leg to stand-on on Sundays really, 2 journeys each way vs an hourly service on more-or-less the same corridor, no contest.

They're only running the X84 as a replacement for the 684 journeys that ran at the same times on a Sunday.

I'm just trying to compare the Bishop Auckland to Hexham operations, following on from the comments above.

Bishop:
* Dedicated depot on hire to reduce costs.
* Reliant on pushing Buzzfare.
* 4 services launched in competition to Arriva.
* Limited service on Sundays.
* Cascaded vehicles, including second hand examples.

Hexham:
* Dedicated depot.
* Competing against train and 685.
* Several local services feeding into town centre with ongoing connections to neighbouring towns and Newcastle.
* Very limited service on Sundays on certain routes.
* Mixture of cascaded and brand new vehicles
servicing the town.

It is obvious where GNE are focusing their attention, investing more in the Tyne Valley, than down the road in the Wear Valley.
Hexham is a more prosperous area, with the weekday market attracting people from around the area as well as the commuters along the valley needing to get onto Tyneside.

However, like with the Coaster, I can't help feeling as though they have missed the boat so to speak with the x84/85.
The majority of people using the Hexham services at this time of year, will be residents living in the Hexham area.
If the X84/85 had been launched earlier in the year, then it could have found its feet perfectly with visitors and tourists wanting to go to Hexham over the summer, when the weather is nicer.
Needless to say, Sunday is an ideal day for people to do that - just not as autumn sets in...

From the other side of the coin, as we get closer to Christmas, the attraction may well be the Metrocentre and Newcastle, with loads increasing from Northumberland as they head onto Tyneside to do their shopping.

Touching on what Daniel was saying, the 74a probably won't have enough passengers to justify using a Scania and to be honest, I can't see the 7.24 X84 on a Sunday morning being too busy either.
As aureolin said, for the sake of 10mins, you can get a 10 and charge your phone up.

This isn't me having another go at GNE, I'm just trying to stand back, trying to understand and analyse their services.

(08 Sep 2013, 9:23 am)Kuyoyo wrote Don't you mean the 85? On Sundays, the 685 is split with Arriva only operating the Hexham-Newcastle section hourly as the 85, while Stagecoach operate Hexham-Carlisle as the 685 every 3 hours (with a 31 minute layover on each trip on 685, and a 27 minutes layover on the 85). So, the X84 doesn't have a leg to stand-on on Sundays really, 2 journeys each way vs an hourly service on more-or-less the same corridor, no contest.

Every time I've seen the service on Sundays (including this morning), the blind has said 685 Hexham. I know it is split, but I wasn't aware of any re-numbering of the service.

EDIT: The only place that seems to list the service as 85, is Arriva's website. Journey Planner, Nexus and the buses themselves all display 685 as normal, just showing Hexham as its terminus as opposed to Carlisle.

(08 Sep 2013, 9:35 am)Andreos1 wrote I'm just trying to compare the Bishop Auckland to Hexham operations, following on from the comments above.

Bishop:
* Dedicated depot on hire to reduce costs.
* Reliant on pushing Buzzfare.
* 4 services launched in competition to Arriva.
* Limited service on Sundays.
* Cascaded vehicles, including second hand examples.

Hexham:
* Dedicated depot.
* Competing against train and 685.
* Several local services feeding into town centre with ongoing connections to neighbouring towns and Newcastle.
* Very limited service on Sundays on certain routes.
* Mixture of cascaded and brand new vehicles
servicing the town.

It is obvious where GNE are focusing their attention, investing more in the Tyne Valley, than down the road in the Wear Valley.
Hexham is a more prosperous area, with the weekday market attracting people from around the area as well as the commuters along the valley needing to get onto Tyneside.

However, like with the Coaster, I can't help feeling as though they have missed the boat so to speak with the x84/85.
The majority of people using the Hexham services at this time of year, will be residents living in the Hexham area.
If the X84/85 had been launched earlier in the year, then it could have found its feet perfectly with visitors and tourists wanting to go to Hexham over the summer, when the weather is nicer.
Needless to say, Sunday is an ideal day for people to do that - just not as autumn sets in...

From the other side of the coin, as we get closer to Christmas, the attraction may well be the Metrocentre and Newcastle, with loads increasing from Northumberland as they head onto Tyneside to do their shopping.

Touching on what Daniel was saying, the 74a probably won't have enough passengers to justify using a Scania and to be honest, I can't see the 7.24 X84 on a Sunday morning being too busy either.
As aureolin said, for the sake of 10mins, you can get a 10 and charge your phone up.

This isn't me having another go at GNE, I'm just trying to stand back, trying to understand and analyse their services.

Came in with no passengers this morning! :p
I expect the next one will come in with some, but I will update you all when it shows at half 12.

I would say the reason the X84/85 weren't launched earlier is that they are commuter services and not aimed at taking twirlys to Hexham Market.

10 passengers on the X84 (MPD 557) pulling into Newcastle now.
Again blinded up for 74A!

(08 Sep 2013, 11:31 am)Daniel wrote 10 passengers on the X84 (MPD 557) pulling into Newcastle now.
Again blinded up for 74A!

Was it late in?

(08 Sep 2013, 11:40 am)aureolin wrote Was it late in?

557 was in about 3 mins late.
555 came in on the 74A about 15 mins late. Now sat dead in Eldon Sq until half 4.

(08 Sep 2013, 11:56 am)Daniel wrote 557 was in about 3 mins late.
555 came in on the 74A about 15 mins late. Now sat dead in Eldon Sq until half 4.

What does the driver do for the rest of the day?

Picking up on a topic which was discussed a few months ago, re 'landing' fees for buses using Interchange facilities like Eldon Square, I wonder if they are charged for parking up too?