Don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but 3963 has lost its abysmal purple door - it's now red.

(16 Jan 2016, 6:06 pm)LeeCalder wrote We went for a drive around the back of Deptford last week, and noticed a lot of the Cats Fast ;-) Solar's are in a right mess....

Upgrade needed?

An upgrade isn't needed - the replacement vinyls just need to be fitted.

The examples which are missing branding have all been reported, and Go North East is waiting for the third party company to print and fit the replacement vinyls. The branding on the "Fast Cats" branded vehicles is applied by a third party company which is no longer used as frequently by Go North East, and this is presumably why this company will be dragging their heels.

I understand the frequency for service X35 on some of the buses is shown as 'every 60 minutes' (as opposed to every 30), though I don't think this will be corrected in the immediate future.

It's a bit of a dull brand which doesn't sell the service as much as it could do - nor does it really meet the standards of some of the more recent brand designs. Given that older designs seem to be under review at the moment (Red Arrows, Loop, etc), I would hope that the Fast Cats could be looked at, too.

(16 Jan 2016, 6:06 pm)LeeCalder wrote We went for a drive around the back of Deptford last week, and noticed a lot of the Cats Fast ;-) Solar's are in a right mess....

Upgrade needed?

Speaking of Deptford, there's still that offer.

(16 Jan 2016, 6:07 pm)Jackamcardle wrote Don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but 3963 has lost its abysmal purple door - it's now red.

Thank god it looked horrendous like that Fab57 Renown a few months back.

(16 Jan 2016, 6:24 pm)Dan wrote An upgrade isn't needed - the replacement vinyls just need to be fitted.

The examples which are missing branding have all been reported, and Go North East is waiting for the third party company to print and fit the replacement vinyls. The branding on the "Fast Cats" branded vehicles is applied by a third party company which is no longer used as frequently by Go North East, and this is presumably why this company will be dragging their heels.

I understand the frequency for service X35 on some of the buses is shown as 'every 60 minutes' (as opposed to every 30), though I don't think this will be corrected in the immediate future.

It's a bit of a dull brand which doesn't sell the service as much as it could do - nor does it really meet the standards of some of the more recent brand designs. Given that older designs seem to be under review at the moment (Red Arrows, Loop, etc), I would hope that the Fast Cats could be looked at, too.

It's good to hear that the missing vinyl's are being replaced.

On the subject of branding's being dull, a friend of mine was talking about the branding's of the present and past, and how quite frankly they have gone downhill. I'll use the example he used...

1 - Magic Roundabout, Doxford Clipper and Pink Angel
2 - Green Arrow, indiGO and Coast and Country.

I know which option I would rather choose, and it certainly wouldn't be 2.

(16 Jan 2016, 6:52 pm)LeeCalder wrote It's good to hear that the missing vinyl's are being replaced.

On the subject of branding's being dull, a friend of mine was talking about the branding's of the present and past, and how quite frankly they have gone downhill. I'll use the example he used...

1 - Magic Roundabout, Doxford Clipper and Pink Angel
2 - Green Arrow, indiGO and Coast and Country.

I know which option I would rather choose, and it certainly wouldn't be 2.

Granted, I'm not a massive fan of branding, but I think the examples you list in Option 1 pale in comparison to the examples listed in Option 2. 

I think someone needs to go to Specsavers...

I am a mix between options 1 and 2. I loved the pink version if the angel livery (pre-24 when the 'The convenient/frequent route to the heart of the north' was present) but i think the Magic Roundabout was too much on such a small vehicle. I quite like the Green Arrow and Coast&Country. Much better than the brands they replaced in my opinion.

(16 Jan 2016, 6:52 pm)LeeCalder wrote It's good to hear that the missing vinyl's are being replaced.

On the subject of branding's being dull, a friend of mine was talking about the branding's of the present and past, and how quite frankly they have gone downhill. I'll use the example he used...

1 - Magic Roundabout, Doxford Clipper and Pink Angel
2 - Green Arrow, indiGO and Coast and Country.

I know which option I would rather choose, and it certainly wouldn't be 2.

It's difficult to really compare Options 1 and 2, as these aren't like-for-like replacements.

If you and your friend were to compare the old "Lime" brand to the current "Coast & Country" brand, there would only ever be one winner (and that's the more modern "Coast & Country" design - if you needed that clarifying!) Whilst the name itself isn't as catchy, the brand design itself is spot on and is noticeable even from a distance. It really sells what's on the route of the 8 and 78 services - the various landmarks served en-route and places to visit are all clearly identifiable.

The current "indiGo" brand is a lot more eye-catching than the old "East Durham" brand, and dirt (which is unavoidable at this time of year due to grit on the road, etc) is a lot less noticeable on these buses than the examples they replaced, due to the darker base livery. In an area like Peterlee where there is competition with services from another bus operator, buses have to be striking, and I certainly feel like the pink base livery achieves this. Again - an improvement in my eyes.

I used to live in the Humbledon Hill estate when the "Magic Roundabout" was around, and I used to love travelling on the 33 service, which was ultimately down to the route branding on these buses. With hindsight; the main roundabout on the route of the 33 service was the Premier Road / Silksworth Lane roundabout, and there wasn't a great deal that was 'magic' about it, so I'm not entirely sure what is relevant about this brand..? 

Route branding is always going down to be personal preference amongst enthusiasts - the above posts in response to yours provide further evidence of this. There's good designs, and not-so-good designs, but ultimately I feel the company is delivering improvements with route branding. The more pointless brand names have been dropped, and the company is no longer 'branding for branding's sake'.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:09 pm)Dan wrote It's difficult to really compare Options 1 and 2, as these aren't like-for-like replacements.

If you and your friend were to compare the old "Lime" brand to the current "Coast & Country" brand, there would only ever be one winner (and that's the more modern "Coast & Country" design - if you needed that clarifying!) Whilst the name itself isn't as catchy, the brand design itself is spot on and is noticeable even from a distance. It really sells what's on the route of the 8 and 78 services - the various landmarks served en-route and places to visit are all clearly identifiable.

The current "indiGo" brand is a lot more eye-catching than the old "East Durham" brand, and dirt (which is unavoidable at this time of year due to grit on the road, etc) is a lot less noticeable on these buses than the examples they replaced, due to the darker base livery. In an area like Peterlee where there is competition with services from another bus operator, buses have to be striking, and I certainly feel like the pink base livery achieves this. Again - an improvement in my eyes.

I used to live in the Humbledon Hill estate when the "Magic Roundabout" was around, and I used to love travelling on the 33 service, which was ultimately down to the route branding on these buses. With hindsight; the main roundabout on the route of the 33 service was the Premier Road / Silksworth Lane roundabout, and there wasn't a great deal that was 'magic' about it, so I'm not entirely sure what is relevant about this brand..? 

Route branding is always going down to be personal preference amongst enthusiasts - the above posts in response to yours provide further evidence of this. There's good designs, and not-so-good designs, but ultimately I feel the company is delivering improvements with route branding. The more pointless brand names have been dropped, and the company is no longer 'branding for branding's sake'.

Green Arrow is more pointless than The Highwayman.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:16 pm)DanPicken wrote Green Arrow is more pointless than The Highwayman.

Green Arrow is a nicer shade of green.

(16 Jan 2016, 6:52 pm)LeeCalder wrote It's good to hear that the missing vinyl's are being replaced.

On the subject of branding's being dull, a friend of mine was talking about the branding's of the present and past, and how quite frankly they have gone downhill. I'll use the example he used...

1 - Magic Roundabout, Doxford Clipper and Pink Angel
2 - Green Arrow, indiGO and Coast and Country.

I know which option I would rather choose, and it certainly wouldn't be 2.

Option 1 for me the brands were all similar and based on the corporate livery, not done for fun.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:18 pm)DanPicken wrote Option 1 for me the brands were all similar and based on the corporate livery, not done for fun.

Don't see how the silver-based Doxford Clipper or the pink-based Pink Angel were similar to the traditionally red-based corporate livery like.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:16 pm)DanPicken wrote Green Arrow is more pointless than The Highwayman.

How is it more pointless? I don't think either the Highwayman and Green Arrow brands are relevant to the routes that the branding was applied to. You could argue that Green Arrow is a more relevant brand simply because the base colour of the bus is green.

With the Red Arrows undergoing a brand refresh, do you think Gary and Lisa's announcements from Real (Heart Radio) made will either be replaced by Brian or the S&K from Metro or another Bauer Radio DJ at the same time?

(16 Jan 2016, 6:06 pm)LeeCalder wrote We went for a drive around the back of Deptford last week, and noticed a lot of the Cats Fast ;-) Solar's are in a right mess....

Upgrade needed?

Bits of branding aye, but the majority of them seem to be operationally sound. Give me one of those 2004 Solars any day, over the usual heaps I have to endure through Durham!

(16 Jan 2016, 7:16 pm)DanPicken wrote Green Arrow is more pointless than The Highwayman.

Depends how you define pointless doesn't it? If it's increased profit across those services, then it's a job well done.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:20 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Don't see how the silver-based Doxford Clipper or the pink-based Pink Angel were similar to the traditionally red-based corporate livery like.

I think DanPicken will be referring to the synergy between different brands owing to the 'swoops' on these designs - similar to what Trent Barton does.

I don't think there has to be links between a brand design and a main corporate identity for a brand to be successful, though. According to recent research carried out by Go North East, 81% of the company's customers love their bus brand and 87% think it makes their bus much easier to identity. The survey about brand perception was carried out by researchers, BlueGrass, and also shows that 81% of people still recognise that Go North East runs their bus route, despite the links between a corporate identity and an individual brand design no longer being existent.

5251 (NK56KHX) Consett 15 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

559 (NK53TKY) Sunderland 33 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

Go North East: 0606 NK54NUB Dennis MPD/Alexander by emdjt42, on Flickr

(16 Jan 2016, 7:20 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Don't see how the silver-based Doxford Clipper or the pink-based Pink Angel were similar to the traditionally red-based corporate livery like.

The Corporate livery at the time was Red, Yellow and Blue, with the "Swoosh" or "Swoop", which I thought looked brilliant, and suited every vehicle.

Almost every brand in that year or two incorporated the swoosh, which is I think Dan's point.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:24 pm)Dan wrote I think DanPicken will be referring to the synergy between different brands owing to the 'swoops' on these designs - similar to what Trent Barton does.

I don't think there has to be links between a brand design and a main corporate identity for a brand to be successful, though. According to recent research carried out by Go North East, 81% of the company's customers love their bus brand and 87% think it makes their bus much easier to identity. The survey about brand perception was carried out by researchers, BlueGrass, and also shows that 81% of people still recognise that Go North East runs their bus route, despite the links between a corporate identity and an individual brand design no longer being existent.

5251 (NK56KHX) Consett 15 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

559 (NK53TKY) Sunderland 33 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

Go North East: 0606 NK54NUB Dennis MPD/Alexander by emdjt42, on Flickr

Didn't even notice the 'swoops' to be honest - just the colour schemes.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:09 pm)Dan wrote It's difficult to really compare Options 1 and 2, as these aren't like-for-like replacements.

If you and your friend were to compare the old "Lime" brand to the current "Coast & Country" brand, there would only ever be one winner (and that's the more modern "Coast & Country" design - if you needed that clarifying!) Whilst the name itself isn't as catchy, the brand design itself is spot on and is noticeable even from a distance. It really sells what's on the route of the 8 and 78 services - the various landmarks served en-route and places to visit are all clearly identifiable.

The current "indiGo" brand is a lot more eye-catching than the old "East Durham" brand, and dirt (which is unavoidable at this time of year due to grit on the road, etc) is a lot less noticeable on these buses than the examples they replaced, due to the darker base livery. In an area like Peterlee where there is competition with services from another bus operator, buses have to be striking, and I certainly feel like the pink base livery achieves this. Again - an improvement in my eyes.

I used to live in the Humbledon Hill estate when the "Magic Roundabout" was around, and I used to love travelling on the 33 service, which was ultimately down to the route branding on these buses. With hindsight; the main roundabout on the route of the 33 service was the Premier Road / Silksworth Lane roundabout, and there wasn't a great deal that was 'magic' about it, so I'm not entirely sure what is relevant about this brand..? 

Route branding is always going down to be personal preference amongst enthusiasts - the above posts in response to yours provide further evidence of this. There's good designs, and not-so-good designs, but ultimately I feel the company is delivering improvements with route branding. The more pointless brand names have been dropped, and the company is no longer 'branding for branding's sake'.

Granted, the Coast and Country is eye catching, and looks pretty decent. But, the "Lime" brand was established, people recognised it. As we both know, the late former Go North East Managing Director, Peter Huntley who I believe was truly inspirational in the way he turned Go North East around stated that brands should be refreshed every five years, however, refreshing and changing the name are two completely different things. People are far more likely to say "Get the Lime bus" than "Get the Coast and Country bus" because chances are, you'll forget Coast and Country, because it isn't catchy.

indiGO isn't indiGo, that is my first gripe with that brand. It would be more acceptable if it was actually Indigo and not bright pink. Again, it has had a major upgrade which is for the customers benefit, however, again the East Durham brand was established, maybe it could have been spruced up a bit?

Magic Roundabout was quite magic, it looked magnificent if we're honest, and a great piece of marketing by Go North East, because it is something you look at and your immediate reaction is that it looks good. Okay, it maybe didn't incorporate a 'magic' roundabout, but it still worked.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:20 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Don't see how the silver-based Doxford Clipper or the pink-based Pink Angel were similar to the traditionally red-based corporate livery like.

I should of been more clearer when making the post.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:22 pm)Adrian wrote Bits of branding aye, but the majority of them seem to be operationally sound. Give me one of those 2004 Solars any day, over the usual heaps I have to endure through Durham!


Depends how you define pointless doesn't it? If it's increased profit across those services, then it's a job well done.

The Highwayman had a background rather than naming a brand after the color and sticking Arrow after.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:24 pm)Dan wrote I think DanPicken will be referring to the synergy between different brands owing to the 'swoops' on these designs - similar to what Trent Barton does.

I don't think there has to be links between a brand design and a main corporate identity for a brand to be successful, though. According to recent research carried out by Go North East, 81% of the company's customers love their bus brand and 87% think it makes their bus much easier to identity. The survey about brand perception was carried out by researchers, BlueGrass, and also shows that 81% of people still recognise that Go North East runs their bus route, despite the links between a corporate identity and an individual brand design no longer being existent.

5251 (NK56KHX) Consett 15 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

559 (NK53TKY) Sunderland 33 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

Go North East: 0606 NK54NUB Dennis MPD/Alexander by emdjt42, on Flickr

That's what I meant.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:25 pm)LeeCalder wrote The Corporate livery at the time was Red, Yellow and Blue, with the "Swoosh" or "Swoop", which I thought looked brilliant, and suited every vehicle.

Almost every brand in that year or two incorporated the swoosh, which is I think Dan's point.

I think it's hard to find a livery that the swoop didn't suit Dennis Dart MPD/SPD also suited any livery chucked on them.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:40 pm)DanPicken wrote The Highwayman had a background rather than naming a brand after the color and sticking Arrow after.

In fairness, you could say the same thing about the 'Red Arrows' and 'Silver Arrows' brands.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:31 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Didn't even notice the 'swoops' to be honest - just the colour schemes.

I'm willing to bet that most others didn't notice them either, which is why it's no longer common practice!

(16 Jan 2016, 7:36 pm)LeeCalder wrote Granted, the Coast and Country is eye catching, and looks pretty decent. But, the "Lime" brand was established, people recognised it. As we both know, the late former Go North East Managing Director, Peter Huntley who I believe was truly inspirational in the way he turned Go North East around stated that brands should be refreshed every five years, however, refreshing and changing the name are two completely different things. People are far more likely to say "Get the Lime bus" than "Get the Coast and Country bus" because chances are, you'll forget Coast and Country, because it isn't catchy. 

indiGO isn't indiGo, that is my first gripe with that brand. It would be more acceptable if it was actually Indigo and not bright pink. Again, it has had a major upgrade which is for the customers benefit, however, again the East Durham brand was established, maybe it could have been spruced up a bit?

There are instances where it's probably more commercially advantageous to completely change the look and name of a brand, though. You've really got to look at the whole picture, if you're going to be critical of decisions made by people who are a lot more experienced in marketing than you or I!

If the company's old brand identity has a tarnished reputation, it may wish to ditch it completely in favour of something totally new. A new brand identity allows for a clean slate, with brand new buses which are a lot more reliable. This may entice new customers to the route, and encourage growth on this route, which will ultimately provide a return on the new vehicles.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:40 pm)DanPicken wrote The Highwayman had a background rather than naming a brand after the color and sticking Arrow after.

What was the background? The fact that these services used Whickham Highway?

(16 Jan 2016, 7:40 pm)DanPicken wrote The Highwayman had a background rather than naming a brand after the color and sticking Arrow after.

I don't see anybody complaining about the Red Arrows. Yet...

(16 Jan 2016, 7:45 pm)Dan wrote I'm willing to bet that most others didn't notice them either, which is why it's no longer common practice!


There are instances where it's probably more commercially advantageous to completely change the look and name of a brand, though. You've really got to look at the whole picture, if you're going to be critical of decisions made by people who are a lot more experienced in marketing than you or I!

If the company's old brand identity has a tarnished reputation, it may wish to ditch it completely in favour of something totally new. A new brand identity allows for a clean slate, with brand new buses which are a lot more reliable. This may entice new customers to the route, and encourage growth on this route, which will ultimately provide a return on the new vehicles.


What was the background? The fact that these services used Whickham Highway?

It had a back story related to The Highwayman where as Green Arrow only refers to the color.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:45 pm)S813 FVK wrote I don't see anybody complaining about the Red Arrows. Yet...

Because it was an original brand but more and more are popping up the 20 will be the Purple Arrow on the Streetlite's.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:50 pm)DanPicken wrote Because it was an original brand but more and more are popping up the 20 will be the Purple Arrow on the Streetlite's.

Damn....somebody has let the new brand name out.

The Highwayman did actually have a meaning.

I am lead to believe it dates back to a story of robberies in the Lobley Hill area in the late 1800. The people who committed these robberies were known as Highwaymen.

Hence why on one of the old Highwayman timetables, it says "At £2.20, it's a steal"

(16 Jan 2016, 7:50 pm)DanPicken wrote It had a back story related to The Highwayman where as Green Arrow only refers to the color.

What's this back story to which you refer?

The only back story I'm aware of is that the bus served Wickham Highway and there's a pub on-route named The Highwayman. Other than that, zilch. I hope this backstory is interesting and contains real highwaymen fighting pirates and dragons and stuff.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:36 pm)LeeCalder wrote indiGO isn't indiGo, that is my first gripe with that brand. It would be more acceptable if it was actually Indigo and not bright pink. Again, it has had a major upgrade which is for the customers benefit, however, again the East Durham brand was established, maybe it could have been spruced up a bit?

'indiGo' is being used as a play on words, promoting links to a, b and c. Painting it the colour Indigo is a difficult one, given that several buses from the network cross paths with the Prince Bishops, which is relatively the same colour. It's not great to have two brands running on one corridor, with neither standing out from the other.

Trent's 'Rainbow One' branded vehicles aren't painted in colours of the rainbow? Nor is the service number '1'. Disappointingly, I've not seen many teal mangos either.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:54 pm)LeeCalder wrote The Highwayman did actually have a meaning.

I am lead to believe it dates back to a story of robberies in the Lobley Hill area in the late 1800. The people who committed these robberies were known as Highwaymen.

Hence why on one of the old Highwayman timetables, it says "At £2.20, it's a steal"

Pretty sure it's actually got something to do with a public house/restaurant located on the Whickham Highway, called ''The Highwayman'', which the route passes.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:54 pm)LeeCalder wrote The Highwayman did actually have a meaning.

I am lead to believe it dates back to a story of robberies in the Lobley Hill area in the late 1800. The people who committed these robberies were known as Highwaymen.

Hence why on one of the old Highwayman timetables, it says "At £2.20, it's a steal"

Source?

And spates robberies have taken place in Lobley Hill in the interim period. It's not the most salubrious place.

(16 Jan 2016, 7:52 pm)citaro5284 wrote Damn....somebody has let the new brand name out.

Sh*t!