(23 Aug 2016, 12:57 pm)MrFozz wrote Some ideas for the East Durham area linking it with Tyneside and Teesside

New X61
Sunderland-Grangetown-Seaham-Dalton Park-Woods Terrace then same as current 61 to Station Estate

Modified 61
Same as now but from Woods Terrace it would go round Cornwall Estate the opposite way to it's current route to Station Estate

The combined frequency would keep to the current 15 minutes and they would interwork from Station Estate...On a Sunday somehow interwork X61 with the 60 to give Murton a service to Seaham on a Sunday

Modified 265
Only change being would be to modify the route to go back round Cornwall Estate

Modify the timings of the 202 and 265 to give a roughly 20 minute combined w/X61 service between Seaham and Murton

New X8
Sunderland-Grangetown-Ryhope-New Seaham-Dalton Park-Peterlee-Billingham-Middlesbrough

Modified X10
Only change being, it goes to Dalton Park

X8 and X10 would be half hourly at Dalton Park giving Tyneside and Teesside a direct link to said retail park

Modified X36
Sunderland-Grangetown-Ryhope-A19-Dalton-Park-Peterlee-Horden-Blackhall-Hartlepool

X36 would be hourly initially to guage if it would be a success

[b]Modified X1[b]
As it is to Hetton, then split it, send 2 to Dalton Park via the 265 route(excl. East Moor Est.)



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To conclude your suggestion i would have the following suggested.
35. Extended to Heworth.
This will enable service x36 to be withdrawn passengers for newcastle can use the 27 or x9,x10.
New 9A.
Sunderland - Fullwell Grange - Southwick Green - carley hill - witherwack - Downhill - Boldon - Fellgate - Jarrow.
This service will be ran by deptford and withdraws short 9 journeys.
The service will operate every 30 minutes but certain journeys will interwork with scholars services
The service will operate monday to sunday but every hour on sundays.
On Sunday percy main 9 journeys will operate hourly combined with the 9A from jarrow.
This will form a 30 minute service

(23 Aug 2016, 2:16 pm)biglugs@yahoo.com wrote To conclude your suggestion i would have the following suggested.
35. Extended to Heworth.
This will enable service x36 to be withdrawn passengers for newcastle can use the 27 or x9,x10.
New 9A.
Sunderland - Fullwell Grange - Southwick Green - carley hill - witherwack - Downhill - Boldon - Fellgate - Jarrow.
This service will be ran by deptford and withdraws short 9 journeys.
The service will operate every 30 minutes but certain journeys will interwork with scholars services
The service will operate monday to sunday but every hour on sundays.
On Sunday percy main 9 journeys will operate hourly combined with the 9A from jarrow.
This will form a 30 minute service

Short 9s never get many passengers on now. This would definitely work. The short 9s are poinless

Just a thought to compete with Arriva. As I got the 46 the other day and I was shocked at the ticket prices to Crook from Durham.

Service X46 withdrawn

22
Durham - Neville's Cross - Tudhoe - Langley Moor - Meadowfield - New Brancepeth - Willington - Crook - North Bitchburn - Binchester - Bishop Auckland - West Auckland

23
Durham - Tudhoe - Bishop Auckland College - Bishop Auckland - St. Mary's Auckland - West Auckland

24
Durham - Croxdale - Spennymoor - Woodhouse Close - Cockton Hill Road - Bishop Auckland - Canney Hill - Coundon - West Auckland (withdrawing the 18)

Don't know about allocations. Probably every hour making 20 minute frequency between all three.

Might be worth renumbering them to avoid confusion with Arriva services

(23 Aug 2016, 5:56 pm)beefcake wrote Might be worth renumbering them to avoid confusion with Arriva services

Completely forgot actually. Just thought of 3 random numbers.

(23 Aug 2016, 2:16 pm)biglugs@yahoo.com wrote To conclude your suggestion i would have the following suggested.
35. Extended to Heworth.
This will enable service x36 to be withdrawn passengers for newcastle can use the 27 or x9,x10.
New 9A.
Sunderland - Fullwell Grange - Southwick Green - carley hill - witherwack - Downhill - Boldon - Fellgate - Jarrow.
This service will be ran by deptford and withdraws short 9 journeys.
The service will operate every 30 minutes but certain journeys will interwork with scholars services
The service will operate monday to sunday but every hour on sundays.
On Sunday percy main 9 journeys will operate hourly combined with the 9A from jarrow.
This will form a 30 minute service

Doesn't conclude my suggestion, I never gave that a thought, but there you go, who knew

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Was just thinking of this. If an extension on the Coaster between Whitley Bay and Blyth existed before today, it would made a fortune this weekend with the tall ships! Would've picked up a tonne of passengers particularly between Wallsend and Whitley Bay.

(26 Aug 2016, 12:30 pm)L469 YVK wrote Was just thinking of this. If an extension on the Coaster between Whitley Bay and Blyth existed before today, it would made a fortune this weekend with the tall ships! Would've picked up a tonne of passengers particularly between Wallsend and Whitley Bay.

The one that springs to mind is the old 310 which ran Blyth-Sunderland im guessing it would of called at whitley bay

Run some late night stanley express routes.
For example, 31 which does the northern part of the 6 then forks at sunniside to go up east stanley.
Then a service 70, which does the northern part of the X70 then through the southern part of the 6, until it meets the A693, then up to leadgate and Consett. Variations on the night 6s to provide more locations for where absolutely no late evening connection exists. I was talking to an old guy who has to walk from Stanley bus station to East stanley at night, which is quite a walk in a rougher area. The consett link would also be serving the same areas as the 6 does for the majority but also providing a link to Consett from Gateshead which may be popular from what I've heard.

I have decided to do another lot of bulk service suggestions:

Red Arrows and Tyne Tees Express: 13 new streetdecks would come for TTX services X9/X10 (including one red spare for Peterlee) to Riverside/Peterlee allowinng for dual depot operation and a combined every 15 minute frequency. NEW RED ARROWS services would mean that the X1 would be dropped to be every 20 minutes with new X2 also running every 20 minutes terminating at Murton. 
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
6043-6048 move to Washington and gain 6001-6006s NSAs
All Red Arrows deckers (except 6001-6006) would gain sockets
3943, 6001 and 6002 would replace 3818, 3819 and 3824 at Riverside
6003-6006 would replace 3814, 3822, 3830 and 3831 at Stanley.
6007 would be a branded spare

Blaydon Racers, service 64 and LOOP: 15 streetlites would come for services 49/49A/NEW 49B (including two red spares with tachographs for the X9/X10.) The NEW 49B would be exactly the same as the current 49C thus replacing the current 64. New 95 would run the current 95 route then onto Wardley via the 93/94 route past Saltmeadows then the 57 to Wardley with a PVR of 3 atking 41 minutes to do the route.
This would allow for the following allocation plans:
5275-5283 would be branded LOOP (5275 would be a red spare) 
5331 would replace 5167.
5219-5221 would be painted red for use on new service 95
5222 and 5223 would replace 4896 and 5170 at Stanley
5224-5226 would replace 4897-4899.

Wagonway, new 59, InDiGo East Durham, Lambton Worm P1 and 265: 13 streetlites would come for Wagonway 28/28A services (including one red spare) allowing the 28 to replace the 34 to Waldridge Park and the 28A to replace the 34A to Waldridge. The 59 would run 7 days a week with a PVR of 2 allowing it to run hourly. The 265 would leave the InDiGo brand and be every 30 minutes.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
4956-4960 would move to Peterlee with them gaining tachographs allowing them to operate the X9/X10 on windy days.
665 and 666 would be swapped for 631 and 632.
The other services that interwork with the 265 would be standalone services.

18, InDiGo North Tyne and InDiGo Washington (movements and 85/86): 31 Solos would come for the InDiGo North Tyne (including three red spares) allowing it to expand. The InDiGo North Tyne would get some new routes added comprising of: (Red Kite Routes would be renumbered 62/63/64)
40/41 Current route as of 24/7/16 PVR 8 (All journies would operate a full loop)
42 Current route as of 24/7/16 except all journies would extend to Cramlington. PVR 8
NEW 43 would run North Shields Town Centre Rudyerd Street-Percy Park Road-Tynemouth Seafront-Grand Parade-Cullercoats-Whitley Bay Metro-Whitley Bay Town Centre-Monkseaton Metro-North Tyneside Hospital-New York-Chirton Industrial Estate-Verne Road-North Shields Town Centre Rudyerd Street, the 44 would run in reverse (PVR 5-Interworking)
NEW 45 would run North Shields Town Centre Rudyerd Street-Verne Road-Chirton Industrial Estate-Coast Road to Billy Mill-Queen Alexandra Road-Trevor Terrace-Linskill Terrace-King Edward Road- ANE 306 route to Whitley Bay Town Centre- ANE 54 route to North Tyneside Hospital-Murton Village-Silver Fox Way East-Silver Fox Way-Northumberland Park Metro-Holystone-Benton ASDA-Forest Hall-Great Lime Road-West Lane to Killingworth Village-B1317-Simonside Way-East Bailey-West Bailey-Killingworth Bus Station (PVR 6-Every 30 minutes)
NEW 46 Jarrow Bus Station-Percy Main Metro-High Howdon-Howdon-Jarrow Bus Station PVR 1.
The 554 would run throughout the day half hourly.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
625 and 627 would run the 554 throughout the day.
665 and 666 would be used on the 33 replacing 547 and 557.
672 would replace 554 on the Byker ASDA bus
673 would replace 556 on the 13.
674 and 675 would replace 549 and 559.
676-680 would replace 570 and 603-606 on the 85/86 to allow it to join InDiGo Washington.
603 would replace 550 at Peterlee.
604 would replace 560 at Deptford.
The 18 would lose the OK Way brand and 605 and 606 would replace 571 and 572.
8261-8265 would be withdrawn.


Angel, Crusader, WTX and NEW Airport bus 737: 21 streetdecks (including two red spares) without tables for use on the ANGEL 21. This would allow for an every 12 minute full route frequency and an every 6 minute frequency Newcastle-Chester-le-Street. New airport service 737 would run every 15 minutes Newcastle Airport-Eldon Square rivalling the metro. The WTX would become half-hourly. The X7 would be renumbered X8.

This allow for the following allocation plans:
6057-6070 would transfer to Riverside for use on the Crusader 27 with 6057 being a red spare.
6056 would transfer to Stanley for replacing 3864.
3962 would stay at Chester-le-Street for replacing 3872.
3965 would replace 6009 at Stanley.
5328-5330 would be branded WTX and would transfer to Deptford for use on service X8 allowing for an every 30 minute frequency and dual depot operation, 5336 would also be given a tachograph.
5310-5314 would be branded for new airport service 737. 5310 would be a branded spare.
5315 and 5316 would replace 4900 and 4901.
5317 would replace 4902.
5318 would replace 4907.
5332 would replace 4918.

SimpliCity 2/2A/39/NEW 2B, Lambton Worm P2 (Urpeth Grange will be explained further down the post), South Tyne, Green Arrow, NEW 95 and Blue Arrow: 28 streetlites (including three red spares) would come for Deptford for SimpliCity services 2/2A/2B/39, the new 2B would run Washington-Biddick-Barmston-A1231-A19-Hylton Road-Kayll Road (Sunderland Royal Hospital)-A183-A690-Park Lane-then the current 61 to Murton taking 52 minutes. 10 streetlites (including one red spare) for Riverside for the 88/88A. 5 optare solos would come for Lambton Worm 34/34A (including one red spare). 

This would allow for the following allocation changes:

8320-8327 would be branded Blue Arrow for the 11/11A/11X for Percy Main, 8319 would be a red spare

8297-8309 would transfer to Riverside for Green Arrow 97/97A/X97 (8297 would be a red spare), the X97 would run throughout the day.

8294-8296 would transfer for the 238 at Deptford.

4969 and 4976 would transfer to Riverside for replacing 4919 and 4920.

4990 and 4991 would replace 4922 and 4923.

4992 would be tachographed and would move to Peterlee as a single deck X9/X10 spare.

5212 and 5213 would be part of Washington's spare fleet.

4938, 4940, 4941 and 4944 would be withdrawn.

5227 and 5228 would withdraw 4928 and 4929  at Chester-le-Street

4967 and 5218 would withdraw 4930 and 4931.

4948 and 4947 would withdraw 4932 and 4933.

4968, 4970-4975 and 5203 would be used on the 9 allowing it to be every 15 minutes full route.

3978-3980 would replace 3878 and 3876 with one being a float vehicle.
5248, 5249 and 5273 and 5274 would be mentioned below:

See it Do It, TOONLINK X84/X85, Cobalt Connect and NEW 12B: 19 streetlites would come for See It Do It services at Deptford (including two red spares.)

This would allow for the 36 to be extended to Urpeth Grange replacing the 34/34A. A new service 19/19A would run at Percy Main with the current long 19s staying hourly while new service 19A would run the current route to Manor Walks and then would follow the Arriva 43 to Morpeth taking just under 90 mins. NEW 12B would run the 12 route Newcastle-Blaydon-49 route to Winlaton-Winlaton Mil, via Barlow Lane, Knobbyends Lane, West Lane, Coldstream Drive, Scotland Head, Mill Lane-A694-Sherburn Towers Estate. 12/12A would lave the TOON Link brand and the X84/X85 would join. The X46 would run throughout the day half-hourly using citaros under the Castles Express brand name to rival the Arriva 46, plus making it connect with the X21 at Durham allowing connections to Newcastle.

This would allow for the following changes:

5298-5308 would transfer to Percy Main for Cobalt Connect 19/19A (5298 would be a red spare)

4978-4981 will replace 4912 and 4915-4917.

4982 would be tachographed and sent to Peterlee.

5326 and 5327 would be used on the X46..

5309 and 5325 would replace 4926 and 4927 at Chester-le-Street

4949, 4964 and 4966 would be used on the 12B

5234-5238 and 5248 and 5249 + 5273 and 5274 would be used on the X84/X85 allowing 4 buses per hour, 5234 would be a red spare.
5229-5233 would be used on the 12/12A.

Coaster and TOON Link: 36 new streetlites (including four red spares) would come for Percy Main to allow an upgrade of Coaster 1/1A/NEW 1B. 1 would run half hourly and would be extended to Washington Galleries via the X1 route but not running limited stop taking an extra 15 minutes. 1A would be half hourly full route everyday. NEW 1B would run Blackhall Mill-Whitley Bay following the 1/1A Gateshead-Whitley Bay then Askew Road until Teams where it would run through Teams until the Metrocentre, then it would follow the 10As route to Blackhall Mill, the services would be every 10 minutes combined Gateshead-Whitley Bay. New X27 would be an express Newcastle Haymarket-South Shields taking 27 minutes rivalling the metro. It would be operated by Percy Main and would serve only the following stops; Haymarket-St Mary's Place-Civic Centre-Cradlewell-Battle Hill Shops (308 stop)-Jarrow Bus Station-Chichester Metro-South Shields Town Hall-South Shields Metro. The X32 would run all day half-hourly and new X33 would be the same-8bph Newcastle-Stanley using Toon Link. It would use the following route taking 45 minutes:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Eldon+...Stand+J+(W
Bound),+Newcastle+upon+Tyne/Stanley+Bus+Station,+A693,+Stanley+DH9+0HU/@54.9395664,-1.6511116,10598m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m39!4m38!1m30!1m1!1s0x487e70cbcea578ed:0x24a1f73e55a8f789!2m2!1d-1.614818!2d54.975742!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6041959!2d54.9620242!3s0x487e70bab3c5a3e3:0x9ea0dabb5a89603e!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6103025!2d54.9586177!3s0x487e70afab47292b:0xbac25a503bec626d!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6207573!2d54.9356034!3s0x487e79f659c25845:0x6c23ed53e5327f48!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6230282!2d54.9045756!3s0x487e7978cc1c436b:0x14b1935811998e28!3m4!1m2!1d-1.673837!2d54.9127643!3s0x487e78531c611427:0x9a221ce5041261de!1m5!1m1!1s0x487e78b653d1bd93:0xd4c93f5ef4ea3745!2m2!1d-1.6986683!2d54.8691987!3e0.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
5261-5268 would transfer to Stanley for TOON Link with 5261 being a red spare.
5251, 5252 and 5269-5272 would be branded TOON Link X27 running Newcastle Haymarket-Cradlewell-Jarrow Bus Station-South Shields taking 27 minutes rivalling the metro. 

Whey Aye Five Oh and Blyth TOON Link: 22 streetlites (including two red spares) would come for Washington/Chester-le-Street for the 50/50A allowing it to be every 20 minutes and operated by two separate depots and to be extended to Bishop Auckland from Durham to rival Arriva. This would allow for some new Toon Link routes to be created running Blyth-Newcastle, the X86 which would run Haymarket-South Gosforth Roundabout-Balliol Bus Link-Quorum-A189-Annitsford-Cramlington High Pit-Cramlington Manor Walks-Cramlington Eastfield-New Delaval-Newsham-Plessey Road-B1327-Blyth Bus Station, running every 15 minutes taking just under 45 minutes.The NEW X87 would run Haymarket-Gosforth High Street-Regent Centre-Brunton Park-Brunton Lane-A1-A19-Dudley Lane-Cramlington Manor Walks-Cramlington Eastfield-New Delaval-Newsham-Plessey Road-B1327-Blyth Bus Station, running every 15 minutes taking just 39 minutes.

This would allow for the following allocation plans: 

5243-5247 would move to Riverside

5254 now surplus at Stanley would move to Riverside as X86/X87 spare
5255-5260 would transfer to Riverside.

TEN, DFDS, 6136-6139, Red Kite and Venture: 18 streetdecks would come to Hexham/Riverside for the TEN (including two red spares.) Service 47 would be extended to Consett following the rote of the V9 thus withdrawing this service and the 45E. Services X84/X85 would have an upgraded frequency and passengers who previously used the 686 Wylam-Ovington could use the TOON Link X84, the 686 would only run Prudhoe-Albemarle Barracks throughout the day. Services V7/V8 would leave the venture brand and would be allocated double deckers. This would allow for the following allocation changes:

6071 and 6072 would transfer to Stanley for the upgraded 47.

6073-6077 would transfer to Percy Main for the DFDS bus.

6083 would also transfer to Percy Main but for the 434/448

6082 would remove 6023.

6078-6080 would transfer to Stanley for the V7/V8.

6081 would replace 6008 at Percy Main.

3941 and 3942 would replace 6010 and 6015 at Percy Main.

3866 and 3867 would be withdrawn.

3888 would replace 6025.

3889 and 3890 would replace 6009 and 6012 at Stanley.
641 and 642 would move to Hexham for the new 686.
643 would replace 556 at Hexham.
644 would be Venture spare.

Cobalt Clipper, NEW TWX, Fast Cats and Northern: 21 Streetdecks (including two red spare) would come for Cobalt Clipper 309/310 allowing the 310 to be extended to Tynemouth via the 306 route and then it would head straight up to Whitley Bay via the Grand Parade, Beverley Terrace, Victoria Crescent, Windsor Crescent, Rockliffe Gardens, The Promenade and The Links turning at the 1 terminus. NEW Tyne Wear Express would be number X34 and would run Newcastle Eldon Square-Gateshead-A184-Heworth-A184-A19-A1231-Southwick-Deptford Bus Depot-Sunderland-Park Lane taking 48 minutes. Current X36 would be renumbered 36A and would only run as far as Downhill. 5204-5209 and 5211 would be replaced by 8 new streetlites including one red spare.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
6101-6107 would be branded TWX with 6101 being red.
6108-6117 would be branded Northern.
5204-5209 and 5211 would find reserve roles as would 6122-6133.

Thank you for reading, I appreciate not everything is immediately possible but will make sense in the long run.

(07 Sep 2016, 7:48 pm)NK53 TKT wrote I have decided to do another lot of bulk service suggestions:

Red Arrows and Tyne Tees Express: 13 new streetdecks would come for TTX services X9/X10 (including one red spare for Peterlee) to Riverside/Peterlee allowinng for dual depot operation and a combined every 15 minute frequency. NEW RED ARROWS services would mean that the X1 would be dropped to be every 20 minutes with new X2 also running every 20 minutes terminating at Murton. 
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
6043-6048 move to Washington and gain 6001-6006s NSAs
All Red Arrows deckers (except 6001-6006) would gain sockets
3943, 6001 and 6002 would replace 3818, 3819 and 3824 at Riverside
6003-6006 would replace 3814, 3822, 3830 and 3831 at Stanley.
6007 would be a branded spare

Blaydon Racers, service 64 and LOOP: 15 streetlites would come for services 49/49A/NEW 49B (including two red spares with tachographs for the X9/X10.) The NEW 49B would be exactly the same as the current 49C thus replacing the current 64. New 95 would run the current 95 route then onto Wardley via the 93/94 route past Saltmeadows then the 57 to Wardley with a PVR of 3 atking 41 minutes to do the route.
This would allow for the following allocation plans:
5275-5283 would be branded LOOP (5275 would be a red spare) 
5331 would replace 5167.
5219-5221 would be painted red for use on new service 95
5222 and 5223 would replace 4896 and 5170 at Stanley
5224-5226 would replace 4897-4899.

Wagonway, new 59, InDiGo East Durham, Lambton Worm P1 and 265: 13 streetlites would come for Wagonway 28/28A services (including one red spare) allowing the 28 to replace the 34 to Waldridge Park and the 28A to replace the 34A to Waldridge. The 59 would run 7 days a week with a PVR of 2 allowing it to run hourly. The 265 would leave the InDiGo brand and be every 30 minutes.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
4956-4960 would move to Peterlee with them gaining tachographs allowing them to operate the X9/X10 on windy days.
665 and 666 would be swapped for 631 and 632.
The other services that interwork with the 265 would be standalone services.

18, InDiGo North Tyne and InDiGo Washington (movements and 85/86): 31 Solos would come for the InDiGo North Tyne (including three red spares) allowing it to expand. The InDiGo North Tyne would get some new routes added comprising of: (Red Kite Routes would be renumbered 62/63/64)
40/41 Current route as of 24/7/16 PVR 8 (All journies would operate a full loop)
42 Current route as of 24/7/16 except all journies would extend to Cramlington. PVR 8
NEW 43 would run North Shields Town Centre Rudyerd Street-Percy Park Road-Tynemouth Seafront-Grand Parade-Cullercoats-Whitley Bay Metro-Whitley Bay Town Centre-Monkseaton Metro-North Tyneside Hospital-New York-Chirton Industrial Estate-Verne Road-North Shields Town Centre Rudyerd Street, the 44 would run in reverse (PVR 5-Interworking)
NEW 45 would run North Shields Town Centre Rudyerd Street-Verne Road-Chirton Industrial Estate-Coast Road to Billy Mill-Queen Alexandra Road-Trevor Terrace-Linskill Terrace-King Edward Road- ANE 306 route to Whitley Bay Town Centre- ANE 54 route to North Tyneside Hospital-Murton Village-Silver Fox Way East-Silver Fox Way-Northumberland Park Metro-Holystone-Benton ASDA-Forest Hall-Great Lime Road-West Lane to Killingworth Village-B1317-Simonside Way-East Bailey-West Bailey-Killingworth Bus Station (PVR 6-Every 30 minutes)
NEW 46 Jarrow Bus Station-Percy Main Metro-High Howdon-Howdon-Jarrow Bus Station PVR 1.
The 554 would run throughout the day half hourly.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
625 and 627 would run the 554 throughout the day.
665 and 666 would be used on the 33 replacing 547 and 557.
672 would replace 554 on the Byker ASDA bus
673 would replace 556 on the 13.
674 and 675 would replace 549 and 559.
676-680 would replace 570 and 603-606 on the 85/86 to allow it to join InDiGo Washington.
603 would replace 550 at Peterlee.
604 would replace 560 at Deptford.
The 18 would lose the OK Way brand and 605 and 606 would replace 571 and 572.
8261-8265 would be withdrawn.


Angel, Crusader, WTX and NEW Airport bus 737: 21 streetdecks (including two red spares) without tables for use on the ANGEL 21. This would allow for an every 12 minute full route frequency and an every 6 minute frequency Newcastle-Chester-le-Street. New airport service 737 would run every 15 minutes Newcastle Airport-Eldon Square rivalling the metro. The WTX would become half-hourly. The X7 would be renumbered X8.

This allow for the following allocation plans:
6057-6070 would transfer to Riverside for use on the Crusader 27 with 6057 being a red spare.
6056 would transfer to Stanley for replacing 3864.
3962 would stay at Chester-le-Street for replacing 3872.
3965 would replace 6009 at Stanley.
5328-5330 would be branded WTX and would transfer to Deptford for use on service X8 allowing for an every 30 minute frequency and dual depot operation, 5336 would also be given a tachograph.
5310-5314 would be branded for new airport service 737. 5310 would be a branded spare.
5315 and 5316 would replace 4900 and 4901.
5317 would replace 4902.
5318 would replace 4907.
5332 would replace 4918.

SimpliCity 2/2A/39/NEW 2B, Lambton Worm P2 (Urpeth Grange will be explained further down the post), South Tyne, Green Arrow, NEW 95 and Blue Arrow: 28 streetlites (including three red spares) would come for Deptford for SimpliCity services 2/2A/2B/39, the new 2B would run Washington-Biddick-Barmston-A1231-A19-Hylton Road-Kayll Road (Sunderland Royal Hospital)-A183-A690-Park Lane-then the current 61 to Murton taking 52 minutes. 10 streetlites (including one red spare) for Riverside for the 88/88A. 5 optare solos would come for Lambton Worm 34/34A (including one red spare). 

This would allow for the following allocation changes:

8320-8327 would be branded Blue Arrow for the 11/11A/11X for Percy Main, 8319 would be a red spare

8297-8309 would transfer to Riverside for Green Arrow 97/97A/X97 (8297 would be a red spare), the X97 would run throughout the day.

8294-8296 would transfer for the 238 at Deptford.

4969 and 4976 would transfer to Riverside for replacing 4919 and 4920.

4990 and 4991 would replace 4922 and 4923.

4992 would be tachographed and would move to Peterlee as a single deck X9/X10 spare.

5212 and 5213 would be part of Washington's spare fleet.

4938, 4940, 4941 and 4944 would be withdrawn.

5227 and 5228 would withdraw 4928 and 4929  at Chester-le-Street

4967 and 5218 would withdraw 4930 and 4931.

4948 and 4947 would withdraw 4932 and 4933.

4968, 4970-4975 and 5203 would be used on the 9 allowing it to be every 15 minutes full route.

3978-3980 would replace 3878 and 3876 with one being a float vehicle.
5248, 5249 and 5273 and 5274 would be mentioned below:

See it Do It, TOONLINK X84/X85, Cobalt Connect and NEW 12B: 19 streetlites would come for See It Do It services at Deptford (including two red spares.)

This would allow for the 36 to be extended to Urpeth Grange replacing the 34/34A. A new service 19/19A would run at Percy Main with the current long 19s staying hourly while new service 19A would run the current route to Manor Walks and then would follow the Arriva 43 to Morpeth taking just under 90 mins. NEW 12B would run the 12 route Newcastle-Blaydon-49 route to Winlaton-Winlaton Mil, via Barlow Lane, Knobbyends Lane, West Lane, Coldstream Drive, Scotland Head, Mill Lane-A694-Sherburn Towers Estate. 12/12A would lave the TOON Link brand and the X84/X85 would join. The X46 would run throughout the day half-hourly using citaros under the Castles Express brand name to rival the Arriva 46, plus making it connect with the X21 at Durham allowing connections to Newcastle.

This would allow for the following changes:

5298-5308 would transfer to Percy Main for Cobalt Connect 19/19A (5298 would be a red spare)

4978-4981 will replace 4912 and 4915-4917.

4982 would be tachographed and sent to Peterlee.

5326 and 5327 would be used on the X46..

5309 and 5325 would replace 4926 and 4927 at Chester-le-Street

4949, 4964 and 4966 would be used on the 12B

5234-5238 and 5248 and 5249 + 5273 and 5274 would be used on the X84/X85 allowing 4 buses per hour, 5234 would be a red spare.
5229-5233 would be used on the 12/12A.

Coaster and TOON Link: 36 new streetlites (including four red spares) would come for Percy Main to allow an upgrade of Coaster 1/1A/NEW 1B. 1 would run half hourly and would be extended to Washington Galleries via the X1 route but not running limited stop taking an extra 15 minutes. 1A would be half hourly full route everyday. NEW 1B would run Blackhall Mill-Whitley Bay following the 1/1A Gateshead-Whitley Bay then Askew Road until Teams where it would run through Teams until the Metrocentre, then it would follow the 10As route to Blackhall Mill, the services would be every 10 minutes combined Gateshead-Whitley Bay. New X27 would be an express Newcastle Haymarket-South Shields taking 27 minutes rivalling the metro. It would be operated by Percy Main and would serve only the following stops; Haymarket-St Mary's Place-Civic Centre-Cradlewell-Battle Hill Shops (308 stop)-Jarrow Bus Station-Chichester Metro-South Shields Town Hall-South Shields Metro. The X32 would run all day half-hourly and new X33 would be the same-8bph Newcastle-Stanley using Toon Link. It would use the following route taking 45 minutes:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Eldon+...Stand+J+(W
Bound),+Newcastle+upon+Tyne/Stanley+Bus+Station,+A693,+Stanley+DH9+0HU/@54.9395664,-1.6511116,10598m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m39!4m38!1m30!1m1!1s0x487e70cbcea578ed:0x24a1f73e55a8f789!2m2!1d-1.614818!2d54.975742!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6041959!2d54.9620242!3s0x487e70bab3c5a3e3:0x9ea0dabb5a89603e!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6103025!2d54.9586177!3s0x487e70afab47292b:0xbac25a503bec626d!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6207573!2d54.9356034!3s0x487e79f659c25845:0x6c23ed53e5327f48!3m4!1m2!1d-1.6230282!2d54.9045756!3s0x487e7978cc1c436b:0x14b1935811998e28!3m4!1m2!1d-1.673837!2d54.9127643!3s0x487e78531c611427:0x9a221ce5041261de!1m5!1m1!1s0x487e78b653d1bd93:0xd4c93f5ef4ea3745!2m2!1d-1.6986683!2d54.8691987!3e0.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
5261-5268 would transfer to Stanley for TOON Link with 5261 being a red spare.
5251, 5252 and 5269-5272 would be branded TOON Link X27 running Newcastle Haymarket-Cradlewell-Jarrow Bus Station-South Shields taking 27 minutes rivalling the metro. 

Whey Aye Five Oh and Blyth TOON Link: 22 streetlites (including two red spares) would come for Washington/Chester-le-Street for the 50/50A allowing it to be every 20 minutes and operated by two separate depots and to be extended to Bishop Auckland from Durham to rival Arriva. This would allow for some new Toon Link routes to be created running Blyth-Newcastle, the X86 which would run Haymarket-South Gosforth Roundabout-Balliol Bus Link-Quorum-A189-Annitsford-Cramlington High Pit-Cramlington Manor Walks-Cramlington Eastfield-New Delaval-Newsham-Plessey Road-B1327-Blyth Bus Station, running every 15 minutes taking just under 45 minutes.The NEW X87 would run Haymarket-Gosforth High Street-Regent Centre-Brunton Park-Brunton Lane-A1-A19-Dudley Lane-Cramlington Manor Walks-Cramlington Eastfield-New Delaval-Newsham-Plessey Road-B1327-Blyth Bus Station, running every 15 minutes taking just 39 minutes.

This would allow for the following allocation plans: 

5243-5247 would move to Riverside

5254 now surplus at Stanley would move to Riverside as X86/X87 spare
5255-5260 would transfer to Riverside.

TEN, DFDS, 6136-6139, Red Kite and Venture: 18 streetdecks would come to Hexham/Riverside for the TEN (including two red spares.) Service 47 would be extended to Consett following the rote of the V9 thus withdrawing this service and the 45E. Services X84/X85 would have an upgraded frequency and passengers who previously used the 686 Wylam-Ovington could use the TOON Link X84, the 686 would only run Prudhoe-Albemarle Barracks throughout the day. Services V7/V8 would leave the venture brand and would be allocated double deckers. This would allow for the following allocation changes:

6071 and 6072 would transfer to Stanley for the upgraded 47.

6073-6077 would transfer to Percy Main for the DFDS bus.

6083 would also transfer to Percy Main but for the 434/448

6082 would remove 6023.

6078-6080 would transfer to Stanley for the V7/V8.

6081 would replace 6008 at Percy Main.

3941 and 3942 would replace 6010 and 6015 at Percy Main.

3866 and 3867 would be withdrawn.

3888 would replace 6025.

3889 and 3890 would replace 6009 and 6012 at Stanley.
641 and 642 would move to Hexham for the new 686.
643 would replace 556 at Hexham.
644 would be Venture spare.

Cobalt Clipper, NEW TWX, Fast Cats and Northern: 21 Streetdecks (including two red spare) would come for Cobalt Clipper 309/310 allowing the 310 to be extended to Tynemouth via the 306 route and then it would head straight up to Whitley Bay via the Grand Parade, Beverley Terrace, Victoria Crescent, Windsor Crescent, Rockliffe Gardens, The Promenade and The Links turning at the 1 terminus. NEW Tyne Wear Express would be number X34 and would run Newcastle Eldon Square-Gateshead-A184-Heworth-A184-A19-A1231-Southwick-Deptford Bus Depot-Sunderland-Park Lane taking 48 minutes. Current X36 would be renumbered 36A and would only run as far as Downhill. 5204-5209 and 5211 would be replaced by 8 new streetlites including one red spare.
This would allow for the following allocation changes:
6101-6107 would be branded TWX with 6101 being red.
6108-6117 would be branded Northern.
5204-5209 and 5211 would find reserve roles as would 6122-6133.

Thank you for reading, I appreciate not everything is immediately possible but will make sense in the long run.

I really recommend you split this into bold/underlined titles and subsections, it's quite a lot to digest!
Either way, I doubt you could ever rival the metro with bus. The metro only has to stop when other metros are on the single line section where it forks. It stops for about 10 seconds at each stop and it can hit speeds most of Stanley's deckers could only dream of. My point is that the metro will be cheaper, more chance of a seat and reliably quicker.

(11 Sep 2016, 9:42 am)Jamie M wrote I really recommend you split this into bold/underlined titles and subsections, it's quite a lot to digest!
Either way, I doubt you could ever rival the metro with bus. The metro only has to stop when other metros are on the single line section where it forks. It stops for about 10 seconds at each stop and it can hit speeds most of Stanley's deckers could only dream of. My point is that the metro will be cheaper, more chance of a seat and reliably quicker.

I agree,the only time a bus really has a chance to compete is when the metro is delayed and/or suspended then with metro expecting to get new stock in the 2020's then these delays that have been occurring with hopefully be at a minimum,i actually genuinely fear for the bus,because of all the proposed expansions the metro have

It has been said repeatedly, that links from Washington to Team Valley are poor. Apart from secured/contracted services early doors and after work, there is a minimum of two services that need to be taken (assuming a passenger lives in walking distance from the Galleries).

So...

Concord - Galleries - Springwell - Harlow Green/Allerdene - Kingsway - Lobley Hill Road/Bensham Bank - Cuthbert St - Teams and then the common route to Metrocentre.

As well as improving links to TVTE from Washington, it will create links from parts of Gateshead that are without a direct connection to TVTE, despite them being relatively close together. 
By extending the service to the Metrocentre, the service will have 'through' passengers to supplement margins in addition to any passengers using it to/from TVTE only.

84 - Barley Mow Estate - Rickleton - Harraton - Ayton - Lambton - Washington Galleries - Sainsbury's Car Park - Glebe - Washington Village - Barmston - Peel Retail Park - Washington Comprehensive School - Concord

Operating Every 30 Minutes Monday to Saturday, Hourly on a Sunday.

Coming into Barley Mow Estate from Washington the 84 will come off of Vigo Lane and turn left onto Durham Place/Cheshire Avenue and along to Norfolk Avenue, it will turn left at Surrey Terrace and then right looping around Dorset Avenue onto Pembroke Drive, it will go up Renfrew Place to Windemere and along Eskdale and down Bedford Avenue to exit back onto Vigo Lane to head back towards Washington.

(12 Sep 2016, 8:02 pm)Andreos1 wrote It has been said repeatedly, that links from Washington to Team Valley are poor. Apart from secured/contracted services early doors and after work, there is a minimum of two services that need to be taken (assuming a passenger lives in walking distance from the Galleries).

So...

Concord - Galleries - Springwell - Harlow Green/Allerdene - Kingsway - Lobley Hill Road/Bensham Bank - Cuthbert St - Teams and then the common route to Metrocentre.

As well as improving links to TVTE from Washington, it will create links from parts of Gateshead that are without a direct connection to TVTE, despite them being relatively close together. 
By extending the service to the Metrocentre, the service will have 'through' passengers to supplement margins in addition to any passengers using it to/from TVTE only.

I'm unsure if that'd work. We previously had the 183, which was arguably quicker than the route you've described to the Metrocentre, and that was withdrawn due to low usage.

Harlow Green/Allerdene is an interesting one. Parts of it are, I'd say, in reasonable walking distance of the Loop. That will get you to/from Team Valley, and you've also got the Coaster and Angel connections too. Parts of it are perhaps not, but a more likely solution would be to adjust the Loop route.

Looking at reasonable routes on a map, I really don't think there is one that will work from Washington, which is probably why it doesn't exist. Your best bet would probably be routing the Red Arrows away from Old Durham Road, but that would not go down well with existing customers, due to increased journey times.

(12 Sep 2016, 9:08 pm)Adrian wrote I'm unsure if that'd work. We previously had the 183, which was arguably quicker than the route you've described to the Metrocentre, and that was withdrawn due to low usage.

Harlow Green/Allerdene is an interesting one. Parts of it are, I'd say, in reasonable walking distance of the Loop. That will get you to/from Team Valley, and you've also got the Coaster and Angel connections too. Parts of it are perhaps not, but a more likely solution would be to adjust the Loop route.

Looking at reasonable routes on a map, I really don't think there is one that will work from Washington, which is probably why it doesn't exist. Your best bet would probably be routing the Red Arrows away from Old Durham Road, but that would not go down well with existing customers, due to increased journey times.

Looking at Andreos1's idea, you could extend the 85/86 from Concord via Springwell and Harlow Green to Team Valley & MetroCentre.

How about merging Saltwell Park 53/54 with the loop 93/94. Could become one joint route or keep separate but mix them in a little

(12 Sep 2016, 9:08 pm)Adrian wrote I'm unsure if that'd work. We previously had the 183, which was arguably quicker than the route you've described to the Metrocentre, and that was withdrawn due to low usage.

Harlow Green/Allerdene is an interesting one. Parts of it are, I'd say, in reasonable walking distance of the Loop. That will get you to/from Team Valley, and you've also got the Coaster and Angel connections too. Parts of it are perhaps not, but a more likely solution would be to adjust the Loop route.

Looking at reasonable routes on a map, I really don't think there is one that will work from Washington, which is probably why it doesn't exist. Your best bet would probably be routing the Red Arrows away from Old Durham Road, but that would not go down well with existing customers, due to increased journey times.

I think part of the problem with the 183, was that it was perceived to be a long route. I don't think it's frequency helped either. Nor that it went in the wrong direction out of the Galleries.

Initially, it didnt take much longer than a 194, Metro and X66 did from the Galleries (which depending on connections, was about the same duration as the express services between the Galleries and Gateshead at the time). Obviously the revisions and tweaks it had over the years added to its duration slightly. 
From being an express between the Galleries and Vigo Bridge (A182/A195), it then ended up going via Lambton/Ayton. At one point I think it went via Wear and Harraton/Rickleton.

I think the same problem emerged in Birtley.
Passengers in Birtley had a frequent service to Gateshead and could easily change buses there. 45 mins roughly from Birtley - Metrocentre was similar to getting a bus along the Durham Road and then the X66.

You could argue the same perception applies between the Galleries and Tyneside now. The majority seem to prefer the X1, despite a 4 and Metro being a similar journey time.

2. Metro centre - Teams - Gateshead interchange - Wrekenton - springwell - Washington - Lambton - fatfield - Barnwell - Penshaw monument - Broadway - royal hospital - sunderland interchange.
This service will operate every 30 minutes and will replace the current 2,2a.
The service will serve both the Barnwell and lambton.
The service will allow service 64 to be withdrawn in teams.
2A. Evening's and Sundays only.
Silksworth - hollycarside - Grangetown - sunderland - royal hospital - Broadway - Penshaw - Barnwell - fatfield - lampton - Washington.
Normal as now but Sundays and evening only.
38. Silksworth - Tunstall Bank - esdale estate - hollycarside - leech mere asda - ashbrooke - sunderland interchange.
This service will operate every 30 minutes and extends to Silksworth to replace service 2.
38A. Tunstall bank - hollycarside - Grangetown - sunderland.
Every 20 minutes replacing the 2,2a

(13 Sep 2016, 6:17 pm)biglugs@yahoo.com wrote 2. Metro centre - Teams - Gateshead interchange - Wrekenton - springwell - Washington - Lambton - fatfield - Barnwell - Penshaw monument - Broadway - royal hospital - sunderland interchange.
This service will operate every 30 minutes and will replace the current 2,2a.
The service will serve both the Barnwell and lambton.
The service will allow service 64 to be withdrawn in teams.
2A. Evening's and Sundays only.
Silksworth - hollycarside - Grangetown - sunderland - royal hospital - Broadway - Penshaw - Barnwell - fatfield - lampton - Washington.
Normal as now but Sundays and evening only.
38. Silksworth - Tunstall Bank - esdale estate - hollycarside - leech mere asda - ashbrooke - sunderland interchange.
This service will operate every 30 minutes and extends to Silksworth to replace service 2.
38A. Tunstall bank - hollycarside - Grangetown - sunderland.
Every 20 minutes replacing the 2,2a

I think go north east have messed around with buses in tunstall bank estate so much since the 141 days, Passengers  just walk to the main road for  the 2 or 39. The current 38 runs every hour so proves there's no longer a demand. Can't see Deptford chopping the 2/2a day times from ryhope and Silksworth or even going to the metrocentre. Perhaps have an x1a every hour  from pick tree / galleries/team valley/Newcastle . There's no demand from Washington to the metrocentre. X88 is a ghost bus on weekends

(14 Sep 2016, 6:42 pm)Acky81 wrote I think go north east have messed around with buses in tunstall bank estate so much since the 141 days, Passengers  just walk to the main road for  the 2 or 39. The current 38 runs every hour so proves there's no longer a demand. Can't see Deptford chopping the 2/2a day times from ryhope and Silksworth or even going to the metrocentre. Perhaps have an x1a every hour  from pick tree / galleries/team valley/Newcastle . There's no demand from Washington to the metrocentre. X88 is a ghost bus on weekends

The X88 has always been different to most other services. First 2 or 3 runs of the day can often be busy to the Metrocentre, but you'll be lucky to carry one passenger back. Coming back from the Metrocentre to Washington, the last 2 or 3 runs of the day are often busy, but you're not taking many people at all towards the Metrocentre.

(12 Sep 2016, 8:02 pm)Andreos1 wrote It has been said repeatedly, that links from Washington to Team Valley are poor. Apart from secured/contracted services early doors and after work, there is a minimum of two services that need to be taken (assuming a passenger lives in walking distance from the Galleries).

So...

Concord - Galleries - Springwell - Harlow Green/Allerdene - Kingsway - Lobley Hill Road/Bensham Bank - Cuthbert St - Teams and then the common route to Metrocentre.

As well as improving links to TVTE from Washington, it will create links from parts of Gateshead that are without a direct connection to TVTE, despite them being relatively close together. 
By extending the service to the Metrocentre, the service will have 'through' passengers to supplement margins in addition to any passengers using it to/from TVTE only.

I wonder if it would be worth extending the 82A to Team Valley to provide the link between Washington and Team Valley. It could be extended from Birtley and it would be good if it also served Lansbury Drive/Birtley Crem on the way to provide a more frequent and convenient service to people living in that area. The 23 would no longer need to serve this area as a result either.

(14 Sep 2016, 11:55 pm)Washingtonian wrote I wonder if it would be worth extending the 82A to Team Valley to provide the link between Washington and Team Valley. It could be extended from Birtley and it would be good if it also served Lansbury Drive/Birtley Crem on the way to provide a more frequent and convenient service to people living in that area. The 23 would no longer need to serve this area as a result either.

Yeah, possibly. Would that increase the PVR by two vehicles?

(15 Sep 2016, 4:08 pm)Andreos1 wrote Yeah, possibly. Would that increase the PVR by two vehicles?

Yeah i think you're right. I think could be worth it though as I think a few people will benefit. As well as creating the link between Washington and Team Valley, Birtley would also have better connections to Team Valley.

Been having a think about the upcoming changes to the WTX/Durham coast services and how they could be implemented differently. 

It's generally agreed that passenger numbers on the southern part of the WTX seem high enough. The reason I suspect it becomes commercially unsustainable is due to the high number of concessionary pass users. Essentially the bus travels from Wingate to Stockton without picking up any new passengers which is a lot of time and miles to cover without bringing in any extra revenue. In the same time/miles period an urban service will transport many more pass holders and generate much more revenue. It's therefore logical to conclude that altering the route to encourage more, shorter, journeys alongside longer ones would boost sustainability. 

I've mocked up an example timetable for my suggestion to test suitability:
 


Service X35 becomes X5
Route and frequency remains unchanged between Sunderland and Peterlee. One service per hour terminates at Peterlee, though this will be replaced exactly by service X6 which will maintain a 30-min frequency along the coast road to Hartlepool. This maintains the current service as well as opening up connections to Seaham, Dalton Park & Teesside. 

Service X6  
Although I welcome a new service, I don't think the 'real' new X6 amounts to much as all it offers is a new direct link from Blackhall to Seaham and one extra bus per hour on the already busy Hartlepool-Peterlee corridor. The X6 I suggest would also call at Dalton Park and extend to Teesside as well as combining with the X7 to provide the Sunderland - Seaham - Peterlee fast every 30 minutes as per the proposals. 

Service X7
I believe the southern part of the X7 will be missed, but it needs reforming to be sustainable. Routing it via Hartlepool & Billingham does add significant extra running time, but it remains competitive with the 21/21A - but with arguably more useful links if people in Wingate & Station Town wish to travel to simply the nearest Rail Station/Hospital/Cinema etc. Combined with X6, this would provide a 30 minute frequency Hartlepool - Billingham - Stockton - Middlesbrough along a much faster route than that of the frequently overcrowded 36. Running via Teesdale in Stockton will link together most of the colleges in the northern Tees Valley meaning Go North East will be the preferred option for the lucrative student market.   

If I've done my maths correctly the 'real' proposals will have a PVR of 13 - factoring in the X5, the X6/X7 and an extra bus on the 202.

I think my suggestions could be implemented with a combined PVR of 15. For an increase in PVR of just 2, I believe the new links created and commercial sustainability would be well worth it.

(18 Oct 2016, 2:34 pm)James101 wrote Been having a think about the upcoming changes to the WTX/Durham coast services and how they could be implemented differently. 

It's generally agreed that passenger numbers on the southern part of the WTX seem high enough. The reason I suspect it becomes commercially unsustainable is due to the high number of concessionary pass users. 

That is questionable.
Many concessionary pass users would not travel without their concession, and the operator receives a contribution that they wouldn't receive if they didn't travel.
I suspect that you should have stated that there is a paucity of fare-paying passengers - which is a different argument.
Imagine the passenger numbers without concessionary pass users and see if the service would be commercially sustainable.

(18 Oct 2016, 3:00 pm)G-CPTN wrote That is questionable.
Many concessionary pass users would not travel without their concession, and the operator receives a contribution that they wouldn't receive if they didn't travel.
I suspect that you should have stated that there is a paucity of fare-paying passengers - which is a different argument.
Imagine the passenger numbers without concessionary pass users and see if the service would be commercially sustainable.

Indeed, I believe concessionary passes are a good thing. The part of my post you cropped out, however, explains why I think concessions can work to the detriment of long distance routes.

Looking at just the southern part of the X7, let's say a service carries 20 concessions from Peterlee & Wingate. Due to the express nature of the route most passengers remain on the vehicle until at least Stockton or Middlesbrough. The bus takes one hour to carry these passengers. Comparing this to a short urban route, such as the 54; in one hour the bus can complete two full circuits carrying passengers both from Newcastle to Saltwell Park and from Saltwell Park to Gateshead on both loops. Assuming the overheads of running one bus for one hour are roughly the same, the bus on the 54 has the potential to carry four times as many individual journies per hour as the bus on the X7. When Go North East revive a flat rate reimbursement for concessions, it becomes easy to see why long distance routes struggle.

Death by bus pass is not an unheard of concept; it's led to the down fall of the X60/X61 to Scarbourgh and is the reason passes cannot be used on some express routes such as the X8 in Cumbria and trentbarton's red arrow.

(18 Oct 2016, 5:21 pm)James101 wrote Indeed, I believe concessionary passes are a good thing. The part of my post you cropped out, however, explains why I think concessions can work to the detriment of long distance routes.

Looking at just the southern part of the X7, let's say a service carries 20 concessions from Peterlee & Wingate. Due to the express nature of the route most passengers remain on the vehicle until at least Stockton or Middlesbrough. The bus takes one hour to carry these passengers. Comparing this to a short urban route, such as the 54; in one hour the bus can complete two full circuits carrying passengers both from Newcastle to Saltwell Park and from Saltwell Park to Gateshead on both loops. Assuming the overheads of running one bus for one hour are roughly the same, the bus on the 54 has the potential to carry four times as many individual journies per hour as the bus on the X7. When Go North East revive a flat rate reimbursement for concessions, it becomes easy to see why long distance routes struggle.

Death by bus pass is not an unheard of concept; it's led to the down fall of the X60/X61 to Scarbourgh and is the reason passes cannot be used on some express routes such as the X8 in Cumbria and trentbarton's red arrow.

The withdrawal of concessionary travel on the red arrow was not a commercial decision on the part of Trent barton. It was cost cutting by Nottingham Council who claimed red arrow is a premium service and they are under no obligation to fund such services. Derbyshire are still funding journeys  on red arrow that originate in their area. Trent Barton raised no issues with either authority regarding the use of concessionary passes.

(18 Oct 2016, 2:34 pm)James101 wrote Been having a think about the upcoming changes to the WTX/Durham coast services and how they could be implemented differently. 

It's generally agreed that passenger numbers on the southern part of the WTX seem high enough. The reason I suspect it becomes commercially unsustainable is due to the high number of concessionary pass users. Essentially the bus travels from Wingate to Stockton without picking up any new passengers which is a lot of time and miles to cover without bringing in any extra revenue. In the same time/miles period an urban service will transport many more pass holders and generate much more revenue. It's therefore logical to conclude that altering the route to encourage more, shorter, journeys alongside longer ones would boost sustainability. 

I've mocked up an example timetable for my suggestion to test suitability:
 


Service X35 becomes X5
Route and frequency remains unchanged between Sunderland and Peterlee. One service per hour terminates at Peterlee, though this will be replaced exactly by service X6 which will maintain a 30-min frequency along the coast road to Hartlepool. This maintains the current service as well as opening up connections to Seaham, Dalton Park & Teesside. 

Service X6  
Although I welcome a new service, I don't think the 'real' new X6 amounts to much as all it offers is a new direct link from Blackhall to Seaham and one extra bus per hour on the already busy Hartlepool-Peterlee corridor. The X6 I suggest would also call at Dalton Park and extend to Teesside as well as combining with the X7 to provide the Sunderland - Seaham - Peterlee fast every 30 minutes as per the proposals. 

Service X7
I believe the southern part of the X7 will be missed, but it needs reforming to be sustainable. Routing it via Hartlepool & Billingham does add significant extra running time, but it remains competitive with the 21/21A - but with arguably more useful links if people in Wingate & Station Town wish to travel to simply the nearest Rail Station/Hospital/Cinema etc. Combined with X6, this would provide a 30 minute frequency Hartlepool - Billingham - Stockton - Middlesbrough along a much faster route than that of the frequently overcrowded 36. Running via Teesdale in Stockton will link together most of the colleges in the northern Tees Valley meaning Go North East will be the preferred option for the lucrative student market.   

If I've done my maths correctly the 'real' proposals will have a PVR of 13 - factoring in the X5, the X6/X7 and an extra bus on the 202.

I think my suggestions could be implemented with a combined PVR of 15. For an increase in PVR of just 2, I believe the new links created and commercial sustainability would be well worth it.

I genuinely thought a service would run via Station Town to Hartlepool, rather than down the coast. For pretty much the same reasons you said.

However, to pick up on comments relating to the current X7.
I have used it north out of Teesside in the late afternoon/early evening, let's say a number of times - certainly not everyday.
However, what I have noticed, is the number of students and commuters who use the service out of Boro and Stockton. A number of them stop on to Peterlee, but a number get off prior to then.
Whilst I appreciate they now need to get two or three buses home now (assuming they are loyal to GNE), those journeys are often close to standing room only. 
I reckon a proportion of them will use the X7 to get to Teesside on a morning.

However, there are other times of the day I have used it and I am pretty sure the only stops the driver has made are to keep time and not get too early. 

The question needs asking as to why it varies so much. Is it because there are too many buses in the area (in which case the new services are simply transferring the issue a few miles east) or is there not enough demand - throughout the day. If there isn't enough demand throughout the day, but demand at peaks, surely a commuter service which maintains the current X7 links would be an option.
It certainly keeps the punters away from the ANE competition.

(18 Oct 2016, 6:42 pm)GuyParkRoyal wrote The withdrawal of concessionary travel on the red arrow was not a commercial decision on the part of Trent barton. It was cost cutting by Nottingham Council who claimed red arrow is a premium service and they are under no obligation to fund such services. Derbyshire are still funding journeys  on red arrow that originate in their area. Trent Barton raised no issues with either authority regarding the use of concessionary passes.

I understand the circumstances around Nottingham withdrawing the support they provided to allow use of concessionary passes on red arrow which went beyond their statutory obligations. If concessionary reimbursements were at all important to trentbarton, they're fully entitled to make the commercial decision to offer pass holders a reduced fare which would be in line with the reimbursement they previously received from the council. As they have not done this; it can be assumed trentbarton are happier pursuing fare-paying passengers. 

It's worth noting the following from the official guidance issued from the government on reimbursement of concessionary fares:
 
The Objective –"No Better, No Worse Off" 

3.1 Requiring operators to use their assets to provide a free service for a proportion of the population is a major market intervention, and the requirement to provide adequate reimbursement is a fundamental one. Equally, however, European regulations prevent concessionary travel schemes being used to provide hidden subsidy (or state aid) to operators. The underlying principle which underpins reimbursement is set out in domestic Regulations which state that operators should be left 'no better and no worse off'3 as a result of the existence of concessionary travel schemes. 

What this means is that despite pass holders taking up seats, the reimbursement of their fares cannot legally be used to boost a service's profitability. I totally accept that concessionary reimbursements prop-up off peak services and indeed justify a lot of routes existing in the first place; but they can be deadly for express routes. I am not in any way diminishing the social need for concessionary bus passes as they are a lifeline for thousands of people. Looking at them in a purely commercial sense, however, finds them to be very much a double-edged sword.