If a local authority or a PTE partially subsidises a route (i.e a few late evening journeys) but not a full on tender, can they dictate what times they run at as a condition of the subsidy?

(06 Nov 2022, 5:18 pm)L469 YVK wrote If a local authority or a PTE partially subsidises a route (i.e a few late evening journeys) but not a full on tender, can they dictate what times they run at as a condition of the subsidy?

Any secured bus journeys, timetables, route are dictated by the local authority as there pay the bill


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(06 Nov 2022, 5:18 pm)L469 YVK wrote If a local authority or a PTE partially subsidises a route (i.e a few late evening journeys) but not a full on tender, can they dictate what times they run at as a condition of the subsidy?

They can, but given it will be a negotiated agreement in your example, the operator would need to be in agreement also.

Is that not a de minimus level, if that’s the term?

As in, Nexus might contribute to last bus of an evening rather than the full service. I’m sure there was a list shared on here a few year back?

(06 Nov 2022, 9:22 pm)Chris 1 wrote Is that not a de minimus level, if that’s the term?

As in, Nexus might contribute to last bus of an evening rather than the full service. I’m sure there was a list shared on here a few year back?

I think it was a couple months, well maybe 6.

(06 Nov 2022, 7:53 pm)RobinHood wrote They can, but given it will be a negotiated agreement in your example, the operator would need to be in agreement also.

So for instance......later journeys on the 10/10A/10B that Nexus/NCC might partially subsidise, GNE could get more flexibility when they run? Whereas something like the evening 309 & 310, Nexus would work with GNE to create even headway on the Coast Road with Arriva to prevent effectively Nexus funding a red meat situation?

(06 Nov 2022, 9:37 pm)L469 YVK wrote So for instance......later journeys on the 10/10A/10B that Nexus/NCC might partially subsidise, GNE could get more flexibility when they run? Whereas something like the evening 309 & 310, Nexus would work with GNE to create even headway on the Coast Road with Arriva to prevent effectively Nexus funding a red meat situation?

Nexus won't fund the 309/310 full stop. They're not needed since their mostly covered by the 1/306/308/Metro so making even headways is irrelevant.

If they pulled Hadrian Park, I doubt it would be replaced at all, it's covered by the 41A so there's a bus service there and people can change at Wallsend Metro (it's not ideal but it's a service)

Don’t forget that since deregulation , bus companies can run services where there like and run the timetables and routes where there like and get the cream of the crop, but local authorities are obliged to fund the gap where the bus companies deemed routes and services unprofitable, the money that the local authorities get from the government it’s not the same stash that was there years ago in the 80’s and 90’s, secured timetables and routes will not always follow the commercial bus services as the secured services are for social needs and not for profit.

I wonder how many bus services are ran on late evenings and Sundays that are secured [emoji3166], won’t be that many that are commercial. Maybe there should be all have a prefix letter so the passengers can identify the service from a commercial all for profit service .


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Another example of this was the 44/45 on evening and Sundays. You use to have a 44 to Dinnington and one to hazlerigg so 2 per hour. 45 to Dinnington and 45 to Brunswick 3 per hour. Arriva suggested only 2 buses per hour Newcastle- hazlerigg Dinnington then back through Brunswick and the same in the opposite direction, still giving 2 per hour, granted a longer journey and nexus accepted this.