(17 Jan 2025, 3:20 pm)DeltaMan wrote Surely they could have printed the artwork to take along?

Plenty of timetables available in South Shields at 1400!

(17 Jan 2025, 11:06 am)Aaron21 wrote Went to roadshow this morning

Extremely poor

There was two signs saying "changes are coming in your area"

No timetables available as they "didn't have them delivered" But said. Available on our website

Asked why the 26 was hourly between Jarrow & South Shields but said more frequently Stagecoach services and York Road has better service and he lauged about the 26 being "improved"

The fact they ain't being very helpful goes to show how much this company has fallen.

What did you expect of the roadshow? live music, competitions, glitz, glamour and flashy lights? they had plenty of route change guides for both sunderland and south shields this afternoon at south shields, maybe they did get them delivered, what would have been the point in printing out the plain PDF's when the information is available online.
Thought the point of these was to answer questions about how the route changes effect how people from A to B now via C and how the changes will effect people, the decision to reduce the frequency to hourly on the 26 obviously reflects passenger numbers and for the majority of the route it is not the only service.
Guess it would have been better to not bother this morning without them then you would have complained it wasn't on.
Maybe pop to sunderland tomorrow afternoon if you really want the guides

Thanks for getting involved Ben

Love to Nige from us all

(17 Jan 2025, 8:48 pm)N1cholas wrote What did you expect of the roadshow? live music, competitions, glitz, glamour and flashy lights? they had plenty of route change guides for both sunderland and south shields this afternoon at south shields, maybe they did get them delivered, what would have been the point in printing out the plain PDF's when the information is available online.
Thought the point of these was to answer questions about how the route changes effect how people from A to B now via C and how the changes will effect people, the decision to reduce the frequency to hourly on the 26 obviously reflects passenger numbers and for the majority of the route it is not the only service.
Guess it would have been better to not bother this morning without them then you would have complained it wasn't on.
Maybe pop to sunderland tomorrow afternoon if you really want the guides

You mean it's not?! Damn, was hoping it would be a good old TV-am/GMTV affair with whatever TV star of the day hosting (lord knows who it would be in 2025).

I wasn't there, so have no clue what was/wasn't in place for it, although it's a bit poor if timetable info, even in a basic form wasn't avaliable especially as the purpose of the event was to help/inform passengers of the upcoming changes, especially to those who don't frequent the Internet or just need further clarity.

(17 Jan 2025, 8:48 pm)N1cholas wrote What did you expect of the roadshow? live music, competitions, glitz, glamour and flashy lights? they had plenty of route change guides for both sunderland and south shields this afternoon at south shields, maybe they did get them delivered, what would have been the point in printing out the plain PDF's when the information is available online.
Thought the point of these was to answer questions about how the route changes effect how people from A to B now via C and how the changes will effect people, the decision to reduce the frequency to hourly on the 26 obviously reflects passenger numbers and for the majority of the route it is not the only service.
Guess it would have been better to not bother this morning without them then you would have complained it wasn't on.
Maybe pop to sunderland tomorrow afternoon if you really want the guides

Surely the point of the roadshows are to help people who can't get online ie. pensioners.

If you can just do stuff online, then why not just have the roadshow online aswell? It would be easier for the vast majority of people anyway ie. having some form of live chat where you could just ask for help if you needed it.

Whether that's a job for Nexus or individual bus operators, is a discussion point though as I'd argue it's Nexus' remit but obviously they only promote the Metro. At the end of the day one of their role is to provide public transport information which imo they generally do terribly.

There's now maps on the changes coming up.

Map showing the service changes in Sunderland and South Tyneside:

https://images-gonortheast.passenger-web...025%29.pdf


https://www.gonortheast.co.uk/service-ch...washington


https://www.gonortheast.co.uk/service-ch...nuary-2025


Also to note, it looks like the new timetables are now in a proper format.

Jesus christ that looks so bare! On a positive note the 61 diversion isn't as long as I thought it would be.

(20 Jan 2025, 11:21 pm)F114TML wrote Jesus christ that looks so bare! On a positive note the 61 diversion isn't as long as I thought it would be.

The first link is just showing the routes with service changes.  Presumably to create extra confusion they have produced one map showing just revised services and a separate one showing the full network.  Other than Washington where they still only show the 2.  Oh and they have left the 8 and 78 off, but have included the likes of the 56, so seems pretty random.

Not sure why they dont just link to the actual timetables from the service change page either.  They haven't split them into separate pdfs anyway, so a link to the Sunderland one and a link to the Shields one instead of fannying on searching individual routes would have been sensible.  As it is, when for example you search for the 33 pdf, you get a 57 page pdf starting off with service 2 to wade through.  Reminds me of the dark days of "Better than Never" with the crazy 100-odd page brochure you had to search through to find your service had indeed been slashed.

(21 Jan 2025, 1:13 am)stagecoachbusdepot wrote The first link is just showing the routes with service changes.  Presumably to create extra confusion they have produced one map showing just revised services and a separate one showing the full network.  Other than Washington where they still only show the 2.  Oh and they have left the 8 and 78 off, but have included the likes of the 56, so seems pretty random.

That map is a complete mess, using cream on cream that's just basic design stuff for a big no no, not to mention the multiple pink/reds in the city which all clash with each other.

Not to mention the missing routes, the 27 being another one and arguably the busiest in South Tyneside ironically.

Very poor design and definitely not a Creating Desire or whatever it's called as much they're slated.

(21 Jan 2025, 3:40 pm)Storx wrote That map is a complete mess, using cream on cream that's just basic design stuff for a big no no, not to mention the multiple pink/reds in the city which all clash with each other.

Not to mention the missing routes, the 27 being another one and arguably the busiest in South Tyneside ironically.

Very poor design and definitely not a Creating Desire or whatever it's called as much they're slated.

Hadn't noticed the 27 missing as well.  Why on earth you'd bother to produce a "network map" then fail to include some of your routes is beyond me.  It would be a massive asset if only it was accurate and complete. Some of the clangers GNE drop is almost like they are actively trying to fail.  The Sunderland "road show" was another example - they had a load of out of date timetables in the rack for the likes of 56 and 65, together with soon to be out of date ones for 33 etc.  Talk about how to confuse customers.   Everything they do is epitomised by that network map though, which screams amateur and just reflects again what a mess the company is in.

Every time I read something on this Forum about GNE, it actually hurts me head on another level. Not because of anything that anyone is saying on here; but the fact that everyones pointing out Go North East's incompetence, and everything everyone is saying is 9 times out of 10 fully factual. It must say something about the company, that people are getting annoyed at posts on the Forum regarding GNE, and the person who's posting it isn't even saying anything wrong. The map's in shambles, half the time they don't know their own route. I'm putting £50 on the day of the changes there'll be buses going awol all over 'cause they don't know where to go.

(21 Jan 2025, 9:28 pm)lewisparker1509 wrote Every time I read something on this Forum about GNE, it actually hurts me head on another level. Not because of anything that anyone is saying on here; but the fact that everyones pointing out Go North East's incompetence, and everything everyone is saying is 9 times out of 10 fully factual. It must say something about the company, that people are getting annoyed at posts on the Forum regarding GNE, and the person who's posting it isn't even saying anything wrong. The map's in shambles, half the time they don't know their own route. I'm putting £50 on the day of the changes there'll be buses going awol all over 'cause they don't know where to go.

No-one cares basically. Once management alienate the staff to the stage of strikes it always happens. No doubt be a lot of working to rule for anyone who doesn't love the job and it ends up with the mess like now and that's ignoring those who bolted.

Sad because they actually had some decent staff in the past ie. Dan on here but seems most have gone now. Heard a lot of the old guard were lost with the Chester Le Street farce aswell. 

The only people who like GoNorthEast are the fanatics around who can't take criticism. Not worth talking to people like that though as you'll just get abuse for stating facts. The public certainly don't and are a lot more vocal than on here. 

Arriva isn't much better tbh for similar reasons but least they seem to be on the up a bit after the takeover.

(21 Jan 2025, 10:22 pm)Storx wrote No-one cares basically. Once management alienate the staff to the stage of strikes it always happens. No doubt be a lot of working to rule for anyone who doesn't love the job and it ends up with the mess like now and that's ignoring those who bolted.

Sad because they actually had some decent staff in the past ie. Dan on here but seems most have gone now. Heard a lot of the old guard were lost with the Chester Le Street farce aswell. 

The only people who like GoNorthEast are the fanatics around who can't take criticism. Not worth talking to people like that though as you'll just get abuse for stating facts. The public certainly don't and are a lot more vocal than on here. 

Arriva isn't much better tbh for similar reasons but least they seem to be on the up a bit after the takeover.

im gonna hold my hands up and say i originally didnt like dan, but you're right he's probably the most decent one there. i've came to realise that when dan was at GNE, he's always been a good bloke, he was just sticking up for the wrong company. and now, northstar is doing absolutley bits (in a good way obvs) and i hope he gets some north tyneside/newcastle contracts. did the 643 for the first ever time in my life just before the new year (never even done it with previous operators), and i've never enjoyed being on an ALX so much in my life. buses: pristine, staff: sound as a pound, timekeeping; haven't seen one major complaint yet! GNE could never!

i fully understand why he was sticking up for gne so much tho, im assuming he wanted to get higher up the ladder to make it a better company, its just a shame he wasn't able to.

i honestly believe, if dan was able to get to the very top of GNE say a few year back to turn it around, franchising wouldn't even be a conversation right now.

i do agree and accept its not just GNE with this issue, but the amount of complaints and issues compared to stagecoach is unreal

(21 Jan 2025, 10:44 pm)lewisparker1509 wrote im gonna hold my hands up and say i originally didnt like dan, but you're right he's probably the most decent one there. i've came to realise that when dan was at GNE, he's always been a good bloke, he was just sticking up for the wrong company. and now, northstar is doing absolutley bits (in a good way obvs) and i hope he gets some north tyneside/newcastle contracts. did the 643 for the first ever time in my life just before the new year (never even done it with previous operators), and i've never enjoyed being on an ALX so much in my life. buses: pristine, staff: sound as a pound, timekeeping; haven't seen one major complaint yet! GNE could never!

i fully understand why he was sticking up for gne so much tho, im assuming he wanted to get higher up the ladder to make it a better company, its just a shame he wasn't able to.

i honestly believe, if dan was able to get to the very top of GNE say a few year back to turn it around, franchising wouldn't even be a conversation right now.

i do agree and accept its not just GNE with this issue, but the amount of complaints and issues compared to stagecoach is unreal

To be fair I can't fault anyone backing their work up. GNE wasn't really that bad back then. I know a lot of people blame Featham but I don't actually think he's the real problem. Personally I think the problem is above him. If the group won't give you money and want you to make cuts then you can argue he's doing a 'good job.' When he had money at Arriva he wasn't that bad really it's only when that tap ran out with the DB issues it went South there aswell. 

GoNorthEast has gone down hill big time since the Aussies took over and they seem to be more bothered about servicing their debt rather than actually running a decent bus service

I've heard that Go East Anglia isn't much better either. 

iSquared and the new Stagecoach owners seem to be in for the long run so don't seem to be cutting as much. Credit to Stagecoach they've pretty much dealt with everything fine in recent years and recovered from COVID well.

(21 Jan 2025, 10:22 pm)Storx wrote No-one cares basically. Once management alienate the staff to the stage of strikes it always happens. No doubt be a lot of working to rule for anyone who doesn't love the job and it ends up with the mess like now and that's ignoring those who bolted.

Sad because they actually had some decent staff in the past ie. Dan on here but seems most have gone now. Heard a lot of the old guard were lost with the Chester Le Street farce aswell. 

The only people who like GoNorthEast are the fanatics around who can't take criticism. Not worth talking to people like that though as you'll just get abuse for stating facts. The public certainly don't and are a lot more vocal than on here. 

Arriva isn't much better tbh for similar reasons but least they seem to be on the up a bit after the takeover.

Most of the real old hands at Chester were offered and took severance when it closed. There were a few long servers who weren't quite old enough to retire at the time who went to Washington.

Can't remember the exact numbers, but if I recall, best part of sixty went to Washington, best part of forty to Consett, about fifteen to Riverside and ten to Deptford. Two and a bit years on, by my count, there's about forty still at Washington, twenty or so still at Consett, less than ten at Riverside and maybe half a dozen at Deptford. I'd describe Chester as having had an ageing workforce at the time of closure, and, even with potential changes in industry working practices difficult to account for, I'd be impressed if there were more than twenty ex-Chester drivers still around by the time of the tenth anniversary of its closure. For context, there's still about twenty drivers between Riverside and Deptford who originated at South Shields, a considerably smaller depot which closed twenty years ago this month, and while it might be apples and oranges in terms of driver establishment size and local workforce age demographics, I don't anticipate any comparable longevity there.

(22 Jan 2025, 1:47 am)R852 PRG wrote Most of the real old hands at Chester were offered and took severance when it closed. There were a few long servers who weren't quite old enough to retire at the time who went to Washington.

Can't remember the exact numbers, but if I recall, best part of sixty went to Washington, best part of forty to Consett, about fifteen to Riverside and ten to Deptford. Two and a bit years on, by my count, there's about forty still at Washington, twenty or so still at Consett, less than ten at Riverside and maybe half a dozen at Deptford. I'd describe Chester as having had an ageing workforce at the time of closure, and, even with potential changes in industry working practices difficult to account for, I'd be impressed if there were more than twenty ex-Chester drivers still around by the time of the tenth anniversary of its closure. For context, there's still about twenty drivers between Riverside and Deptford who originated at South Shields, a considerably smaller depot which closed twenty years ago this month, and while it might be apples and oranges in terms of driver establishment size and local workforce age demographics, I don't anticipate any comparable longevity there.

Thanks for confirming, can't say I can't blame them for taking the severance pay when they could. I know I would've definitely done the same, if I was in the same boat.

Wouldn't be surprised if many are left either, no doubt a few will go when the farce (employment wise) comes in with the franchising which no doubt will be a headache for some.

(17 Jan 2025, 7:08 pm)busmanT wrote Plenty of timetables available in South Shields at 1400!

Not much use to the folk who attended Sunderland at 10.00 though, is it? 

Hopefully that won't be the case again this Fri/Sat.

(17 Jan 2025, 8:48 pm)N1cholas wrote What did you expect of the roadshow? live music, competitions, glitz, glamour and flashy lights? they had plenty of route change guides for both sunderland and south shields this afternoon at south shields, maybe they did get them delivered, what would have been the point in printing out the plain PDF's when the information is available online.
Thought the point of these was to answer questions about how the route changes effect how people from A to B now via C and how the changes will effect people, the decision to reduce the frequency to hourly on the 26 obviously reflects passenger numbers and for the majority of the route it is not the only service.
Guess it would have been better to not bother this morning without them then you would have complained it wasn't on.
Maybe pop to sunderland tomorrow afternoon if you really want the guides

Putting the flippancy to one side, I think it would be a reasonable expectation to be able to take away some literature for the changes they're promoting. People are of course going to ask questions, but I suspect most of the answers are what could be referred to in a paper timetable or route map. What do you say to the first person that tells you they don't have a device to access the Internet on? 

It'd have also been a useful aid in promoting those services to people who don't presently use them. 

In reality though, I suspect these 'roadshows' are only taking place because it's been pointed out that they haven't followed the consultation protocol that they've committed to in the Enhanced Partnership.

(22 Jan 2025, 4:47 pm)Adrian wrote Not much use to the folk who attended Sunderland at 10.00 though, is it? 

Hopefully that won't be the case again this Fri/Sat.


Putting the flippancy to one side, I think it would be a reasonable expectation to be able to take away some literature for the changes they're promoting. People are of course going to ask questions, but I suspect most of the answers are what could be referred to in a paper timetable or route map. What do you say to the first person that tells you they don't have a device to access the Internet on? 

It'd have also been a useful aid in promoting those services to people who don't presently use them. 

In reality though, I suspect these 'roadshows' are only taking place because it's been pointed out that they haven't followed the consultation protocol that they've committed to in the Enhanced Partnership.

 Even the timetables turned up late ..... oh the irony.

Actually just noticed, on a Saturday, the last journey from Lukes Lane Estate is 15:22pm towards Sunderland.


Odd time to end the service then.

(22 Jan 2025, 8:23 pm)Michael wrote Actually just noticed, on a Saturday, the last journey from Lukes Lane Estate is 15:22pm towards Sunderland.


Odd time to end the service then.

Be interesting if anyone actually got the bus all the way round. You'd arguably be better getting off at York Avenue and walking the 5 minutes instead or alternatively walking to Fellgate if you're more able.

For Hebburn I'd be using the Metro personally, even with the change.

(22 Jan 2025, 8:23 pm)Michael wrote Actually just noticed, on a Saturday, the last journey from Lukes Lane Estate is 15:22pm towards Sunderland.


Odd time to end the service then.

Almost like it was just introduced for efficiency rather than what anybody actually wants.

(23 Jan 2025, 1:44 pm)deanmachine wrote Almost like it was just introduced for efficiency rather than what anybody actually wants.

I doubt many passengers heading that way after then. 

Jarrow dead at 4pm on a Saturday.

(23 Jan 2025, 7:24 pm)busmanT wrote I doubt many passengers heading that way after then. 

Jarrow dead at 4pm on a Saturday.

To be fair the 26 runs until the end of the night. It's only people who want to travel to Fellgate and beyond who are affected but you'd have to be pretty dedicated to do that route unless you're really unable to walk as the Metro would be substantially quicker from Hebburn or Fellgate even with the 10/15 minute walk or alternatively the 5/9 on York Avenue.

Service 62 has the via points on the destination display the same way in both directions......62 Doxford Park via Sunderland and Ryhope.....and 62 Pennywell via Sunderland and Ryhope, Pennywell should be Ryhope and Sunderland.

The change of the 25 to 22 might be a masterclass in how not to communicate

(26 Jan 2025, 7:33 pm)Ambassador wrote The change of the 25 to 22 might be a masterclass in how not to communicate

and creates 2 service 22s in Newcastle!

Shouldn't the Enhanced Partnership have stopped this?

(26 Jan 2025, 9:16 pm)busmanT wrote and creates 2 service 22s in Newcastle!

Shouldn't the Enhanced Partnership have stopped this?

Perhaps such a discrepancy would have been ironed out during the consultation process which is meant to take place as per the Bus Passenger Charter. What sort of consultation do you think has been undertaken?

It's not like they could swap the 20/20A and 22 because either way the 22 is causing conflict
22 Cobalt- Throckley
22 Durham- Sunderland
There's quite a good chunk of numbers in the 40's that are not used 40,42-45 but if they really wanted to they could easily renumber the 41/41A

(26 Jan 2025, 9:16 pm)busmanT wrote and creates 2 service 22s in Newcastle!

Shouldn't the Enhanced Partnership have stopped this?

If an operator needs telling by a third party about another route in the same city with with the same number, then they really shouldn't be in operation to start with.

The number, although a random change isn’t the biggest issue. We’ve had an Angel 22 in the past but I agree there could have been more thought to it. The obsession with 2 digits doesn’t help.

It’s more the totally random change communicated to passengers via a south Tyneside and Sunderland update as a footnote