(27 Jan 2015, 10:11 pm)Dan wrote Durham - Chester, I can't imagine many having a preference.

Durham - Newcastle, the preference will be the X21 given the faster journey time.



Nowt to do with them not having any oomph though  

I'd have no problems with getting the 21 to Chester from Durham as it takes no longer than the X21/X2 although from Durham / Chester to Gateshead / Newcastle I'd choose the X2/X21 any day because if you sit on the 21 for that long you will loose your marbles.

(27 Jan 2015, 8:00 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote Scania still offer a 9 litre 250bhp engine at Euro 6 on the E400MMC body. I strongly think GNE will go with ADL bodywork for deckers and even though the Cummins is no good for long distance / express work, it would be ideal for the likes of the Crusader and even the Angel when the B5LH's whave had their day if not ordering for the two purposes described above. 

BIB: set the ECU right and anything is suitable for any sort of work - as I've mentioned in the past. And instead of simply slating Cummins engines, get out there and experience one of 7529-33 on the A1. And asking yourself why most customers for the Optare Solo or Optare Versa have gone for the Cummins engine option

(27 Jan 2015, 10:35 pm)Kuyoyo wrote BIB: set the ECU right and anything is suitable for any sort of work - as I've mentioned in the past. And instead of simply slating Cummins engines, get out there and experience one of 7529-33 on the A1. And asking yourself why most customers for the Optare Solo or Optare Versa have gone for the Cummins engine option

Ok then but:

- Why are 6001 - 6007 (often fully laden between Galleries and Newcastle) in better state than the Cummins DB300's (61 reg examples) at Blyth? (Very similar routes and the X1 more on par with the sections of the X21 / X22 between Ashington and Newcastle). And the 61 reg Geminis even spent time on the 308 before 7801 - 7810 arrived.

- Why did the E400's not cope on the X93 resulting in the order of dealer stock B9TL's?

- Why did Arriva have B9TL's on the order books for the X18 originally?

- And for a Cummins ISB 6.7 engine to achieve the same output as the D9B, Cummins use Turbochargers but as soon as the Turbocharger dies, the engine has had it. The D9B doesn't need Turbochargers to achieve a high power output

AND WHY, did Arriva have to bring 6 Volvo B10BLE's down from Scotland to replace 3 year old ALX400's from Hexham depot on the 602 and why after a 2 year stint at Blyth, did Jesmond send out Palatines on the 306 during evenings and Sundays?

(27 Jan 2015, 11:04 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote Ok then but:

- Why are 6001 - 6007 (often fully laden between Galleries and Newcastle) in better state than the Cummins DB300's (61 reg examples) at Blyth? (Very similar routes and the X1 more on par with the sections of the X21 / X22 between Ashington and Newcastle). And the 61 reg Geminis even spent time on the 308 before 7801 - 7810 arrived.

- Why did the E400's not cope on the X93 resulting in the order of dealer stock B9TL's?

- Why did Arriva have B9TL's on the order books for the X18 originally?

- And for a Cummins ISB 6.7 engine to achieve the same output as the D9B, Cummins use Turbochargers but as soon as the Turbocharger dies, the engine has had it. The D9B doesn't need Turbochargers to achieve a high power output

The E400s struggled in 2013 because they weren't looked after properly - they managed fine in 2012. But then, the B7TLs struggled as well - and who's not to say these B9TLs won't struggle.

No B9TLs were ever ordered for the X18 - the order was always for E400s, it was a basic communication error.

Actually, if a Turbocharger dies, the engine can still go but on reduced power output. If the D9B dies, the B9 is dead.

Also, all I see is moaning about the X18 - I don't see anything being complained about when Stagecoach used to send Newcastle-based E400s (can't remember which ones but it's 2 or 3 of the 58-reg E400s) to London on Megabus work every Sunday and when the main Megabus fleet kept breaking down. Even been a Trident do Portsmouth-Newcastle-Rugby.

But that is on a one off basis though and, if the Turbo dies and the Cummins runs on a reduced power output, then the Cummins Unit will suffer from problems in the long run. Most Volvo engines that have been prpduced are bullet proof and even the owner of Spirit Buses wanted Volvo but had to go with Transbus / ADL as it was cheaper.

(27 Jan 2015, 11:48 am)Malarkey wrote Just a little prediction from me, I noticed that the Blinds on 5320-24 are Programmed as Blue for the 61, whereas previously they were in fact purple as shown in the link https://www.flickr.com/photos/adammalark...911496376/ - Secondly on a Sunday as a result of Services Changes in Sunderland on Sunday just gone, the 60 and 61 both Interwork with each other meaning that the Drifter Streetlites are allocated to the 61, therefore I think Four Streetlites have been ordered for the 61 and it will rejoin the Drifter Brand, and the allocation of 5320-24 is only Temporary.

As for Double Deckers which seems to be a Topical Debate at the moment, from looking at the Specifications of both the Streetdeck and Gemini/B5TL, Id say the Streetdeck would be the better option otherwise purchase the E400 MMC.

Having been on the 61 today and experiencing a quiet, warm and comfortable ride I do not want noisy, cheap and nasty Streetlites anywhere near this route. The Citaro should also be ordered for the Lime. If it is good enough for the nowhere to nowhere route sorry I mean the Heworth to Houghton-le-Spring service then it would be sensible to put it on the Lime. Imagine travelling from Sunderland to Stanley on a Streetlite. You would need psychiatric treatment on arrival.

(27 Jan 2015, 8:00 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote Scania still offer a 9 litre 250bhp engine at Euro 6 on the E400MMC body. I strongly think GNE will go with ADL bodywork for deckers and even though the Cummins is no good for long distance / express work, it would be ideal for the likes of the Crusader and even the Angel when the B5LH's whave had their day if not ordering for the two purposes described above. 

I'm not a fan of ADL products, and had experience of Arriva 7514-21 when I worked at Bishop Auckland depot. Cheap and nasty springs to mind! 

I may be wrong but I suspect GNE will be looking to stick with Wright and Optare products in the interests of standardisation. I'll also bet that Scania products have a price premium as well.

As far as upgrading the Pronto goes, I have said this before but I would like to see 6001-7 transferred to Crook. They have now got miles under their belts and any teething problems will be long gone. New buses bring their own problems!

Not the place but I remain sceptical that the Hybrids are the right choice for the Angel.

The congestion and slow pace through Birtley (which in effect out of peak doesn't exist - I've yet to be on a 21 doing 20!) is overplayed, its far worse in Low Fell and Newcastle CC.

Saying that, give me an open chequebook and I'm still not sure what the right bus is!

(28 Jan 2015, 6:56 am)DaveyBowyer wrote But that is on a one off basis though and, if the Turbo dies and the Cummins runs on a reduced power output, then the Cummins Unit will suffer from problems in the long run. Most Volvo engines that have been prpduced are bullet proof and even the owner of Spirit Buses wanted Volvo but had to go with Transbus / ADL as it was cheaper.

Erm, they have Caetano-bodied Darts...

Also, in relation to your reply to me earlier in the thread - Go North East have 1001 - why would they need to pay Alpha to go and fetch a bus when 1001 is clearly closer. Think about it: Alpha - Weetslade (Cramlington). Go North East's 1001 - GATESHEAD!

(28 Jan 2015, 5:23 pm)Tommy_1581 wrote Erm, they have Caetano-bodied Darts...

Also, in relation to your reply to me earlier in the thread - Go North East have 1001 - why would they need to pay Alpha to go and fetch a bus when 1001 is clearly closer. Think about it: Alpha - Weetslade (Cramlington). Go North East's 1001 - GATESHEAD!

What are you on about? Caetano Bodied Darts have nothing to do with anything Davey was saying!

And makes no difference, it is still a long way to travel.

(28 Jan 2015, 5:24 pm)Tom wrote What are you on about? Caetano Bodied Darts have nothing to do with anything Davey was saying!

And makes no difference, it is still a long way to travel.

Spirit Buses have Caetano bodied Darts, don't they?

(28 Jan 2015, 5:26 pm)Tommy_1581 wrote Spirit Buses have Caetano bodied Darts, don't they?

I thought you were on about his reply about the X9/X10?

(28 Jan 2015, 5:28 pm)Tom wrote I thought you were on about his reply about the X9/X10?

I was replying to both posts - I wasn't online much yesterday because I was out.

(28 Jan 2015, 5:26 pm)Tommy_1581 wrote Spirit Buses have Caetano bodied Darts, don't they?

Yes - I believe the owner of Spirit Buses said that they had to opt for Caetano bodied Dennis Darts in the end as cost was prohibitive meaning that they couldn't go for a more solid Volvo product. Darts are ADL products, so Davey is right.

(28 Jan 2015, 5:29 pm)Tommy_1581 wrote I was replying to both posts - I wasn't online much yesterday because I was out.  

Ignore me then, I don't read stuff fully.

I don't think the Pronto will get new vehicles. I could most likely see the Red Arrows getting an upgrade with:
- 6001 - 6007 going to Crook.
- 6049 to Riverside for the TEN.
- 6050 going to Percy Main for Cobalt spare role.
- 6051 - 6053 to Riverside as spares allowing 3941-42 and 3963 to Percy Main for DFDS work replacing 3x Tridents only leaving one of the 51 reg President Tridents to remain.
- 6054 and 6055 fitted with Flybrid flywheels and joining the B5LHs at Chester

(28 Jan 2015, 5:30 pm)Dan wrote Yes - I believe the owner of Spirit Buses said that they had to opt for Caetano bodied Dennis Darts in the end as cost was prohibitive meaning that they couldn't go for a more solid Volvo product. Darts are ADL products, so Davey is right.

But ADL didn't build them Darts - because ADL wasn't around until Transbus went bust...

(28 Jan 2015, 5:32 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote I don't think the Pronto will get new vehicles. I could most likely see the Red Arrows getting an upgrade with:
- 6001 - 6007 going to Crook.
- 6049 to Riverside for the TEN.
- 6050 going to Percy Main for Cobalt spare role.
- 6051 - 6053 to Riverside as spares allowing 3941-42 and 3963 to Percy Main for DFDS work replacing 3x Tridents only leaving one of the 51 reg President Tridents to remain.
- 6054 and 6055 fitted with Flybrid flywheels and joining the B5LHs at Chester

DFDS shuttle work doesn't require 05-reg Geminis - why do the DFDS fleet need newer buses anyway?

(28 Jan 2015, 5:33 pm)Tommy_1581 wrote But ADL didn't build them Darts - because ADL wasn't around until Transbus went bust...

Well yes, but you're going into technicalities... The products are still very similar, whatever the trading name of the manufacturer might be...

(28 Jan 2015, 5:35 pm)Tommy_1581 wrote DFDS shuttle work doesn't require 05-reg Geminis - why do the DFDS fleet need newer buses anyway?

3866 and 3867 are not DDA compliant. They must be withdrawn prior to 1 January 2017, so their replacement needs to be organised before then.

(28 Jan 2015, 5:32 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote I don't think the Pronto will get new vehicles. I could most likely see the Red Arrows getting an upgrade with:
- 6001 - 6007 going to Crook.
- 6049 to Riverside for the TEN.
- 6050 going to Percy Main for Cobalt spare role.
- 6051 - 6053 to Riverside as spares allowing 3941-42 and 3963 to Percy Main for DFDS work replacing 3x Tridents only leaving one of the 51 reg President Tridents to remain.
- 6054 and 6055 fitted with Flybrid flywheels and joining the B5LHs at Chester

I think it'd be a while before the Red Arrows next gets new vehicles with the Gemini 2s being the age they are. Therefore, i think the Pronto will get new vehicles.

(28 Jan 2015, 5:38 pm)Dan wrote 3866 and 3867 are not DDA compliant. They must be withdrawn prior to 1 January 2017, so their replacement needs to be organised before then.

This being the case, I can see the DFDS service being seen for investment (begs the question, does it need so?) nonetheless - I reckon they will be part of the 2017 orders...if they are withdrawn back end of 2016, reserve vehicles can take over their duties until their successors arrive?

Just a theory. Don't shoot.

(28 Jan 2015, 6:51 pm)MarcTheA4 wrote This being the case, I can see the DFDS service being seen for investment (begs the question, does it need so?) nonetheless - I reckon they will be part of the 2017 orders...if they are withdrawn back end of 2016, reserve vehicles can take over their duties until their successors arrive?

Just a theory. Don't shoot.

Ready, aim, FIRE!  

(28 Jan 2015, 6:51 pm)MarcTheA4 wrote This being the case, I can see the DFDS service being seen for investment (begs the question, does it need so?) nonetheless - I reckon they will be part of the 2017 orders...if they are withdrawn back end of 2016, reserve vehicles can take over their duties until their successors arrive?

Just a theory. Don't shoot.

Bang!

(28 Jan 2015, 6:51 pm)Robert wrote I think it'd be a while before the Red Arrows next gets new vehicles with the Gemini 2s being the age they are. Therefore, i think the Pronto will get new vehicles.

I know the Gemini 2s are relaively new but:
- GNE might want to increase the Fab 56 frequency back  to every 10 minutes meaning that an extra bus at least will be needed.
- The TEN is still short of 1 vehicle as 6084 will nearly always be needed on the TTX.
- The 309 / 310 might get split meaning that all of the existing 17 need used.
- The Pronto sort of justifys new vehicles but 6001 - 6007 have been well proven.
- The Angel is 2 short of a modern Gemini spare.
- The Red Arrows is missing power sockets which comes as standard with most new double deck orders (exclusing the Angel).

(28 Jan 2015, 6:51 pm)MarcTheA4 wrote This being the case, I can see the DFDS service being seen for investment (begs the question, does it need so?) nonetheless - I reckon they will be part of the 2017 orders...if they are withdrawn back end of 2016, reserve vehicles can take over their duties until their successors arrive?

Just a theory. Don't shoot.

I'd be very surprised if it got brand new vehicles. I think it's probably likely that some more of the 51 plate Tridents get converted for it when the time comes to drop them out of front line duties.

Is the subsidy that DFDS pays worth much or carry many obligations for GNE?

Hopefully GNE release details of the new orders soon, as in which routes will get new buses...

(04 Feb 2015, 12:36 pm)Michael wrote Hopefully GNE release details of the new orders soon, as in which routes will get new buses...

Aye, still wondering what the new buses and the livery are going to be for the X66...