(19 Dec 2020, 11:54 pm)Ambassador wrote Interesting debate this. My view on Hebburn is that you’ve got swathes of new housing being built but all are designed for car users and most are indeed car users, so the increase in population isn’t really an increase in bus users and when those people do commute they’d prefer to stand on a metro to Newcastle for 13 minutes (by which time the 27 is still in Hebburn on it’s torturous route through Luke’s Lane)

The likes of Hebburn in particular is that it’s moving away from being a place of employment and industry to essentially a commuter town so people aren’t looking to make local journeys (outside concessionary pass holders) but more point to point

On the earlier point of the 721, it didn’t really compete Durham Rd wise as it served Elizabethville and Barley Mow which the the 23 sort of replaced but didn’t. Birtley used to have an excellent local network with the original 23 going up into Sanders Gardens and Birtley East school (now a taxi bus service) alongside the 184 and direct links to Sunderland (777) and South Shields (551) and more regular services to Ouston and direct services to Stanley (709/728) again Birtley is seeing that shift to commuter town status

I've read back and realise what I was saying didn't come across too clearly. I meant the section south of Barley Mow through North Lodge etc. 

I'm still amazed that developers are designing estates for car users, particularly as there are all sorts of measures in place for councils to implement specific rules and regs in relation to public transport. 
Similarly, I'm flabbergasted that bus operators don't look to encourage that switch in those areas. 

The new housing in Birtley has the 81/82 coming through on a one-way loop (from Birtley, but not taking them to Birtley), but at the same time residents have seen the 25 (which skirts the estate) adapt its route and make getting in to Newcastle less attractive. 
No wonder car use is on the increase.

(20 Dec 2020, 12:54 am)Storx wrote Yeah agreed with the new housing it's the same up this way. Gosforth Park being one where they pretty much isn't a bus service at all to the place, the same as the new housing estates they're building in Cramlington.

Wrote a bit more on the commuter town below.


Yeah agreed there, it's almost as the network is stuck back in 1980 for me serving places that were popular back then but not so much nowadays with noticeable places being pretty much unserved. Shopping without a car must be an absolute nightmare for most people like talking about South Shields if you wanted an ASDA you'd probably want to go to the one at Boldon but you can't get there; some clothes shopping Silverlink or Washington (no service / v little to both). There's 10 buses to South Shields though or you can go to Sunderland either which isn't exactly much better. Sainsburys, Washington Galleries (can't get there). Buggar it I'll drive.

It's the same as Birtley, most people there will either shop at Team Valley or The Metro Centre but can you get to either of them, nope not without changes infact you can't get to really anywhere to the Metro Centre from the North or South bar the token X22 service.

Live in the West End want to go to the Metro Centre; that's a trip to Newcastle then back out. Speaking of that I was speaking to someone in the West End and they shopped at ASDA at Byker (which was like eh). But they said it's the only supermarket you can actually get to from the West Road / Elswick (bar Morrisons at Cowgate but it's small and has a limited range). Even known there's an ASDA at Metro Centre and Gosforth, Tesco Gateshead and Kingston Park, Morrisons Blaydon, M&S Kingston Park etc but none of them are accesible from there. Then they wonder why people drive.

Not to mention there's no bus service from the West End at all to Newcastle / Newburn Business Parks (an employment site), never mind struggling from South Shields.

(Tounge in cheek the 50 serves Nissan from most the places you said )

I think some of the examples you mention, really rams home how ineffective public transport can be in the region and no matter how funky and fancy the buses are - people won't use them if they can't get to the places they need to. 

I'm glad you mentioned the 50. I specifically used that example and the places too, referring to the variety of shifts on offer at the likes of Nissan or Tyne Dock.
The 50 may allow them to get to work if they're on a 9-5, Mon-Fri. There's mot much chance of them getting the 50 if they're on something like back shift, night shift or working on a Sunday.
If they can't use the 50 for thr majority of the shifts they're working - why bother at all?
You may as well make the investment and drive in, utilising the car for weekend trips to the shops (can't get a bus there either) and for days out too (why waste the day hanging around for connections?).