(05 Apr 2021, 2:59 pm)Andreos1 wrote Quite possibly Dan.
I've certainly never said or implied those things at all.

For clarity.
I feel there needs to be further differences between the X1/9/10/11, if tickets aren't valid for those who would use the 4, X1/9/10 ordinarily, but are hoping to utilise the X11. Particularly as there is a vehicle which is allocated to the X9/10/11, it shares a common brand, serves a number of common towns and has a relatively small driving rota. 

I feel that the opportunity to accept passengers intending for the 4, X1/9/10, should be taken. Particularly by an organisation who are set up to make money.
I'd hope the X11 was a success and was the start of network improvements and opening up new travel opportunities, but feel that with one arm behind its back, it will struggle. Particularly on those wet and windy days you have mentioned.

To supplement its revenue seems to be an obvious thing. Yet, this doesn't appear to be an option.
I don't think the numbers for those travelling locally, would make too much difference to those travelling the entire journey or result in people being left behind. 

I'd have hoped there were ticketing options for those wanting to spend more than a few hours in Whitby or Scarborough, maybe a night or two.

I do think the fare is reasonable for those travelling from Tyneside to Whitby or Scarborough, but that market is going to be small for a number of reasons. When you look at other factors, such as weather (like you have mentioned) - you can see how supplementing the revenue with additional passengers, not making the end to end journey, makes so much sense. 

Enthusiasts may understand the difference between the X11 and other routes, but ordinary passengers may not. 
Travelling by public transport needs to be attractive and it goes without saying that operators need to remove barriers. Operators or enthusiasts may or may not see or appreciate those barriers. Either way, the operators need to develop an understanding of the barriers that may exist and do something about removing them. However insignificant, small or subtle they may appear from 'inside'. 

I've carried out different analysis on the X11 project and there are obvious flaws that appear to have been overlooked or ignored by the commercial team. A shame as I do think there is a lot more potential with it. More than the 'use it or lose it', 'its clearly a different service' mentality which will inevitably hold back that potential.
If we don't see the return of the X11 next year, I'd genuinely hope there was some sort of detailed look in to why it failed. There will be external factors without a doubt. But by looking (all be it, reactively) at the internal factors, so much can and should be learned.

Hurrah! I'm glad you've finally acknowledged the point that has been continuously made regarding passenger loadings and the impact that the acceptance of standard 'local bus' tickets could have, even if you disagree.

I have already acknowledged the point on the vehicle branding, and the reasons for this. In normal circumstances, this service would have been allocated a coach, and been a part of the 'Northern Coaching' unit. This would be a good use for a coach which is otherwise confined to scholars duties during the week, and therefore naturally available on a weekend and during school holidays (unlike 6377, which would have been otherwise been the spare bus for services X9/X10 on Saturdays and during school holidays). Unfortunately we live in a world of social distancing at the moment, and, to ensure that there is sufficient capacity available to allow the service to cover its costs, a double-deck bus must be allocated. That double-deck bus has to be a newer bus, which has proven reliability. The 6-cylinder StreetDeck has proven itself as being more than capable on services X9/X10. Unfortunately Go North East can't justify painting a bus for an experimental seasonal service like this, and even if it was, you'd still have the same issue with it being sighted on services X9/X10 during the week, as it would still be intended to be the spare bus for those services during the week. All that said, there are differences between the X9/X10 and X11, with the latter serving different stops in Newcastle, Gateshead and Heworth. The destination displays will not reference Middlesbrough on the southbound journey to avoid confusion. What else would you do, if this was Andreos1's bus company, to differentiate the two (noting that the vehicle allocation is more or less set in stone this year, for the aforementioned reasons)?

Clearly you're a lone voice in that opinion with everyone else having echoed my comments regarding 'local travel' on the X11 service, but I can't help but feel your argument is flawed. In one breath you state that you 'don't think the numbers for those travelling locally would make too much difference' as they're so small in number, yet the main basis for your argument is that those passengers would supplement the revenue on the service. If, by your own admission, the numbers travelling locally would be so small, and wouldn't make a difference to the available capacity on-board, how on earth could it possibly make a notable difference to the sustainability of that route?

You make a good point regarding overnight stays in Whitby and Scarborough - particularly in Scarborough where there are holiday parks - and I would be surprised if this point had been 'overlooked' or 'ignored' by Go North East's commercial team. This would add a layer of risk, as it would become another unknown as to how many passengers would return from Scarborough. If, during the school holidays, families decide to head to Scarborough on a Friday for the weekend in a holiday park, and on the Sunday morning the bus is already full for the main target audience (the day-tripper market), how do those families on Sunday evening get back home? In a world of social distancing and reduced capacity on board buses, standees are sadly not permitted.

I can only echo the previous comment of this thread and the counter-argument being incredibly anal, over what is one return journey per day on a new service introduced to take advantage of the 'staycation' market, expected to be higher this year than previous due to the current travel restrictions. In my opinion your argument would have so much more substance if this service was something of a far greater frequency, but that's not the case.