Ashington, Blyth and Jesmond appear to be running dupes on selected routes today.

Ashington on at least the X21/22 and 35 cycle - potentially also on the 57 though it may just be a vehicle swap in the instance of 7529 appearing after the X20 peak.

Blyth on at least the 308, possibly also on the X7/8.

Jesmond on at least the 44/45/47 - possibly also the 553.

Bit all over the place in terms of tracking on Bustimes - some buses are quite happy to track in duplicate it seems, whereas others are tracking singularly and missing out alternate journeys (I assume whichever bus logs onto the journey first is tracked in that instance).

Darlington depot are doing dupes on certain town runs as well; not sure how there tracking

(15 Jun 2020, 10:44 am)Stuartphin1639 wrote Darlington depot are doing dupes on certain town runs as well; not sure how there tracking

Some of the Aycliffe runs have been too, spied a Solo following either a E400 on the 5 to Bishop or 1515 on the 8 to Darlington? and a Lite was seemingly shadowing the X21 towards Peterlee, observed whilst sat in Tesco's car park.

7401 on 63. Wonder how it avoided the low bridge on the route...

Edit. According to bustimes

(15 Jun 2020, 5:39 pm)S830OFT wrote 7401 on 63. Wonder how it avoided the low bridge on the route...

Is it actually on the 63, or is that just something from bustimes?

(15 Jun 2020, 5:49 pm)Dan wrote Is it actually on the 63, or is that just something from bustimes?

Incorrect fleet no. on the Ticketer, was changed to the correct one , 4717, this afternoon. 4720 was tracking as spare machine til this was also rectified.

2x 47 passing rvi this morning.together. both empty but heading to General hospital site where staff park. Single and double Decker

Looking at a couple of the timetables on the Arriva site today, it seems as though services will be returning to their pre-coronavirus levels from the 28th June

(18 Jun 2020, 4:04 pm)peter wrote Looking at a couple of the timetables on the Arriva site today, it seems as though services will be returning to their pre-coronavirus levels from the 28th June

I haven't seen them but unless they get some more buses from somewhere it could potentially cause problems at Blyth, Ashington and Jesmond because of the amount of routes ran by minibuses which need a capacity of more than 7 people (1, 2, 46, 51, 51A, 55, 57 and 57A) which have been ran by deckers and full size singles the past week or so.

I don't know the area but could imagine there could be similar problems at Durham and Darlington.

(18 Jun 2020, 4:53 pm)Storx wrote I haven't seen them but unless they get some more buses from somewhere it could potentially cause problems at Blyth, Ashington and Jesmond because of the amount of routes ran by minibuses which need a capacity of more than 7 people (1, 2, 46, 51, 51A, 55, 57 and 57A) which have been ran by deckers and full size singles the past week or so.

I don't know the area but could imagine there could be similar problems at Durham and Darlington.

Can't speak for Blyth and Jesmond as I don't know their routes as well, but Ashington could possibly swap some of the 35 and 57 allocations. As we've seen this week, continue with B7TLs on the 57s, and then the 35s with the higher frequency you can look at allocating deckers (7510) and full size singles (1579/80) then fill out with minibuses. 

Hopefully, however, the government relax social distancing to 1 metre which would almost double the capacity on buses. To be honest, as long as people are wearing masks, I don't see a huge problem with 2 people sitting on every row of seats as long as they're all front facing - especially with windows open (i.e one person far left, one person far right, empty aisle seats but people also on the row immediately behind).

Teesside and East Cleveland ‘COVID’-related changes from 28th June 2020 (all timetables on website)

5/5a: 5a reinstated on WEEKDAYS only.

7/7a: Weekday service increased to every 15 minutes. Saturday remains every 20

8: Weekday service increased to every 10 minutes. Saturday remains every 20

9: Weekday service increased to every 20 minutes. Saturday remains every 30

15: Weekday service increased back to normal frequency of every 10 minutes on the core. Saturday remains every 15

17/17a: Weekday service back to normal frequency (half hourly on each route). Saturdays remain as now (hourly 17a, twice hourly 17)

28/28a: Weekday service back to normal hourly on both routes (28 now serving Farndale Drive in Guisborough in place of the 81). Saturdays remains as now - combined hourly service.

29: Back to half hourly weekdays. Saturdays remain hourly

63: Evening journeys reduced to hourly

X22: Increased to hourly between Middlesbrough and North Tees Hospital Monday to Saturday.

X66/X67: Back to normal weekday timetable Monday to Friday. Saturday remains hourly on each route.

(18 Jun 2020, 8:40 pm)mb134 wrote Can't speak for Blyth and Jesmond as I don't know their routes as well, but Ashington could possibly swap some of the 35 and 57 allocations. As we've seen this week, continue with B7TLs on the 57s, and then the 35s with the higher frequency you can look at allocating deckers (7510) and full size singles (1579/80) then fill out with minibuses. 

Hopefully, however, the government relax social distancing to 1 metre which would almost double the capacity on buses. To be honest, as long as people are wearing masks, I don't see a huge problem with 2 people sitting on every row of seats as long as they're all front facing - especially with windows open (i.e one person far left, one person far right, empty aisle seats but people also on the row immediately behind).

I don't know the fleet at Ashington but will they have enough buses to do that. I know 1579/80 are regularly on the 57 usually anyway (guessing minis off the road).

Moving forward out of the current situation, how are Arriva going to adapt?

As I was driving to work the other day, I seen an ex London "MAX" B7TL broken down at Brunton Park on the X10.

I know I'm probably going to get shot down saying this but I do think that once social distancing measures are a thing of the past, maybe now is the time that Arriva need to scale back their operations and run as a leaner and fitter outfit focusing on quality over quantity.

They do some things better than GNE (local routes) but for their key services, they need to start seriously investing and doing things properly.

For Jesmomd, Blyth and Ashington, they could easily reduce the PVR by 11 vehicles.

51/51A & 306 & 308 (PVR reduced by 4) :
- As previously suggested in suggestion thread.

X9/X10/X11 (PVR reduced by 4) :
- X10 & X11 reduced to every 30 minutes each.
- X9/X10/X11 re-timed to form an up to every 10 minute service from Blyth, Cramlington Shops, Regent Centre, Gosforth and Newcastle. Blyth frequency split would be 9-11-10 and Cramlington Shops 8-12-10.
- X7 & X8 go back to previous arrangements with PVR 10.

X21/X22 (PVR reduced by 3):
- X21 & X22 reduced to every 30 minutes each.
- X21 reduced to hourly between Ashington & Newbiggin with Newbiggin runs interworking with service X19.
- X19 as previously suggested introduced.

(19 Jun 2020, 10:48 pm)L469 YVK wrote Moving forward out of the current situation, how are Arriva going to adapt?

As I was driving to work the other day, I seen an ex London "MAX" B7TL broken down at Brunton Park on the X10.

I know I'm probably going to get shot down saying this but I do think that once social distancing measures are a thing of the past, maybe now is the time that Arriva need to scale back their operations and run as a leaner and fitter outfit focusing on quality over quantity.

They do some things better than GNE (local routes) but for their key services, they need to start seriously investing and doing things properly.

For Jesmomd, Blyth and Ashington, they could easily reduce the PVR by 11 vehicles.

51/51A & 306 & 308 (PVR reduced by 4) :
- As previously suggested in suggestion thread.

X9/X10/X11 (PVR reduced by 4) :
- X10 & X11 reduced to every 30 minutes each.
- X9/X10/X11 re-timed to form an up to every 10 minute service from Blyth, Cramlington Shops, Regent Centre, Gosforth and Newcastle. Blyth frequency split would be 9-11-10 and Cramlington Shops 8-12-10.
- X7 & X8 go back to previous arrangements with PVR 10.

X21/X22 (PVR reduced by 3):
- X21 & X22 reduced to every 30 minutes each.
- X21 reduced to hourly between Ashington & Newbiggin with Newbiggin runs interworking with service X19.
- X19 as previously suggested introduced.

I personally don't see what the issue is with Arriva Northumbria's express network personally quality wise. Just because they're not painted bright pink with some stupid tagline on the side doesn't make them worse. I'd personally take Arriva's Gemini's anyday over any Streetdeck / Streetlite or Enviro, they're just a much better quality product without rattles everywhere even known they're 11 year old now.

I can also guarentee (any normal person) would find frequency a hell of a lot more important than the buses used. Decreasing a bus from 20 minutes to 30 minutes can make a hell of lot of a difference to someones commute for example if the buses are currently 05, 25, 45; that person may get a bus at 05 minutes past which gets them in just in time for work with the reduction they make choose to go for 15, 45; the hour for buses which increases their commute by an additional 20 minutes every day; enough to make them move to another type of travel.

Wifi, USB charger, Gold bus handles and whatever stuff you could think of won't overcome the extra 20 minute commute, especially if it occurs in both directions. The majority of the X10/X11 passengers come from beyond Cramlington or are travelling to Cramlington from those points.

If you really must play around with reducing the PVR there's other bus routes you could mess around with better than those ones.

43 - Do you really need 4 buses an hour there plus the 8 buses express?
46 - Merge it with one of 43/44/45?
55 - Does it need to be every 15 minutes with mini buses?
47 - Could you run it with something else ie. 52 then have a connection to Freeman on same service?
X8 - Could you make it quicker for those from Cowpen etc to Newcastle?
306 Whitley -> Tynemouth - Move this to the 57 and give Tynemouth etc a link to the new hospital and at the same time give SE Northumberland a link to the beaches and Monkseaton a link to Tynemouth Morrisons?

(19 Jun 2020, 4:33 pm)Storx wrote I don't know the fleet at Ashington but will they have enough buses to do that. I know 1579/80 are regularly on the 57 usually anyway (guessing minis off the road).

Generally the 35 allocation (pre-Corona) was: 7445/6/84/6 and 7510. (Streetlites branded but were generally filling in for Scanias on the X14).

The 57 allocation should have been four from: 2809/12/13 and 1800/1. 

If the Scanias sort themselves out, then you'd have the two Streetlites available for the 35 as well as 7510. You'd then need two from the minibus pool to put onto the quieter boards. Not ideal, but with the 57 being quite busy through this period then it's certainly a solution to an inevitable problem (until the social distancing is reduced). 


On a separate note - it's baffled me that Arriva Durham County are running dupes with single deckers and minibuses, yet still have some of their older deckers parked up (7416/24/55/6/93), and all of the Scanias. Seems completely backward - keeping the highest capacity vehicles off the road and running dupes with vehicles that even combined sometimes don't reach a deckers capacity. Obviously on the contrary, Northumbria are using deckers at will (Ashington, Blyth and Jesmond all have most, if not all, of their older stock out - with Jesmond seemingly only holding back their Omnicities and Ashington only holding back 4659 thus far).

(20 Jun 2020, 10:41 am)Storx wrote I personally don't see what the issue is with Arriva Northumbria's express network personally quality wise. Just because they're not painted bright pink with some stupid tagline on the side doesn't make them worse. I'd personally take Arriva's Gemini's anyday over any Streetdeck / Streetlite or Enviro, they're just a much better quality product without rattles everywhere even known they're 11 year old now.

I'd absolutely agree with this. The Arriva Northumbria expresses have worked very well for the best part of a decade - note how few alterations there have been to the X10/11 and X21/22 since they settled into this form. The odd timetable alteration here and there but generally they've been unchanged and that shows with the passenger numbers. People like reliable, frequent and easy to understand services - for the most part those 4 routes fit that bill perfectly. 

Cutting service frequency on any of them, particularly as they've done a good job of getting both commuters and leisure users, would be hugely detrimental. Pre-Corona, the Ashington expresses were as busy on a Saturday going into town as they were on a weekday peak - and even through the day on weekdays you had quite a lot of traffic between Newbiggin/Ashington/Bedlington and a few folk going all the way to town. My limited experience on the Blyth ones told the same story - if anything they were even busier M-F daytime.

(20 Jun 2020, 10:59 am)mb134 wrote I'd absolutely agree with this. The Arriva Northumbria expresses have worked very well for the best part of a decade - note how few alterations there have been to the X10/11 and X21/22 since they settled into this form. The odd timetable alteration here and there but generally they've been unchanged and that shows with the passenger numbers. People like reliable, frequent and easy to understand services - for the most part those 4 routes fit that bill perfectly. 

Cutting service frequency on any of them, particularly as they've done a good job of getting both commuters and leisure users, would be hugely detrimental. Pre-Corona, the Ashington expresses were as busy on a Saturday going into town as they were on a weekday peak - and even through the day on weekdays you had quite a lot of traffic between Newbiggin/Ashington/Bedlington and a few folk going all the way to town. My limited experience on the Blyth ones told the same story - if anything they were even busier M-F daytime.

Yeah it's definitely the same with the Blyth expresses, the only two areas where people tend to moan about is the fact the X8 is way too slow from Cowpen estate since it goes via everywhere now and Beacon Hill in Cramlington has a quite early last bus out of Newcastle.

It's definitely the same with the freqency though, personally I'd say they're some of the best routes in the North East. God help going back to the day of extended 41's etc to Blyth which didn't work at all which we had before the eventual settling of only the X10 and X11 and the X7 and X8 going via Gosforth and the Freeman which didn't go down well at all hence the removal. Some other bus companies really need to learn that having a stable bus network is better than changing it every other week, *cough Sunderland and North Tyneside*.

(20 Jun 2020, 4:10 pm)Storx wrote Yeah it's definitely the same with the Blyth expresses, the only two areas where people tend to moan about is the fact the X8 is way too slow from Cowpen estate since it goes via everywhere now and Beacon Hill in Cramlington has a quite early last bus out of Newcastle.

It's definitely the same with the freqency though, personally I'd say they're some of the best routes in the North East. God help going back to the day of extended 41's etc to Blyth which didn't work at all which we had before the eventual settling of only the X10 and X11 and the X7 and X8 going via Gosforth and the Freeman which didn't go down well at all hence the removal. Some other bus companies really need to learn that having a stable bus network is better than changing it every other week, *cough Sunderland and North Tyneside*.

It's not so much about changing the bus network but rather "streamlining" it.

To be fair, there's nothing in the current form that needs to change in terms of routes. But in terms of frequencies and passengers vs demand, Arriva are going to need to adjust accordingly on some of their core routes.

Passenger numbers post social distancing will likely reduce to some extent, hopefully not too much. But Arriva can't keep running around using the bare minimum in terms of vehicle quality. They need to start doing things properly. Having the correct vehicles for the correct PVR and suitable spares available (and NOT an ex-London boneshaker tarted up in MAX branding & spec).

(20 Jun 2020, 7:41 pm)L469 YVK wrote It's not so much about changing the bus network but rather "streamlining" it.

To be fair, there's nothing in the current form that needs to change in terms of routes. But in terms of frequencies and passengers vs demand, Arriva are going to need to adjust accordingly on some of their core routes.

Passenger numbers post social distancing will likely reduce to some extent, hopefully not too much. But Arriva can't keep running around using the bare minimum in terms of vehicle quality. They need to start doing things properly. Having the correct vehicles for the correct PVR and suitable spares available (and NOT an ex-London boneshaker tarted up in MAX branding & spec).

I'm not sure "bare minimum" is fair. In Northumbria in particular, each express route has either seen refurbs or brand new vehicles in the last 6 years. I also can't think of an instance where vehicle availability doesn't match/exceed PVR - unless there is a VOR surplus. 

Arriva's business model is, and always has been, to invest in waves - while enthusiasts and GNE fans don't like it it's clearly successful, otherwise there'd be no Arriva. They spend money where and when required, arguably therefore allowing slightly higher frequencies than would otherwise be possible. 

Equally, those "boneshakers" you describe - not a huge issue imo. I had to pop through to Cramlington the other day and was treated to the 18.5 year old 7484. While top speed was an issue, acceleration was smooth (gear changes next to unnoticeable), there were virtually no rattles and the brakes weren't too harsh or noisy. Inside it was fairly nice and airy, seat moquette was clean and appealing - and for Civic V2s they were pretty comfortable. I've had far worse trips on newer E400s and Streetdecks - with the ride quality of 7484 being light-years ahead of a Streetlite. The MAX B7 refurbs also allow for route upgrades where new/newer stock simply isn't justifiable - don't forget that for things like the X20 it's a route (largely) dominated by concession travel. 

While, bar Sapphire, Arriva have never had a huge push to drive people onto buses because of fancy specs - they have recognised that WiFi is now accepted as a standard and majority of their vehicles now have it. Instead they seem to push frequency and fares - and for the most part this is where they do very well. People want frequent, reliable and good value buses - by and large that's what Arriva give you.

(20 Jun 2020, 7:41 pm)L469 YVK wrote It's not so much about changing the bus network but rather "streamlining" it.

To be fair, there's nothing in the current form that needs to change in terms of routes. But in terms of frequencies and passengers vs demand, Arriva are going to need to adjust accordingly on some of their core routes.

Passenger numbers post social distancing will likely reduce to some extent, hopefully not too much. But Arriva can't keep running around using the bare minimum in terms of vehicle quality. They need to start doing things properly. Having the correct vehicles for the correct PVR and suitable spares available (and NOT an ex-London boneshaker tarted up in MAX branding & spec).

That's not streamlining though, streamlining is where you merge bus routes and remove duplicate bus routes in the same area service similar or the same purpose. It's just reducing the frequency. The Blyth expresses have ran at similar frequencies but as different disguises for the same or similar frequencies for years now without being subsidised at all. There's other routes you'd target before those.

For the record when it comes to frequencies it's
X7/X8 - Every 15 Minutes
X9 - Every 30 Minutes
X10/X11 - Every 10 Minutes

You can't combine the X9 with the X10 and X11 as they're 2 different bus routes like you did above.

Arriva have suitable spares usually for the network however they're 1493, 1497, 1501-1505. However they've chosen that it's better to have an older decker on rather than a single with limited capacity.

Also I'd rather be on a ex. London 'boneshaker' than have my bus timetable reduced, not everyone is obsessed by fancy branding and useless features. There's no point having newer buses sitting around in a depot being unused and they're not bad buses even given their age. They're not the only operator who do it up here who have ex. Brighton deckers instead.

(20 Jun 2020, 8:29 pm)Storx wrote That's not streamlining though, streamlining is where you merge bus routes and remove duplicate bus routes in the same area service similar or the same purpose. It's just reducing the frequency. The Blyth expresses have ran at similar frequencies but as different disguises for the same or similar frequencies for years now without being subsidised at all. There's other routes you'd target before those.

For the record when it comes to frequencies it's
X7/X8 - Every 15 Minutes
X9 - Every 30 Minutes
X10/X11 - Every 10 Minutes

You can't combine the X9 with the X10 and X11 as they're 2 different bus routes like you did above.

Arriva have suitable spares usually for the network however they're 1493, 1497, 1501-1505. However they've chosen that it's better to have an older decker on rather than a single with limited capacity.

Also I'd rather be on a ex. London 'boneshaker' than have my bus timetable reduced, not everyone is obsessed by fancy branding and useless features. There's no point having newer buses sitting around in a depot being unused and they're not bad buses even given their age. They're not the only operator who do it up here who have ex. Brighton deckers instead.

But if an OmniDekka turned up on lets say the X30 (if Consett still have any), at least you'd know that you were on an old bus rather than being disguised as X-Lines.

But at least GoNE are doing the right thing with the X30 by diverting 1x of the X1 batch to Consett to make up the new PVR of 4 allowing a dedicated spare.

Regarding the X9 / X10 / X11, the journey times are very similar between Blyth and Newcastle and they both have a middle common point in Cramlington. Surely it would make sense given the times we're in to streamline.

Looking at Newsham Black Diamond, the X10 & X11 run on a 16-4 split (20 min freq each). If anything, reducing the frequency to every 30 minutes each would create a more evenly distributed service.

If better times do come back again, a "super-fast" express like ANE's X30 running all day would be a good option.

(21 Jun 2020, 6:37 am)L469 YVK wrote But if an OmniDekka turned up on lets say the X30 (if Consett still have any), at least you'd know that you were on an old bus rather than being disguised as X-Lines.

But at least GoNE are doing the right thing with the X30 by diverting 1x of the X1 batch to Consett to make up the new PVR of 4 allowing a dedicated spare.

Regarding the X9 / X10 / X11, the journey times are very similar between Blyth and Newcastle and they both have a middle common point in Cramlington. Surely it would make sense given the times we're in to streamline.

Looking at Newsham Black Diamond, the X10 & X11 run on a 16-4 split (20 min freq each). If anything, reducing the frequency to every 30 minutes each would create a more evenly distributed service.

If better times do come back again, a "super-fast" express like ANE's X30 running all day would be a good option.

They do have enough buses for it though?

27 MAX - 21 Gemini / 6 Pulsar

X10 / X11 - PVR 12
X7 / X8 - PVR 10
X9 - PVR 4

Total 26 Buses (1 Spare) same as your beloved GNE at Consett. Then there's an extra Gemini from the 308 if needed aswell. The only reason reason the older buses end up on the expresses is because they swap things around at Blyth to get things back on time and add extra buses in rather than just cancelling them outright or short like other companies.

You can't possibly tag the X9 and X10/11 together they're not the same route at all. Okay they serve 4 bus stops which are the same on the whole hour journey but that's not a valid reason. It's false economy and would just confuse people. Very few people will travel from Blyth to Cramlington to Newcastle there's no reason to. It's about the estates inbetween to Blyth, Cramlington or Newcastle. Like I said it's also not streamlining it's cutting frequency.

21 - 9 frequency is worse aswell btw. You've reduced an ex 10 minute service to double that time if you hit it at the wrong time.

There's no reason to change the expresses, in particular cutting frequencies, it's probably their most profitable area in the N. East, Teeside and Darlington would get decimated before they even consider touching up here.

(19 Jun 2020, 2:26 pm)Kuyoyo wrote X22: Increased to hourly between Middlesbrough and North Tees Hospital Monday to Saturday.

Same with X21, increased to hourly between Darlington and Newton Aycliffe although sadly still lining up with the X22 times meaning it's still providing an unbalanced timetable between Darlington and Aycliffe as it's been running at the exact same times as service 8 to/from Darlington [emoji849]

X21 aside, Darlington is more or less back to the usual levels of service during weekday daytimes but still COVID-19 frequencies on a Saturday.

7 is removed from Durham Gate except at weekday peak times as previously planned and will now only extend to Framwellgate Moor on weekday mornings in term time

(21 Jun 2020, 11:07 am)Jimmi wrote Same with X21, increased to hourly between Darlington and Newton Aycliffe although sadly still lining up with the X22 times meaning it's still providing an unbalanced timetable between Darlington and Aycliffe as it's been running at the exact same times as service 8 to/from Darlington [emoji849]

X21 aside, Darlington is more or less back to the usual levels of service during weekday daytimes but still COVID-19 frequencies on a Saturday.

7 is removed from Durham Gate except at weekday peak times as previously planned and will now only extend to Framwellgate Moor on weekday mornings in term time

I'd expect weekend service levels to be increased next month. Buses are starting to get busier and social distancing can't be maintained on the existing frequencies of lesser timetables.

Blyth have cut the rota line numbers by 10% going forward long term by the looks of it, mainly due to reduced frequency of all services on Saturdays and X8/9 through the week apart from peak times. No better time to bring it in and fairly sensible changes as well, not something you can say often for Arriva.

(21 Jun 2020, 10:14 am)Storx wrote They do have enough buses for it though?

27 MAX - 21 Gemini / 6 Pulsar

X10 / X11 - PVR 12
X7 / X8 - PVR 10
X9 - PVR 4

Total 26 Buses (1 Spare) same as your beloved GNE at Consett. Then there's an extra Gemini from the 308 if needed aswell. The only reason reason the older buses end up on the expresses is because they swap things around at Blyth to get things back on time and add extra buses in rather than just cancelling them outright or short like other companies.

You can't possibly tag the X9 and X10/11 together they're not the same route at all. Okay they serve 4 bus stops which are the same on the whole hour journey but that's not a valid reason. It's false economy and would just confuse people. Very few people will travel from Blyth to Cramlington to Newcastle there's no reason to. It's about the estates inbetween to Blyth, Cramlington or Newcastle. Like I said it's also not streamlining it's cutting frequency.

21 - 9 frequency is worse aswell btw. You've reduced an ex 10 minute service to double that time if you hit it at the wrong time.

There's no reason to change the expresses, in particular cutting frequencies, it's probably their most profitable area in the N. East, Teeside and Darlington would get decimated before they even consider touching up here.

Newsham would be 14/16. Cramlington would be 8/12/10 and Blyth would be 9/11/10.

Arriva are going to have to go forward as a more leaner outfit despite historical standpoints. They had to do that in 2010 and again in 2012.

The same argument could've been said about the X21 & X22 back in 2012 despite the original routes being different to an extent. Whilst the changes were controversial and p***ed some people off, they did their job and simplified things.

(21 Jun 2020, 3:11 pm)L469 YVK wrote Newsham would be 14/16. Cramlington would be 8/12/10 and Blyth would be 9/11/10.

Arriva are going to have to go forward as a more leaner outfit despite historical standpoints. They had to do that in 2010 and again in 2012.

The same argument could've been said about the X21 & X22 back in 2012 despite the original routes being different to an extent. Whilst the changes were controversial and p***ed some people off, they did their job and simplified things.

I'm guessing we're going to have to agree to disagree here and see what happens. We both have very different opinions of the future and I can't see it being too significant in the long term not until at least the Northumberland line is opened (if it ever is).

There's other areas that imo would go before the Blyth expresses.

(21 Jun 2020, 4:12 pm)Storx wrote I'm guessing we're going to have to agree to disagree here and see what happens. We both have very different opinions of the future and I can't see it being too significant in the long term not until at least the Northumberland line is opened (if it ever is).

There's other areas that imo would go before the Blyth expresses.

I agree where you're coming from in terms of changing something that's familiar. Arriva do very well with their local routes such as the 51/51A/57/57A/1/2

But in terms of their core routes, a PVR decrease of 11 vehicles whilst only slightly cutting services is a very significant saving and would allow Arriva to operate more sustainably. No routes would be changed as such in terms of the route that they take.

If Arriva were to order vehicles with the X10 & X11 in their current form plus the 308, that would be 23x vehicles (excl spares). That's not taking into account the 306 & X9.

If Arriva were to however order vehicles for the X9/X10/X11 & 306/308 in the future, then 26x vehicles (excl spares) would be needed but...................that's still 9x less than what would be required with services in their current form.

If they ordered spares, 2x at Blyth covering a PVR of 19x and 1x at Jesmond covering PVR of 7x. That still leaves Arriva with 6x less vehicles required even with a suitable spare ratio taken into account. In turn, that would significantly reduce associated costs and improve reliability in terms of vehicle uptime.

(21 Jun 2020, 4:37 pm)L469 YVK wrote I agree where you're coming from in terms of changing something that's familiar. Arriva do very well with their local routes such as the 51/51A/57/57A/1/2

But in terms of their core routes, a PVR decrease of 11 vehicles whilst only slightly cutting services is a very significant saving and would allow Arriva to operate more sustainably. No routes would be changed as such in terms of the route that they take.

If Arriva were to order vehicles with the X10 & X11 in their current form plus the 308, that would be 23x vehicles (excl spares). That's not taking into account the 306 & X9.

If Arriva were to however order vehicles for the X9/X10/X11 & 306/308 in the future, then 26x vehicles (excl spares) would be needed but...................that's still 9x less than what would be required with services in their current form.

If they ordered spares, 2x at Blyth covering a PVR of 19x and 1x at Jesmond covering PVR of 7x. That still leaves Arriva with 6x less vehicles required even with a suitable spare ratio taken into account. In turn, that would significantly reduce associated costs and improve reliability in terms of vehicle uptime.

The thing is though if you did a bit of jiggling around you could keep similar service levels (or even improved) but keep the same reduction your wanting.

The X8 and X9 are by far the weakest two expresses out the lot and I'd work on trying to get arid of them or improving them.

So my idea would be this:

X7 - Increased to every 20 minutes and serves Amersham Drive, PVR 7 (Singles) (+3) - Gives the Cobalt Clipper a real competition and also replaces the X8 which is changed below from Burradon to Newcastle. Improved service in Seaton Valley aswell.
X8 - Renumbered X9 Below, Northern Section Only (-6)
X9 - Current X9 removed or replaced by 43 and 52. New X9 is current X10 from Cramlington -> Parkside then current X8 route PVR 4 (DD) (0) - Creates quicker links from Cowpen and Northern Blyth to Newcastle and keeps 10 Minute service between Cramlington and Parkside. Doesn't serve Swaledale Avenue and runs direct Tynedale Avenue.
X10 - Every 30 Mins (Works with X9 / X11) - No Changes, Northern Section complemented with X9 (X8) - PVR 4 (DD) (-2)
X11 - Every 30 Mins (Works with X9 / X11) - No Changes - PVR 4 (DD) (-2)
43/43A - Same as current Newcastle -> Seaton Burn where splits as below. - PVR 8 (DD) (+1)
43 Every 30 Mins - Continues current route to Dudley where travels along Fern Drive and does current X8 route to Cramlington - Restores bus from Fern Drive to NCL and utilises better use of buses which is already covered by X10/X11, 52 and 53.
43A Every 30 Mins heads towards Seaton R'bout and does current X9 bus route to Cramlington. - Removes the worst running express and give an evening service (currently ends at 7pm) by making more profit on the Southern section.
52 - Extended to Blyth hourly on X9 route (+1) (Single) Keeps link along A1061 in Blyth and gives new link from Blyth to Freeman to replace X9.
53 - Extended to Morpeth hourly (+1) (Single)

PVR Changes
-----------------
X7 (+3) (DD -> Single)
X8 (-4)
X9 (0) (Single -> DD)
X10 (-2) (DD)
X11 (-2) (DD)
43 (+1) (DD)
52 (+1) (Single)
53 (+1) (Single)

New: 20 DD, 17 Singles (37 Total)
Old: 28 DD, 12 Singles (40 Total)

Your creating better links to places and removing the worst serving express services hence they're only hourly currently or with the case of the X8 giving a quicker service which could push more people to use it and by improving the customer base by linking it in with other buses that serve the same area with Parkside in Cramlington. Also by using more singles than currently your saving costs when purchasing new buses rather than purchasing more deckers. This is real streamlining as your utilising the 43 which is a bit of a waste currently.

(21 Jun 2020, 10:32 pm)Storx wrote The thing is though if you did a bit of jiggling around you could keep similar service levels (or even improved) but keep the same reduction your wanting.

The X8 and X9 are by far the weakest two expresses out the lot and I'd work on trying to get arid of them or improving them.

So my idea would be this:

X7 - Increased to every 20 minutes and serves Amersham Drive, PVR 7 (Singles) (+3) - Gives the Cobalt Clipper a real competition and also replaces the X8 which is changed below from Burradon to Newcastle. Improved service in Seaton Valley aswell.
X8 - Renumbered X9 Below, Northern Section Only (-6)
X9 - Current X9 removed or replaced by 43 and 52. New X9 is current X10 from Cramlington -> Parkside then current X8 route PVR 4 (DD) (0) - Creates quicker links from Cowpen and Northern Blyth to Newcastle and keeps 10 Minute service between Cramlington and Parkside. Doesn't serve Swaledale Avenue and runs direct Tynedale Avenue.
X10 - Every 30 Mins (Works with X9 / X11) - No Changes, Northern Section complemented with X9 (X8) - PVR 4 (DD) (-2)
X11 - Every 30 Mins (Works with X9 / X11) - No Changes - PVR 4 (DD) (-2)
43/43A - Same as current Newcastle -> Seaton Burn where splits as below. - PVR 8 (DD) (+1)
43 Every 30 Mins - Continues current route to Dudley where travels along Fern Drive and does current X8 route to Cramlington - Restores bus from Fern Drive to NCL and utilises better use of buses which is already covered by X10/X11, 52 and 53.
43A Every 30 Mins heads towards Seaton R'bout and does current X9 bus route to Cramlington. - Removes the worst running express and give an evening service (currently ends at 7pm) by making more profit on the Southern section.
52 - Extended to Blyth hourly on X9 route (+1) (Single) Keeps link along A1061 in Blyth and gives new link from Blyth to Freeman to replace X9.
53 - Extended to Morpeth hourly (+1) (Single)

PVR Changes
-----------------
X7 (+3) (DD -> Single)
X8 (-4)
X9 (0) (Single -> DD)
X10 (-2) (DD)
X11 (-2) (DD)
43 (+1) (DD)
52 (+1) (Single)
53 (+1) (Single)

New: 20 DD, 17 Singles (37 Total)
Old: 28 DD, 12 Singles (40 Total)

Your creating better links to places and removing the worst serving express services hence they're only hourly currently or with the case of the X8 giving a quicker service which could push more people to use it and by improving the customer base by linking it in with other buses that serve the same area with Parkside in Cramlington. Also by using more singles than currently your saving costs when purchasing new buses rather than purchasing more deckers. This is real streamlining as your utilising the 43 which is a bit of a waste currently.

You know what it is? Although I would change some parts to it, I actually agree to a large extent. You've sorted 2x "problem" routes (X8 & X9).

I'm going to have a play around during my spare time and see what I can come up with based on that. Not exactly in that form but close if you know what I mean. And will of course post in the suggestions thread.