(23 Jan 2022, 4:04 pm)N1cholas wrote If you had been at the Galleries for 20 mins you would have noticed not only the posters on the timetable boards but nexus changed all the liners on the boards to show the correct timetables (sunday times on a saturday) so if you didnt notice this then you did not look very well

Or perhaps they aren't large or prominent enough to be noticed...?

I walked past three stands and stood half way down a long queue at the fourth and didn't see any whilst stood there, but more to the point, if I was any customer selected at random, with no knowledge of Sunday timetables being in place, why would I go looking for the information?

(23 Jan 2022, 3:37 pm)Adrian wrote [*]The X1 is too busy for a half-hourly service on a Saturday and there isn't sufficient room at the Galleries to manage the queue.

[*]I have been on the X1 on a Saturday the last 2 weeks, and the queue has been massive, but i heard someone say they waited over 1 hour for the bus, bearing in mind my bus was over 20 mins late. 

Tbh, most people don't even get on the bus when in the queue untill atleast one has been and gone which is at a minimum around 35 mins. Infact they are probs not been able to board 2 X1's due to how busy they have been before the galleries.

(23 Jan 2022, 7:56 am)Dan wrote I was at Park Lane yesterday morning around 11am and there was a Go North East bus station supervisor present as well as a Nexus bus station supervisor - not sure if both were on their breaks at the time 54APhotography was at Park Lane or dealing with something else in the bus station, but both were definitely present. Additional supervisors employed by Go North East have been in place at all major bus stations now for a couple of months, in order to provide additional support and guidance, to both customers and the driving team.

(23 Jan 2022, 9:50 am)54APhotography wrote There was no carnage being alluded to Dan, I stated exactly what I saw taking two autistic relatives to the Galleries on a 2. The elderly people were waiting at the 2 stop, the furthest away from the entrance, they said nobody was around to ask, nobody told them about the service reduction and they didn't use phones ,like the youngsters. They were full of hell. And you should know the way old folk chatter, all of them were angry and were told why, told what time their bus would be . I didn't have to do that , but found it preferable to a journey with half a bus full of people slagging off the bus company.
Otherwise my only comment was the one to which you agreed - that Streetlites should have been allocated to the 39.

When going to work yesterday I ended up being late due to the 39A being full at Vine Place, and 3 passengers including myself were told we couldn't get on. Bearing in mind the driver stopped at Borough Rd to let more passengers on. There was like 10 or so mins to wait for the 2 (luckily I was going to Ryhope Street so I could get the 2/2A and walk down towards Ryhope Village), so I decided to walk to Borough Rd (because of the cold) and when at the lights to cross over Fawcett st, the 39A pulled away from the stop. I literally was soo annoyed as there was definitely standing room for more than 3 people and for longer than 1 stop. Solos should not be on the 39/39A anyways especially not in these sunday times pa larva (i know it is better than no service but why should it come down to that?)

Whether or not streetlites were supposed to be allocated they weren't.

(23 Jan 2022, 3:37 pm)Adrian wrote We can talk about cost vs benefit, and whilst I'd agree it regularly comes down to this in business, we shouldn't dismiss obligations that a business has. We know that younger people prefer to use the Internet, Social Media or Apps to communicate, but face-to-face and telephone contact is especially important to the over-70s and to people with impairments. Age UK reported recently that there's still 70% of the over-70s that don't have or use a smartphone. Does a business not have an obligation to remain accessible to these people, especially when operating in an emergency or business continuity situation? 

I'd stand by the comment that customers are being left hung out to dry at present, but that's not to say the situation couldn't be vastly improved. There's one hell of a challenge ahead for operators to rebuild confidence in public transport.

Aside from that, a few observations from when I was out yesterday. Generally speaking, I won't use buses on a Sunday, unless I'm doing something specifically. The timings don't work for me, I'm not a fan of standing round waiting for ages and I begrudge paying the same fee for 1/3 of the service.

• Sunday timetables just aren't suitable for a normal day's service. There's too many peaks, whether it be commuters (if a Sunday timetable even gets you into work on time!), people heading out for football matches, people heading out on the drink or whatever else. 
  
• Every bus I used yesterday was busy, with most seats visible to my eye having been in use. 
  
• I'm still noticing that there is wide-spread hesitation from customers about sitting directly next to a stranger and especially rear-facing to someone. Less so with OAPs, most of whom would consider murder to get in that front row seat at the best of times.
  
• I was surprised at the amount of passengers on an X10 to Newcastle, with the queue at Newgate Street for the return trip down to the zebra crossing, then taking a good 10 minutes to board everyone. Not bad for a service on the ropes.
  
• The X1 is too busy for a half-hourly service on a Saturday and there isn't sufficient room at the Galleries to manage the queue.
  

Was it just me but the App wasn't even working properly so everyone is screwed really. My bus (on weekday & Saturday times) said it was due in 43 mins so I left to get the metro and ended up walking as it was too cold to wait in a metro station. When approaching my stop I looked at the App and the 39A wasn't tracking but buses regularly don't track but still turn up. So I waited for the next 39A which was full mentioned above...

---

I am sick of hearing negativity about the bus industry as i'm sure you all are but I literally cannot remember a time where people used to slag Stagecoach and Arriva off to this extent, enthusiasts and public alike (besides the metro, that is a different kettle of fish haha). Believe me the general public have noticed as I was on a 35A the other day and heard a group of people saying how the only got this bus because it turned up, they would normally get either stagecoach or a taxi. Now that is saying something. Just shows that fancy mod cons like WiFi, charging, paint jobs don't make a route more profitable they just are additions for the people that use the service.

(23 Jan 2022, 10:28 am)Dan wrote The truth of the matter however was that there probably was someone around to ask - as I mentioned in my previous post both Nexus and Go North East had supervisors in the interchange, but they tend to be closer to Greggs in between 'walkarounds'. In my experience there tends to be at least one driver on the 'ABC' side of the interchange waiting to relieve an incoming 60/61/62/X6 (especially as the latter two are on Saturday timetables), who would have also been nearby to ask.

If the posters are still up (there's no reason why they would have been taken down), then in print at each stand there's something that tells customers to use the Sunday timetable, which is of course at every stand on the liner.

The point I'm making is that there are options - for people in Park Lane at least - to gain access to the information. There is room for improvement:

• the digital displays could be updated to show Sunday times on a Saturday - but this is an infrastructure issue outside of the operators' control
  
• Customer Services could be open to take phone calls for those customers who do not feel confident enough to use a digital method (website/app), a print method (the bus stop liner), or to ask someone on-site.
  

As we've discussed on many occasions in the past, it comes down to a cost vs benefit situation. Presumably staffing levels in GNE's customer services team decreased when opening hours reduced at the start of the pandemic, making it more difficult to cover weekends without reliance on overtime. Presumably digital displays could be updated, but it would cost a lot of time for local authorities, when, as we know, the situation is changing very regularly for all three operators, with dates often not aligned to each other.

With regards to the negative chitter-chatter - it's commendable you helped those customers - but you'll never completely get away from this. Last weekend I went to Toby Carvery at Barnes Park for breakfast. On arrival, I discovered that they were closed due to staff shortages. There had been posts the previous weekend on social media to advise customers, and there have been posts since. For me, there was no forewarning, and no explanation. I'm not oblivious to the staff shortages being faced in all sectors currently, but I was quite annoyed because it was time and money wasted. I even told a few friends about it (negative chitter-chatter!) I think I have said it previously but the bus industry seems to be facing more criticsm than other sectors who are going through the exact same thing, although this is probably down to there being a reliance on the bus as a public service.

I suspect that those pensioners I wrote about probably were avoided by anyone over that side of the Interchange, mind they do tend to bark on to each other but then when I intervened and told them why, including reprimanding them for wearing masks over their mouths alone, which does not help the spread or covid, they soon quietened and accepted that the situation was out of the operator's control. 
I too acknowledge your point about the Toby carvery, my next door neighbour was manager there before moving to the Duke of Wellington had major problems staffing the Durham Road branch and had to close several times.
The ignorance over Covid implications is everywhere, and will now run riot after this fascist regime has abandoned all regulations just to keep the bastard Johnson in power. I fear what absenteeism we see now will just get worse as the largely arrogant and ignorant public think it's 'freedom for all'..
The year is just going to get worse...

(23 Jan 2022, 4:04 pm)N1cholas wrote If you had been at the Galleries for 20 mins you would have noticed not only the posters on the timetable boards but nexus changed all the liners on the boards to show the correct timetables (sunday times on a saturday) so if you didnt notice this then you did not look very well

(23 Jan 2022, 4:21 pm)Adrian wrote Or perhaps they aren't large or prominent enough to be noticed...?

I walked past three stands and stood half way down a long queue at the fourth and didn't see any whilst stood there, but more to the point, if I was any customer selected at random, with no knowledge of Sunday timetables being in place, why would I go looking for the information?

Thought I'd pop over this evening and take a second look, in case I needed to correct my original post.

I know GNE especially have made use of print to good effect in the past, not only producing clear and eye-catching designs, but affixing the said posters in places where you'll see them. So I was looking out for more of the same; large print, eye-catching and prominent around the bus station, but this is the grand sum of what I found:



So the "poster" mentioned above is actually an A4 print-out of the website post, including hyperlinks that obviously can't be clicked. Fair enough if your service is on the same board as this print-out is stuck to, but if you're relying on a connection that is listed, you'll have to wait until you get there.

For completeness, I looked at the other stands and I could only see the same A4 print out stuck to them. Not even that was stuck anywhere else in the bus station, e.g. queuing points or places that'll catch your eye, which goes back to my point about any random customer... if you don't know that a Sunday service is in operation, why would you go looking to check?







I did wait for the message to change on the large Nexus boards too, in case there was a specific message on this, but it only seemed to rotate between the times and a generic disruption message. I can't comment if that was any different yesterday, but I'd highly doubt there was anyone in at Durham County Council (who I think manage these boards now?) to update them.

(23 Jan 2022, 7:45 pm)54APhotography wrote I intervened and told them why, including reprimanding them for wearing masks over their mouths alone, which does not help the spread or covid,

You should have also advised them to wear helmets too, given your history.

(23 Jan 2022, 7:56 am)Dan wrote I was at Park Lane yesterday morning around 11am and there was a Go North East bus station supervisor present as well as a Nexus bus station supervisor - not sure if both were on their breaks at the time 54APhotography was at Park Lane or dealing with something else in the bus station, but both were definitely present. Additional supervisors employed by Go North East have been in place at all major bus stations now for a couple of months, in order to provide additional support and guidance, to both customers and the driving team.

A couple of weeks ago when the reduced service levels were first brought in, I noticed that Go North East had printed a poster and placed this on each stand at Park Lane, with guidance on which services were running Sunday timetables. Can't recall from being in Park Lane yesterday whether they were still there or not.

It goes without saying that there's more that could, and should, be done - but customers aren't being left completely hung out to dry as has been suggested in a couple of the recent posts on this thread.


I used Go North East buses in Sunderland yesterday, both before and after the match, and had absolutely no trouble. Buses were busier than usual, but it was no where near the carnage that is being alluded here... Or perhaps I got lucky.

Presumably the Go North East supervisor was not aware of the incorrect allocation on the 39 service with it not running via the Interchange

(23 Jan 2022, 8:50 pm)busmanT wrote Presumably the Go North East supervisor was not aware of the incorrect allocation on the 39 service with it not running via the Interchange

Its not like their isn't room.

That same poster is on the bus stops around Chester Le Street as well, I only noticed by how massively unprofessional it looked with the header image stretched and the tiny font.

I get this happening across all operators but if your going to be all Billy Big Balls about your marketing and your buses, when the shit hits the fan, you can’t hide and it’s exactly what GNE are doing. The lack of social media replies and general defensiveness of the brand when they bother manning it is harking back to Kevin Carr and Huntley days.

For GNE its a good job the other operators are just about managing without needing to go further as If covid didn't exists but mileage was being dropped then you'd almost certainly see a competitor registering alternative routes to mirror the X1 and Consett/Stanley Xlines Monday to Saturday daytimes by now (like GNE have done with the 21 to Brandon).

(23 Jan 2022, 10:16 pm)Ambassador wrote That same poster is on the bus stops around Chester Le Street as well, I only noticed by how massively unprofessional it looked with the header image stretched and the tiny font.

I get this happening across all operators but if your going to be all Billy Big Balls about your marketing and your buses, when the shit hits the fan, you can’t hide and it’s exactly what GNE are doing. The lack of social media replies and general defensiveness of the brand when they bother manning it is harking back to Kevin Carr and Huntley days.

imo the social media is the least of the problems, GNE have outright lost control of everything lately. They can keep blaming 'national driving shortages' but it's very much a GNE problem up here now (apart from Darlington a few days last week). Arriva Northumbria and Stagecoach at least from what I'm aware have been running a full timetable for weeks now excluding the few routes on lower frequencies so there isn't the problems happening but people don't care about that as long as it's frequent enough (GNE are the same regardless).

There's problems well beyond Covid at GNE, whether that's the fact they were days from a strike, there's been a court action from a respected ex Driver, there's a (I believe) ex driver from Stanley (Stanleyone) who has openly slagged off the gaffers yesterday, who has also opened posted people are leaving Stanley because of the abuse they're getting but I'm sure there's more than that, who has also revealed that there's been meetings to try and resolve the moral issues that went no-where.

Obviously we'll never get the true story but those aren't things which are normal in a well ran company and for a bit of balance there appears to be similar problems down at the Arriva Darlington (only) depot which is all over the place and has been all pandemic aswell and hasn't been as much problems at GNE Percy Main, Hexham or Peterlee depots in comparison to others.

(23 Jan 2022, 11:51 pm)Storx wrote imo the social media is the least of the problems, GNE have outright lost control of everything lately. They can keep blaming 'national driving shortages' but it's very much a GNE problem up here now (apart from Darlington a few days last week). Arriva Northumbria and Stagecoach at least from what I'm aware have been running a full timetable for weeks now excluding the few routes on lower frequencies so there isn't the problems happening but people don't care about that as long as it's frequent enough (GNE are the same regardless).

There's problems well beyond Covid at GNE, whether that's the fact they were days from a strike, there's been a court action from a respected ex Driver, there's a (I believe) ex driver from Stanley (Stanleyone) who has openly slagged off the gaffers yesterday, who has also opened posted people are leaving Stanley because of the abuse they're getting but I'm sure there's more than that, who has also revealed that there's been meetings to try and resolve the moral issues that went no-where.

Obviously we'll never get the true story but those aren't things which are normal in a well ran company and for a bit of balance there appears to be similar problems down at the Arriva Darlington (only) depot which is all over the place and has been all pandemic aswell and hasn't been as much problems at GNE Percy Main, Hexham or Peterlee depots in comparison to others.

I think Hexham, Peterlee don't really have many COVID cases as they are a lot smaller. 

Compared to Deptford, all the drivers meet outisde of greggs, and in Consett with all the drivers meeting in a room near the bus station.

(24 Jan 2022, 12:13 am)Omega54 wrote I think Hexham, Peterlee don't really have many COVID cases as they are a lot smaller. 

Compared to Deptford, all the drivers meet outisde of greggs, and in Consett with all the drivers meeting in a room near the bus station.

I don't believe Covid is the main problem though. Unless there's a new variant that only affects GNE staff and happens to affect them for next to 3 month now non stop. 

Stagecoach and Arriva aren't having the same problems and nor are supermarkets to bring a different industry in. 

One thing I could imagine though is the smaller depots will have a more of a community feel where everyone gets along better between management and drivers so they just plod along and never leave. I believe it's already been said that's the case for Percy Main on here.

(24 Jan 2022, 1:43 am)Storx wrote I don't believe Covid is the main problem though. Unless there's a new variant that only affects GNE staff and happens to affect them for next to 3 month now non stop. 

Stagecoach and Arriva aren't having the same problems and nor are supermarkets to bring a different industry in. 

One thing I could imagine though is the smaller depots will have a more of a community feel where everyone gets along better between management and drivers so they just plod along and never leave. I believe it's already been said that's the case for Percy Main on here.

You’re absolutely wrong if you believe Arriva and Stagecoach aren’t having problems.

In the same way that Go North East have stronger and weaker depots for their staffing situation, Arriva and Stagecoach do too.

Whilst Arriva Northumbria are back up to full strength in terms of staffing, Arriva Durham County most certainly are not and are still losing mileage hand over fist. The latter are still hugely reliant on overtime working including non-driving staff.

Stagecoach Transit, Stockton especially, are still hiring in extra drivers (as opposed to subbing out the work) and still experiencing large gaps in service.

I am still aware of huge gaps in service on Nexus contracts operated by Gateshead Central Taxis. I was quite vocal about GCT’s staff shortages and vehicle availability issues some time ago when this pre-dated the more recent national issues across multiple sectors, and have cut them some slack more recently, but it’s worth pointing out in this context that other operators (including on work they are being paid by the local authority to run, and most likely aren’t being penalised because they aren’t running it) are still suffering.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

(24 Jan 2022, 6:36 am)Dan wrote You’re absolutely wrong if you believe Arriva and Stagecoach aren’t having problems.

In the same way that Go North East have stronger and weaker depots for their staffing situation, Arriva and Stagecoach do too.

Whilst Arriva Northumbria are back up to full strength in terms of staffing, Arriva Durham County most certainly are not and are still losing mileage hand over fist. The latter are still hugely reliant on overtime working including non-driving staff.

Stagecoach Transit, Stockton especially, are still hiring in extra drivers (as opposed to subbing out the work) and still experiencing large gaps in service.

I am still aware of huge gaps in service on Nexus contracts operated by Gateshead Central Taxis. I was quite vocal about GCT’s staff shortages and vehicle availability issues some time ago when this pre-dated the more recent national issues across multiple sectors, and have cut them some slack more recently, but it’s worth pointing out in this context that other operators (including on work they are being paid by the local authority to run, and most likely aren’t being penalised because they aren’t running it) are still suffering.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh of course not, I'm totally aware of Darlington's problems. Durham hasn't been too bad in recent weeks I don't believe but it's still not great either. Let's be honest though neither were exactly a shining example of hour to run a bus company for years. The fleet standard at both of them is shocking. 

Don't believe there's many issues at Stockton or Redcar though?

Stagecoach Stockton (admit I don't follow it at all) seems to have big problems aswell tbf another depot on strike and I'm sure replacing new 69 plates with 55 plate MAN's is just the best way to boost driver moral when it's blatently rock bottom as it is. 

GCT well they deserve critisism.

(24 Jan 2022, 8:32 am)Storx wrote Oh of course not, I'm totally aware of Darlington's problems. Durham hasn't been too bad in recent weeks I don't believe but it's still not great either. Let's be honest though neither were exactly a shining example of hour to run a bus company for years. The fleet standard at both of them is shocking. 

Don't believe there's many issues at Stockton or Redcar though?

Stagecoach Stockton (admit I don't follow it at all) seems to have big problems aswell tbf another depot on strike and I'm sure replacing new 69 plates with 55 plate MAN's is just the best way to boost driver moral when it's blatently rock bottom as it is. 

GCT well they deserve critisism.

I believe Redcar are still having staffing issues - like Go North East, a lot of what is dropped is during the day, with a priority made to cover early mornings and evenings/nights. Sadly that can't always be achieved and they have dropped a little bit of night time work recently.

The point being made is that each of the big three have their own staffing issues - which are worse at some locations than others - it is definitely not one single operator in the region having issues as was previously suggested. The perception is that Go North East are struggling the most, but this is only because they are being the most transparent about the issues. As Adrian mentioned elsewhere recently, even this isn't 100% and there's more that could be done, with Arriva seemingly doing better on their app to inform customers of cancellations (despite this being somewhat clunky in itself).

(24 Jan 2022, 8:32 am)Storx wrote Oh of course not, I'm totally aware of Darlington's problems. Durham hasn't been too bad in recent weeks I don't believe but it's still not great either. Let's be honest though neither were exactly a shining example of hour to run a bus company for years. The fleet standard at both of them is shocking. 

Don't believe there's many issues at Stockton or Redcar though?

Stagecoach Stockton (admit I don't follow it at all) seems to have big problems aswell tbf another depot on strike and I'm sure replacing new 69 plates with 55 plate MAN's is just the best way to boost driver moral when it's blatently rock bottom as it is. 

GCT well they deserve critisism.

Durham clearly must have made some headway otherwise they wouldn't be restoring the 56 to full service. Doesn't negate the fact that the 6 and 64 are still running every 20 minutes tho, not counting any short-term cancellations

On the GNE website the service 4 appears to be going back to the normal Saturday timetable from 5th February

39/39A are again Solo's.

(29 Jan 2022, 1:50 pm)Omega54 wrote 39/39A are again Solo's.

There's not a football match (or anything else) on in Sunderland today. All of the buses tracking on bustimes are showing 25+ seats free at the minute.

(29 Jan 2022, 1:53 pm)Adrian wrote There's not a football match (or anything else) on in Sunderland today. All of the buses tracking on bustimes are showing 25+ seats free at the minute.

One has 15, which is quite busy for a solo - nevertheless there might not be a match but surely they should still get normal sized buses.

(29 Jan 2022, 1:50 pm)Omega54 wrote 39/39A are again Solo's.

As it was mentioned last week as being wrong, I would have expected them to get the correct allocation this week.

(29 Jan 2022, 4:11 pm)busmanT wrote As it was mentioned last week as being wrong, I would have expected them to get the correct allocation this week.

Perhaps it depends on the drivers available?

(29 Jan 2022, 5:06 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Perhaps it depends on the drivers available?

How? They aren't adding extra buses on for capacity they are upgrading buses to higher capacity

(29 Jan 2022, 1:58 pm)Omega54 wrote One has 15, which is quite busy for a solo - nevertheless there might not be a match but surely they should still get normal sized buses.

Not even close to being full though!

(31 Jan 2022, 5:56 pm)Bazza wrote Not even close to being full though!

But the evening on was 8, which is quite packed tbh. ]

Without any advertisment for the service.

(31 Jan 2022, 5:59 pm)Omega54 wrote But the evening on was 8, which is quite packed tbh. ]

Without any advertisment for the service.

Don’t really understand what you’re saying.   If the bus isn’t leaving people behind, surely they have the capacity right.  

Don’t think an airline would fly a route where the plane was regularly only half full or less

(31 Jan 2022, 6:59 pm)Bazza wrote Don’t really understand what you’re saying.   If the bus isn’t leaving people behind, surely they have the capacity right.  

Don’t think an airline would fly a route where the plane was regularly only half full or less

For me, I think if someone is in every pair of seats, daily (on maybe twice a day services) they should be upgraded, because I just feel like it is better for passenger comfort. That is why when I can get a lift in peak times as I don't really want people who I don't know sitting next to me and I have a feeling that will be for most.

(31 Jan 2022, 8:10 pm)Omega54 wrote For me, I think if someone is in every pair of seats, daily (on maybe twice a day services) they should be upgraded, because I just feel like it is better for passenger comfort. That is why when I can get a lift in peak times as I don't really want people who I don't know sitting next to me and I have a feeling that will be for most.

The problem is there's always the bus going in the opposite direction. People seem to forget that for every bus going out there's one coming in which can potentially carry fresh air if it's heading into Newcastle/Sunderland.

See it quite often on here, the xx was busy tonight it has 20 people on but ignoring the fact the journey going in is dead and it picks no-one up en-route either. In reality there's only 10 people on averaging both it's journeys. Most last journeys are like that pretty much.

20 passengers each with a £2 fare is £40 over 2 hours potentially. There's no money there.

(31 Jan 2022, 8:10 pm)Omega54 wrote For me, I think if someone is in every pair of seats, daily (on maybe twice a day services) they should be upgraded, because I just feel like it is better for passenger comfort. That is why when I can get a lift in peak times as I don't really want people who I don't know sitting next to me and I have a feeling that will be for most.

Its the lack of passengers that results in cuts.   I would imagine that it is a lot cheaper to run a smaller bus than a larger one.  
if running a smaller bus saves enough money to make the journey financially worth while surely that needs to be done.  

If you don’t want to sit next to someone you don’t know there are alternatives.  Unfortunately most of those are more expensive or require more effort than catching a bus.