https://www.sun-fm.com/news/local/246842...y-traffic/

Plans submitted for works on 'Northern Gateway'.

(03 Jan 2018, 8:04 pm)Andreos1 wrote https://www.sun-fm.com/news/local/246842...y-traffic/

Plans submitted for works on 'Northern Gateway'.

Removing the bus lane southbound, into the City, is a huge mistake.

This will add congestion and decrease reliability on services in the area, especially on Match Days (all jokes aside about SAFC's poor performance at present, impacting on the number of football fans visiting the Stadium of Light on Match Days!)

The council should be looking to increase bus priority and supporting the operators by building infrastructure to help decrease journey times and improve reliability. Only then will passenger numbers increase, for improvements to be made, rather than cutbacks and fare increases.

Couple of updates on projects in Sunderland:

Chester Road Site

The Council have partnered with Gentoo to support the delivery of the development of the former Pennywell estate on Chester Road via a planned contribution to the highway works. Following agreement on the detailed proposals, it is expected that the planning application will be determined in March 2018, thus requiring £2m to be re-profiled into 2018/2019 for the delivery of the highways works.


That is for the Aldi, KFC and pub. 

-------------


North Bridge Street Two Way Traffic System


A report elsewhere on today’s Cabinet agenda confirms an increase in the estimated cost of the project to £6m. This is due to refining the design in consultation with stakeholders to increase capacity and better accommodate
public transport The increased cost is to be fully funded from the recentaward of £3.36m National Productivity Investment Fund grant for this project.

The expected start date of construction is now early 2018 with completion by end of March 2019. There will be a works shutdown in July 2018 for Tall Ships and Air show events and a Christmas/New Year period shutdown 2018/2019. This has resulted in £2.286m being re-profiled from 2017/2018 into 2018/2019.


So work should start soon i think...


More info on other projects can be found here:


http://www.sunderland.gov.uk/Committees/...QKxw%3d%3d&rUzwRPf%2bZ3zd4E7Ikn8Lyw%3d%3d=pwRE6AGJFLDNlh225F5QMaQWCtPHwdhUfCZ%2fLUQzgA2uL5jNRG4jdQ%3d%3d&mCTIbCubSFfXsDGW9IXnlg%3d%3d=hFflUdN3100%3d&kCx1AnS9%2fpWZQ40DXFvdEw%3d%3d=hFflUdN3100%3d&uJovDxwdjMPoYv%2bAJvYtyA%3d%3d=ctNJFf55vVA%3d&FgPlIEJYlotS%2bYGoBi5olA%3d%3d=NHdURQburHA%3d&d9Qjj0ag1Pd993jsyOJqFvmyB7X0CSQK=ctNJFf55vVA%3d&WGewmoAfeNR9xqBux0r1Q8Za60lavYmz=ctNJFf55vVA%3d&WGewmoAfeNQ16B2MHuCpMRKZMwaG1PaO=ctNJFf55vVA%3d


Link provided by Sup.sup on the Skyscrapercity website.

Work on new ‘Northern Gateway’ for Sunderland due to begin this month

https://www.sunderlandecho.com/news/work...-1-8995293

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cm23v5kv8r0o

Work to start on St Mary's Way.

(03 Feb 2025, 11:17 pm)Andreos1 wrote https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cm23v5kv8r0o

Work to start on St Mary's Way.

Looks like they're removing the bus lane, great idea Sunderland council. The 9 and the 56 does get along St. Mary's too easily.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly08d0y0yyo.amp

Durham Road and Chester Road plans updated, following feedback.

(18 Sep 2025, 4:54 pm)Andreos1 wrote https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly08d0y0yyo.amp

Durham Road and Chester Road plans updated, following feedback.

So they've removed the only part which would actually improve bus times... 

Complete waste of money, as per usual up here. Just embarrassing.

A person with no hands just list the number of infrastructure schemes which BSIP has actually improved buses in the long term so far...

Look forward to just sitting in more traffic for dozens of minutes still then. This is probably one of the reasons the 61 has been withdrawn from Pennywell from next month. It causes massive delays on the Pennywell bound buses, taking over a 61 that's 20 minutes+ late is pretty much normal.

(18 Sep 2025, 5:07 pm)Storx wrote So they've removed the only part which would actually improve bus times... 

Complete waste of money, as per usual up here. Just embarrassing.

A person with no hands just list the number of infrastructure schemes which BSIP has actually improved buses in the long term so far...

I've been trying to find the original plans and proposals. 
Unfortunately, I can't. 

I can remember they were flawed though.

---

(19 Sep 2025, 1:15 pm)deanmachine wrote Look forward to just sitting in more traffic for dozens of minutes still then. This is probably one of the reasons the 61 has been withdrawn from Pennywell from next month. It causes massive delays on the Pennywell bound buses, taking over a 61 that's 20 minutes+ late is pretty much normal.

If I was an operator, I'd try and find out where all those cars were travelling to and from. 
Then, I would move heaven and earth to introduce a service and aim to get a proportion off the road. 
Not only would it speed services up (making them more attractive), but all those extra passengers would keep the shareholders off my back.

If I could get some taxpayers BSIP to prop it up, I'd also be laughing all the way to the British Virgin Islands.

(19 Sep 2025, 7:28 pm)Andreos1 wrote I've been trying to find the original plans and proposals. 
Unfortunately, I can't. 

I can remember they were flawed though.

If I remember right, bus lane along the whole dual carriageway bit (waste of money) then a bus lane at both sides of Broadway roundabout (good scheme). The second one is cancelled, the first one is unclear either way from that article. 

Imo, cars shouldn't be going along Chester Road and I don't understand why signage takes you down there. It should be treat like Durham Road through Low Fell making it awkward with cars being redirected via the Redheugh Bridge or for this case Wessington Way and the new bridge (why build it if it's not used?). 

It's 50/50 either way anyway, obviously if you want to go to the hospital then fair play - but let's be honest most won't be. Anyone inside of the A19, has no excuse from driving towards Sunderland, at all.

(20 Sep 2025, 7:23 am)Storx wrote If I remember right, bus lane along the whole dual carriageway bit (waste of money) then a bus lane at both sides of Broadway roundabout (good scheme). The second one is cancelled, the first one is unclear either way from that article. 

Imo, cars shouldn't be going along Chester Road and I don't understand why signage takes you down there. It should be treat like Durham Road through Low Fell making it awkward with cars being redirected via the Redheugh Bridge or for this case Wessington Way and the new bridge (why build it if it's not used?). 

It's 50/50 either way anyway, obviously if you want to go to the hospital then fair play - but let's be honest most won't be. Anyone inside of the A19, has no excuse from driving towards Sunderland, at all.

I think you'd be surprised how many cars use Chester Road and Hylton Road to access the hospital. There is no traffic issues once you pass the hospital heading for the city centre. The hospital itself has a parking issue- you'll be lucky to get a space on site after 9am. There probably wouldn't be an issues with the bus lane if the hospital wasn't there. 

But now the 2 doesn't serve 2 of the main stops people use in city centre (Holmeside and Borough Rd), and the 61 due to be withdrawn from the Pennywell section, in my opinion its not helping the case to convince people to switch to the bus.

(20 Sep 2025, 10:29 am)Dans_bus_photos wrote I think you'd be surprised how many cars use Chester Road and Hylton Road to access the hospital. There is no traffic issues once you pass the hospital heading for the city centre. The hospital itself has a parking issue- you'll be lucky to get a space on site after 9am. There probably wouldn't be an issues with the bus lane if the hospital wasn't there. 

But now the 2 doesn't serve 2 of the main stops people use in city centre (Holmeside and Borough Rd), and the 61 due to be withdrawn from the Pennywell section, in my opinion its not helping the case to convince people to switch to the bus.

Yeah no arguments, but guess you could argue that people should be using the bus to the hospital aswell. 

It's a hell of a lot more convincing to use the bus if it got there quicker than the car. If you have to walk 5 minutes to a bus stop, pay for the priviledge and then you sit in the same queue as the car anyway, what's the point... Might aswell just use the car etc.

Agreed with the 2 and 61 though, it's a mess the GNE services in the city centre tbh. 

Obviously taking the views of car drivers in a survey about bus lanes is ridiculous though. It's only going to end in one result. It's the equivilent of asking a cycling club to design a road layout.

The initial idea of the bus lane would of caused carnage.

Re Chester Road, and I'm talking of this from the perspective of leaving the town;

Take out the bus stop after the roundabout (stupid stop anyway, and no one overtakes for some reason), then add an extra lane as far as the junction after the pedestrian crossing (doubt Greggs would mind losing a few bushes out the back). Then, at the roundabout, make both lanes straight on and turn left/right respectively.

Thereby, you've split the traffic going straight on and it should flow a bit better. Even better if you take the roundabout out and put properly timed traffic lights, and/or eliminate traffic coming out of the retail bit that has to turn around there. I'm honestly surprised there isn't more accidents there.

(21 Sep 2025, 6:37 am)F114TML wrote Re Chester Road, and I'm talking of this from the perspective of leaving the town;

Take out the bus stop after the roundabout (stupid stop anyway, and no one overtakes for some reason), then add an extra lane as far as the junction after the pedestrian crossing (doubt Greggs would mind losing a few bushes out the back). Then, at the roundabout, make both lanes straight on and turn left/right respectively.

Thereby, you've split the traffic going straight on and it should flow a bit better. Even better if you take the roundabout out and put properly timed traffic lights, and/or eliminate traffic coming out of the retail bit that has to turn around there. I'm honestly surprised there isn't more accidents there.

See personally I'd look at making it a bigger project and a project to shift traffic away from the road completely.

imo, I'd try and force the traffic to head into the hospital via the following routes:


With the white bits being hard bus and cycling corridors, there's arguably little to no reason why anyone is going along them at this stage bar rat running. 

Obviously you'd have to reopen the link from the new bridge to Woodbine Terrace near Pallion Metro station but personally I really don't understand why this doesn't exist anyway. Why build a brand new bridge that people go via Chester Road instead because it's such an awkward route to join, by the time you join you could be on the A19 the other way? 

I'm sure cross bridge buses could be more feasible aswell if they didn't have to go on a long jaunt aswell, ie. something from the Red House Farm across the new bridge, up Woodbine Terrace, through Pallion and then turn left along Hylton Road or Chester Road into Sunderland that way, it's probably not much longer than the route via the Stadium of Light anyway.

(21 Sep 2025, 7:20 am)Storx wrote See personally I'd look at making it a bigger project and a project to shift traffic away from the road completely.

imo, I'd try and force the traffic to head into the hospital via the following routes:


With the white bits being hard bus and cycling corridors, there's arguably little to no reason why anyone is going along them at this stage bar rat running. 

Obviously you'd have to reopen the link from the new bridge to Woodbine Terrace near Pallion Metro station but personally I really don't understand why this doesn't exist anyway. Why build a brand new bridge that people go via Chester Road instead because it's such an awkward route to join, by the time you join you could be on the A19 the other way? 

I'm sure cross bridge buses could be more feasible aswell if they didn't have to go on a long jaunt aswell, ie. something from the Red House Farm across the new bridge, up Woodbine Terrace, through Pallion and then turn left along Hylton Road or Chester Road into Sunderland that way, it's probably not much longer than the route via the Stadium of Light anyway.

You are aware your purple line goes through the back streets of Pallion?

Also how are people going to access the crematorium, university, and many houses and side streets, as you've blocked off their only road access by turning it buses and cycles only?

(21 Sep 2025, 7:20 am)Storx wrote See personally I'd look at making it a bigger project and a project to shift traffic away from the road completely.

imo, I'd try and force the traffic to head into the hospital via the following routes:


With the white bits being hard bus and cycling corridors, there's arguably little to no reason why anyone is going along them at this stage bar rat running. 

Obviously you'd have to reopen the link from the new bridge to Woodbine Terrace near Pallion Metro station but personally I really don't understand why this doesn't exist anyway. Why build a brand new bridge that people go via Chester Road instead because it's such an awkward route to join, by the time you join you could be on the A19 the other way? 

I'm sure cross bridge buses could be more feasible aswell if they didn't have to go on a long jaunt aswell, ie. something from the Red House Farm across the new bridge, up Woodbine Terrace, through Pallion and then turn left along Hylton Road or Chester Road into Sunderland that way, it's probably not much longer than the route via the Stadium of Light anyway.

The issue you've got with those hard white bits, is that you're offering little to no alternative for ambulance traffic. 

You mentioned Low Fell previously, but that doesn't compare to Chester Road.
Ambulances to the QE from the south, don't hit the traffic measures introduced in Low Fell. 
They've either scooted up to Wrekenton or are heading up Beacon Lough Road. 

Whereas with this proposal, any ambulance between the A19 and the hospital or city centre and the hospital, would be stuck in and amongst the traffic measures you propose.
Those roads leading to and from the hospital need to be functional for ambulances etc.

Also the 1231 backs up horrendously in peak times approaching the junction with the A19. Diverting Chester Road traffic round there will just make it worse.

The core of the issue is the roundabout is not suitable for the volume of traffic using it, not that traffic is using it.

(21 Sep 2025, 8:22 am)Andreos1 wrote The issue you've got with those hard white bits, is that you're offering little to no alternative for ambulance traffic. 

You mentioned Low Fell previously, but that doesn't compare to Chester Road.
Ambulances to the QE from the south, don't hit the traffic measures introduced in Low Fell. 
They've either scooted up to Wrekenton or are heading up Beacon Lough Road. 

Whereas with this proposal, any ambulance between the A19 and the hospital or city centre and the hospital, would be stuck in and amongst the traffic measures you propose.
Those roads leading to and from the hospital need to be functional for ambulances etc.

In fairness though, if a bus is getting a free run then so is an ambulance, they'll have the same priority anyway so surely it's better for them anyway? 

Old Durham Road is much of the same as Low Fell anyway really, with bus lanes along most of the road and to be fair, most the time the buses get a free run along there. 

(21 Sep 2025, 8:36 am)F114TML wrote Also the 1231 backs up horrendously in peak times approaching the junction with the A19. Diverting Chester Road traffic round there will just make it worse.

The core of the issue is the roundabout is not suitable for the volume of traffic using it, not that traffic is using it.

Problem is you'll never fix that roundabout, lights will make it worse as there's too much traffic going in different directions. Like I wouldn't even be surprised if the A183 -> A183 is the busiest flow and it's actually the A183 from the A19 towards the Springwell Road that's actually the busiest flow, it's effectively the main road from the North to the whole South of Sunderland. The A183 just backs up because of the traffic rules, give way to right etc.

Obviously then Holborn Road towards the A19 (another busy flow) getting second priority so you just can't get out from the hospital direction.

Put lights there and you'll have about 6 sequences and no-one will be moving. I'm sure studies said that it actually would make it worse aswell hence they scrapped the plans.

Agreed there's issues at the A19/A1231 roundabout but that probably needs dealing with aswell and should be higher priority really.

The timing of the lights are such a big issue, for someone who uses the A690, A183 and A1231 the only one which has good light times is the A1231, yes it does get backed up but who ever sorted the timings out for the A690, A183 need theur head looking at, you cannot get through more than 1 section without stopping sometimes not even one.

https://sunderlandmagazine.com/sunderlan..._aTbQv04uQ

Seen the new plans are mentioned in here. Hope to god BSIP money isn't funding this as I fail to see where buses are relevant at all.

Next we'll be using it to knock the Gateshead Flyover down, mind probably shouldn't give them ideas...

(21 Sep 2025, 9:24 am)Storx wrote  
In fairness though, if a bus is getting a free run then so is an ambulance, they'll have the same priority anyway so surely it's better for them anyway?  

Old Durham Road is much of the same as Low Fell anyway really, with bus lanes along most of the road and to be fair, most the time the buses get a free run along there. 


Problem is you'll never fix that roundabout, lights will make it worse as there's too much traffic going in different directions. Like I wouldn't even be surprised if the A183 -> A183 is the busiest flow and it's actually the A183 from the A19 towards the Springwell Road that's actually the busiest flow, it's effectively the main road from the North to the whole South of Sunderland. The A183 just backs up because of the traffic rules, give way to right etc.

Obviously then Holborn Road towards the A19 (another busy flow) getting second priority so you just can't get out from the hospital direction.

Put lights there and you'll have about 6 sequences and no-one will be moving. I'm sure studies said that it actually would make it worse aswell hence they scrapped the plans.

Agreed there's issues at the A19/A1231 roundabout but that probably needs dealing with aswell and should be higher priority really.

Sorry, missed this. 

The road isn't wide enough from The Wavendon (where your proposal sits) for a bus lane and car lane.

That's the point I was making. 

Access to the QE on roads which contain bus lanes, still have space for cars.

(27 Sep 2025, 4:50 pm)Andreos1 wrote Sorry, missed this. 

The road isn't wide enough from The Wavendon (where your proposal sits) for a bus lane and car lane.

That's the point I was making. 

Access to the QE on roads which contain bus lanes, still have space for cars.

Get you, sorry wasn't clear I was thinking more of the awkward approach rather than the bus lanes, agreed there's not enough space. Think likes speed humps, 20mph speed limit etc.

If you really want to be radical though, could you create a 'car free zone' around the hospital and put 3 permit bus gates where the red lines are here with anyone within the orange zone, welcome to a permit to allow them through:


There's objectively no reason why people are crossing over those routes and would give faster routes for buses, with cars pushed onto European Way which passes nothing or Durham Road which has a bus lane already for most of it's length. It also has the benefit of making the bus more attractive since you don't have to drive on a detour. The white route is more than good enough though for those who refuse to move over. Permits being given to those within the zone as it's only fair imo and would kill some of the complaining with the bonus they get quieter streets.