(11 Dec 2020, 10:51 pm)L469 YVK wrote Well thankfully there doesn't seem to be any changes to the X30 & X31 according to VOSA although the interworking patterns might change with the X30/X70/X71.

I still stand by my word tough about surplus B9TL from the Cobalts & CityRider/Fab56 getting refurbished and sent to Consett. Most logically, the X31 would be the best fit for the following reasons:

- Mon-Sat daytime only service
- E400MMC on X45/X46/X47 (6338-40) would make sense for fuel costs and allocation flexibility where BSOG & antisocial times (evenings etc) are concerned.
- All of the Consett & Stanley XLines services with the exception of East Stanley covered by bike racks. Although option wouldn't be there from Gateshead to Stanley.

Plus 6338-40 aren't being retrofitted with bike racks. PVR of X30/X70/X71 will be 9x meaning 2x spare at Consett (covering bike guarantee) plus 1x B9TL for other routes. If the X31 got extended in lieu of the X30 in the future, that would mean 4x B9TLs being used so 3x MMCs spare with bike racks.

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I don't, it makes no sense. If you were going to that you might aswell use the spares on it. Does the X45/X46/X47 even need deckers on all it's runs, there's a lot of Streetlites going to Deptford lately. Could easily steal 4 of the Black Cats batch for them when the X20 goes back to Solos as they're Euro 6 and the same age give or take a few months as the oldest Streetdecks with the same spec I believe.

Also there's only 3 spare deckers at Percy Main, with the horribly unreliable B5LH's (which aren't Euro 6 and the conversion is taking forever). Not to mention that eventually 6144, 6145, 6147, 6148 need replacing because of the upcoming LEZ. If anything they need more Euro 6 deckers not less.

If the X31 is extended in lieu of the X30, that's even better for me as I can use the Metro from Gateshead to where I need to go.

We shall see.

(11 Dec 2020, 10:51 pm)L469 YVK wrote Well thankfully there doesn't seem to be any changes to the X30 & X31 according to VOSA although the interworking patterns might change with the X30/X70/X71.

I still stand by my word tough about surplus B9TL from the Cobalts & CityRider/Fab56 getting refurbished and sent to Consett. Most logically, the X31 would be the best fit for the following reasons:

- Mon-Sat daytime only service
- E400MMC on X45/X46/X47 (6338-40) would make sense for fuel costs and allocation flexibility where BSOG & antisocial times (evenings etc) are concerned.
- All of the Consett & Stanley XLines services with the exception of East Stanley covered by bike racks. Although option wouldn't be there from Gateshead to Stanley.

Plus 6338-40 aren't being retrofitted with bike racks. PVR of X30/X70/X71 will be 9x meaning 2x spare at Consett (covering bike guarantee) plus 1x B9TL for other routes. If the X31 got extended in lieu of the X30 in the future, that would mean 4x B9TLs being used so 3x MMCs spare with bike racks.

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(11 Dec 2020, 11:08 pm)Storx wrote I don't, it makes no sense. If you were going to that you might aswell use the spares on it. Does the X45/X46/X47 even need deckers on all it's runs, there's a lot of Streetlites going to Deptford lately. Could easily steal 4 of the Black Cats batch for them when the X20 goes back to Solos as they're Euro 6 and the same age give or take a few months as the oldest Streetdecks with the same spec I believe.

Also there's only 3 spare deckers at Percy Main, with the horribly unreliable B5LH's (which aren't Euro 6 and the conversion is taking forever). Not to mention that eventually 6144, 6145, 6147, 6148 need replacing because of the upcoming LEZ. If anything they need more Euro 6 deckers not less.

Well GNE wouldn't specify deckers for the X45/X46/X47 if they didn't feel they were justified. There has been a lot of growth since the StreetLites back in 2015 and growth will likely further increase with 'XLines'.

As things stand at Percy Main not taking into account any re-mods, refurbs or temporary reallocations / PVRs:

- 13x + 2x spare Volvo B5LH - 1A/1B
- 16x + 2x spare Volvo B9TL - 309/310/311

That then leaves 6099 free. Then at Deptford again not taking temporary measures into account, you have 15x B9TLs there with only 11x (+1 spare) needed for the 56. That then leaves 3x free. Branding for CityRider has also been revised to every 15 minutes.

So taking the above into account, that would then provide Consett with 3x vehicles to either make up the X45/X46/X47 PVR or the X31.

Don't forget, only 6336 & 6337 are getting bike racks. 6338-40 aren't unless that has changed. Consett will need at least 2x spare with racks unless GNE want to cough up for taxis.

GNE would still offer a half hourly 'bike' service from both Stanley & Consett albeit missing out East Stanley as well as links from Stanley to Gateshead (Sunniside to Gateshead part covered by X70/X71)

(11 Dec 2020, 11:57 pm)L469 YVK wrote Well GNE wouldn't specify deckers for the X45/X46/X47 if they didn't feel they were justified. There has been a lot of growth since the StreetLites back in 2015 and growth will likely further increase with 'XLines'.

As things stand at Percy Main not taking into account any re-mods, refurbs or temporary reallocations / PVRs:

- 13x + 2x spare Volvo B5LH - 1A/1B
- 16x + 2x spare Volvo B9TL - 309/310/311

That then leaves 6099 free. Then at Deptford again not taking  temporary measures into account, you have 15x B9TLs there with only 11x (+1 spare) needed for the 56. That then leaves 3x free. Branding for CityRider has also been revised to every 15 minutes.

So taking the above into account, that would then provide Consett with 3x vehicles to either make up the X45/X46/X47 PVR or the X31.

Don't forget, only 6336 & 6337 are getting bike racks. 6338-40 aren't unless that has changed. Consett will need at least 2x spare with racks unless GNE want to cough up for taxis.

GNE would still offer a half hourly 'bike' service from both Stanley & Consett albeit missing out East Stanley as well as links from Stanley to Gateshead (Sunniside to Gateshead part covered by X70/X71)

Have I missed something?

(11 Dec 2020, 11:57 pm)L469 YVK wrote Well GNE wouldn't specify deckers for the X45/X46/X47 if they didn't feel they were justified. There has been a lot of growth since the StreetLites back in 2015 and growth will likely further increase with 'XLines'.

As things stand at Percy Main not taking into account any re-mods, refurbs or temporary reallocations / PVRs:

- 13x + 2x spare Volvo B5LH - 1A/1B
- 16x + 2x spare Volvo B9TL - 309/310/311

That then leaves 6099 free. Then at Deptford again not taking  temporary measures into account, you have 15x B9TLs there with only 11x (+1 spare) needed for the 56. That then leaves 3x free. Branding for CityRider has also been revised to every 15 minutes.

So taking the above into account, that would then provide Consett with 3x vehicles to either make up the X45/X46/X47 PVR or the X31.

Don't forget, only 6336 & 6337 are getting bike racks. 6338-40 aren't unless that has changed. Consett will need at least 2x spare with racks unless GNE want to cough up for taxis.

GNE would still offer a half hourly 'bike' service from both Stanley & Consett albeit missing out East Stanley as well as links from Stanley to Gateshead (Sunniside to Gateshead part covered by X70/X71)

It also doesn't make sense though to send buses to Oxford as surplus when they actually needed the deckers for the service. There's always been deckers for some runs for the X45/X46/X47 but it doesn't mean that all of them need to be deckers in the same way as the X7/X8/X9 don't at Blyth. As long as you have deckers on the runs ie the ones that's run into town at the morning rush hour and the ones out in the evening then the ones inbetween probably don't warrant them. A 15 minute decker service through mostly villages is overkill imo.

The 8:02, 8:25, 8:36 runs out of Consett could all easily be ran by singles. As if doing quick maths and using a 1 hour 10 minute run for each bus, they should be one of the 4 runs between 17:22 to 17:55 runs towards Newcastle so they've missed the Newcastle peak out aswell. It's how the Blyth buses works and it makes sense.

There's the equivelant X7/X8/X9 run for the 8:02, https://bustimes.org/vehicles/189800?date=2020-12-11
There's the one for what would be the 8:25, https://bustimes.org/vehicles/189597?date=2020-12-09
Then there's the third one: https://bustimes.org/vehicles/190086?date=2020-12-09

They all miss both peaks and I don't believe there's any school runs which can mess things up either.

(12 Dec 2020, 12:23 am)streetdeckfan wrote Have I missed something?

From what I gathered (@Dan correct me if wrong), only 6341-55 (new) + 6336/37 (spare and 1x PVR for X84/X85) are getting bike racks.

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(12 Dec 2020, 1:05 am)Storx wrote It also doesn't make sense though to send buses to Oxford as surplus when they actually needed the deckers for the service. There's always been deckers for some runs for the X45/X46/X47 but it doesn't mean that all of them need to be deckers in the same way as the X7/X8/X9 don't at Blyth. As long as you have deckers on the runs ie the ones that's run into town at the morning rush hour and the ones out in the evening then the ones inbetween probably don't warrant them. A 15 minute decker service through mostly villages is overkill imo.

The 8:02, 8:25, 8:36 runs out of Consett could all easily be ran by singles. As if doing quick maths and using a 1 hour 10 minute run for each bus, they should be one of the 4 runs between 17:22 to 17:55 runs towards Newcastle so they've missed the Newcastle peak out aswell. It's how the Blyth buses works and it makes sense.

There's the equivelant X7/X8/X9 run for the 8:02, https://bustimes.org/vehicles/189800?date=2020-12-11
There's the one for what would be the 8:25, https://bustimes.org/vehicles/189597?date=2020-12-09
Then there's the third one: https://bustimes.org/vehicles/190086?date=2020-12-09

They all miss both peaks and I don't believe there's any school runs which can mess things up either.

GNE although having to give up 9x StreetDecks to Oxford, did get a sweetener by getting much needed Coaches in return for the X9 & X10. Buying brand new coaches would cost a fortune.

Dual saloon type does make sense but the only thing that needs to be taken into account is VOR occurrences and unexpected demand.

(12 Dec 2020, 9:30 am)L469 YVK wrote From what I gathered (@Dan correct me if wrong), only 6341-55 (new) + 6336/37 (spare and 1x PVR for X84/X85) are getting bike racks.

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GNE although having to give up 9x StreetDecks to Oxford, did get a sweetener by getting much needed Coaches in return for the X9 & X10. Buying brand new coaches would cost a fortune.

Dual saloon type does make sense but the only thing that needs to be taken into account is VOR occurrences and unexpected demand.

Yeah that's true with the coaches mind can't dispute that. Mind one thing you need to look at is the LEZ and in particular Percy Main and CLS both depots really need more deckers as spares and they both often run the Omnidekkas into town whether they're spares on the Angels or the DFDS. I can't see it being too popular in the future those runs being cancelled outright or getting curtailed at Gateshead since neither depot have anything else to actually run on them so they could be a place for for Euro 6 deckers or anything Euro 6 really. Least at Consett if they had a issues they could always throw the X5/X15 deckers onto the Newcastle runs then throw something else on there so VOR isn't as big of an issue there.

(12 Dec 2020, 10:09 am)Storx wrote Yeah that's true with the coaches mind can't dispute that. Mind one thing you need to look at is the LEZ and in particular Percy Main and CLS both depots really need more deckers as spares and they both often run the Omnidekkas into town whether they're spares on the Angels or the DFDS. I can't see it being too popular in the future those runs being cancelled outright or getting curtailed at Gateshead since neither depot have anything else to actually run on them so they could be a place for for Euro 6 deckers or anything Euro 6 really. Least at Consett if they had a issues they could always throw the X5/X15 deckers onto the Newcastle runs then throw something else on there so VOR isn't as big of an issue there.

The curtailing at Gateshead raises a more general point about all services that will go in to the low emissions zone in Newcastle when it is enforced. How likely is that to be common problem that GNE won't have a suitable vehicle to use on a Newcastle bound service or will they have enough Euro 6 vehicles when it does come in to avoid that happening?

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(12 Dec 2020, 1:13 pm)big mac wrote The curtailing at Gateshead raises a more general point about all services that will go in to the low emissions zone in Newcastle when it is enforced. How likely is that to be common problem that GNE won't have a suitable vehicle to use on a Newcastle bound service or will they have enough Euro 6 vehicles when it does come in to avoid that happening?

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Won't the fee only be £50 a day for vehicles that aren't euro 6?

If that's the case then sending the odd vehicle in and paying will be cheaper than faffing about finding a euro 6 vehicle and moving it around

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(12 Dec 2020, 9:30 am)L469 YVK wrote From what I gathered (@Dan correct me if wrong), only 6341-55 (new) + 6336/37 (spare and 1x PVR for X84/X85) are getting bike racks.

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GNE although having to give up 9x StreetDecks to Oxford, did get a sweetener by getting much needed Coaches in return for the X9 & X10. Buying brand new coaches would cost a fortune.

Dual saloon type does make sense but the only thing that needs to be taken into account is VOR occurrences and unexpected demand.

In 2020 Oxford gained 2 contracts (Bicester Village shuttles & Milton Park shuttles) which dictated the use of euro 6 vehicles, Oxford did not have any spare euro 6 double deckers and there was not enough time before the contracts started for a new order to have been placed and the new vehicles being delivered.
Probably because the Oxford contracts were more lucrative to the Go-Ahead Group as a whole than Go North East’s plans for the 9 StreetDecks, the Group brokered the exchange, as Oxford had spare coaches that it had no longer any use for (following the withdrawal of the X90 London to Oxford), so Oxford passed the spare coaches to Go North East & Oxford took the new 9 StreetDecks for the new contracts.

Arriva Midlands have done the same, there was a batch of E400MMCs for the Leicester - Oadby services, but Arriva won a University of Nottingham contract which required Euro 6 double deckers, so the buses got moved from Leicester to Derby (who operate the UoN routes). The Leicester - Oadby services regained the older buses that they had lost only a few months earlier.

(12 Dec 2020, 1:13 pm)big mac wrote The curtailing at Gateshead raises a more general point about all services that will go in to the low emissions zone in Newcastle when it is enforced.  How likely is that to be common problem that GNE won't have a suitable vehicle to use on a Newcastle bound service or will they have enough Euro 6 vehicles when it does come in to avoid that happening?

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It's definitely an interesting point mind. Wonder if we'll see the cheap option and some routes eventually curtailed in Gateshead to save some money (Q1 / Q2 / 57 possibly) but if things stay the same as now with the daily Omnidekkas on the 21 and X21 it looks like it could be a quite regular thing. Isn't there even a few runs on the X21 intentially ran with them, guessing they'll be gone. Not to mention the 327 which doesn't have anything at all to run it and I can't imagine there being much investment in the next few years especially in deckers so god knows what's going on there.

(12 Dec 2020, 1:51 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Won't the fee only be £50 a day for vehicles that aren't euro 6?

If that's the case then sending the odd vehicle in and paying will be cheaper than faffing about finding a euro 6 vehicle and moving it around

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Not sure if it's £50 per day, or £50 every time you enter the zone. Even £50 is a fair bit that's the equivalant of about 25 customers if using passes could easily make certain bus routes unprofitable.

(12 Dec 2020, 2:31 pm)IRHardy wrote In 2020 Oxford gained 2 contracts (Bicester Village shuttles & Milton Park shuttles) which dictated the use of euro 6 vehicles, Oxford did not have any spare euro 6 double deckers and there was not enough time before the contracts started for a new order to have been placed and the new vehicles being delivered.
Probably because the Oxford contracts were more lucrative to the Go-Ahead Group as a whole than Go North East’s plans for the 9 StreetDecks, the Group brokered the exchange, as Oxford had spare coaches that it had no longer any use for (following the withdrawal of the X90 London to Oxford), so Oxford passed the spare coaches to Go North East & Oxford took the new 9 StreetDecks for the new contracts.

Arriva Midlands have done the same, there was a batch of E400MMCs for the Leicester - Oadby services, but Arriva won a University of Nottingham contract which required Euro 6 double deckers, so the buses got moved from Leicester to Derby (who operate the UoN routes). The Leicester - Oadby services regained the older buses that they had lost only a few months earlier.

That was a good bit of business GNE getting coaches in return though!

6308-14 should NEVER have even been considered for the X9 & X10 though.

Reckon we'll hear about the service changes this week? Any ideas what they are?

(13 Dec 2020, 7:35 pm)L469 YVK wrote Reckon we'll hear about the service changes this week? Any ideas what they are?

10B is going to the new retail park in Prudhoe. Timetable on the Prudhoe council page. Looks like service 10A/10B will now interwork.

(13 Dec 2020, 8:19 pm)michaelb wrote 10B is going to the new retail park in Prudhoe. Timetable on the Prudhoe council page. Looks like service 10A/10B will now interwork.

Any links for this, can't find it. Weirdly there's no changes for the 10 registered so it's either last minute or there's more planned which could include the 56 changes that people were talking about above.

https://www.facebook.com/792650460745513...11769/?d=n

New timetable for 10/10A/10B is on GNE website, just change your date to 2nd January.

10A/10B will indeed interwork, the departure times for the two services having swapped at Newcastle. The change has been done using no extra vehicles; the layover at Blackhall Mill has been cut slightly and the layover at Rockwood Hill for buses terminating there is non-existent (1 minute!). Also, buses terminating at Rockwood Hill omit Woodside and Folly and only serve it on journeys returning to Newcastle. Through buses to Blackhall Mill will still serve Woodside and Folly in both directions. It's messy to explain but the timetable shows it clearly enough.

(14 Dec 2020, 7:03 pm)missedbus wrote New timetable for 10/10A/10B is on GNE website, just change your date to 2nd January.

10A/10B will indeed interwork, the departure times for the two services having swapped at Newcastle. The change has been done using no extra vehicles; the layover at Blackhall Mill has been cut slightly and the layover at Rockwood Hill for buses terminating there is non-existent (1 minute!). Also, buses terminating at Rockwood Hill omit Woodside and Folly and only serve it on journeys returning to Newcastle. Through buses to Blackhall Mill will still serve Woodside and Folly in both directions. It's messy to explain but the timetable shows it clearly enough.

New timetable also shows every journey stopping at all stops between Metrocentre and Newcastle.

(14 Dec 2020, 7:51 pm)S813 FVK wrote New timetable also shows every journey stopping at all stops between Metrocentre and Newcastle.

That would technically allow the 97 to be withdrawn between MetroCentre and Newcastle via the Teams reducing the PVR by 2x to 8x vehicles.

Any news on when changes will be published?

Seems quite late to still not have the changes on the website yet.

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Generally speaking they publish changes 2 weeks before they come into place so I would expect them Monday.

I wonder with them planning on running a service in Brandon they might bring back a service to Crook.
Clearly the whole 'not wanting to compete with Arriva' thing doesn't apply anymore

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(17 Dec 2020, 3:48 pm)streetdeckfan wrote I wonder with them planning on running a service in Brandon they might bring back a service to Crook.
Clearly the whole 'not wanting to compete with Arriva' thing doesn't apply anymore

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Having left it too late to get involved and buy my shares from Gateshead Councils white paint and traffic light supplier AND GNE's bus paint supplier, I'm going for it and will be buying some shares in ANE's raw meat supplier.
http://www.passengertransport.co.uk/2011...-raw-meat/

Hopefully any posts from the summer onwards are from the Maldives and will relate to the state of public transport there.
Obviously funded by the success of my raw meat shares in the preceding 6 months.

(17 Dec 2020, 3:48 pm)streetdeckfan wrote I wonder with them planning on running a service in Brandon they might bring back a service to Crook.
Clearly the whole 'not wanting to compete with Arriva' thing doesn't apply anymore

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I still can't get my head around them registering it and then claiming that it's still at the consultation stage. I don't know the ins and outs of the process of registering service changes, but surely do you not only do that if the change is already confirmed?

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(17 Dec 2020, 4:44 pm)Andreos1 wrote Having left it too late to get involved and buy my shares from Gateshead Councils white paint and traffic light supplier AND GNE's bus paint supplier, I'm going for it and will be buying some shares in ANE's raw meat supplier.
http://www.passengertransport.co.uk/2011...-raw-meat/

Hopefully any posts from the summer onwards are from the Maldives and will relate to the state of public transport there.
Obviously funded by the success of my raw meat shares in the preceding 6 months.

Don't forget shares in duct tape from all the 2m lines!

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Still no news on the changes despite them being only a fortnight away.

(21 Dec 2020, 11:06 am)L469 YVK wrote Still no news on the changes despite them being only a fortnight away.

Weren't the last batch of changes announced with relatively short notice as well though?

(21 Dec 2020, 11:12 am)streetdeckfan wrote Weren't the last batch of changes announced with relatively short notice as well though?

Is there actually very much changing?

Martjin in his live update tonight:


83/84 - extended to Peel retail park

10/10A/10B - extended to Tyne Valley retail park

Small number of changes to the 6 on the afternoon

The 21 changes will NOT go ahead - due to a number of factors, the move of the bus station and the bridge closure

None of the changes add extra buses to their PVR's.

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7 minutes 45 seconds: https://www.facebook.com/100009920923911...6353664715