(28 Aug 2025, 12:07 pm)Andreos1 wrote Who said anything about extra drivers? 
There's route management for a start.
Such as terminating the X93 Middlesbrough bound, at Guisborough and ensuring connections with the 5.
There's running shuttles between Whitby and Scarborough. 
There's working in partnership with Transdev and/EYMS, for cross-service ticketing between Whitby/Pickering and Pickering/Scarborough.
Howay man Superman.

I can see there may be some gaps in your understanding of how bus operators function, so I’ll take that into account.

While those points are noted, they do not address the practical challenges around drivers’ duties and working hours. Drivers reporting on or being in incorrect locations at key times within their normal duty allowance, some without sufficient time to cover the proposed split duties or unrelated services. Resolving this requires additional drivers and significant coordination, and it is not something that can be arranged at the last minute—or even within just a few days.

Very crude and basic example -: Turning the X93 at Guisborough simply places the driver arriving from Whitby onto the timings of the previous trip for the return journey. As a result, they would arrive back in Whitby an hour earlier than their scheduled duty. The question then arises: what is the driver expected to do with that time? Their duty (or first element of) still ends at the originally scheduled time, and there is no productive work to fill the gap. Imagine this 12 times per day just for this short suggested change.

This very simple and one-off example highlights how such an approach would, by default, require additional staff to cover the operation—ultimately leading to an inefficient and unsustainable arrangement.

Additionally, directly contacting a competitor to agree on a ticketing arrangement, while it may seem like common sense to some, is strictly prohibited under competition law. This is not something a single operator could initiate or manage unilaterally.

So, "howay man!" Think about it.

(28 Aug 2025, 4:15 pm)Superman wrote I can see there may be some gaps in your understanding of how bus operators function, so I’ll take that into account.

While those points are noted, they do not address the practical challenges around drivers’ duties and working hours. Drivers reporting on or being in incorrect locations at key times within their normal duty allowance, some without sufficient time to cover the proposed split duties or unrelated services. Resolving this requires additional drivers and significant coordination, and it is not something that can be arranged at the last minute—or even within just a few days.

Very crude and basic example -: Turning the X93 at Guisborough simply places the driver arriving from Whitby onto the timings of the previous trip for the return journey. As a result, they would arrive back in Whitby an hour earlier than their scheduled duty. The question then arises: what is the driver expected to do with that time? Their duty (or first element of) still ends at the originally scheduled time, and there is no productive work to fill the gap. Imagine this 12 times per day just for this short suggested change.

This very simple and one-off example highlights how such an approach would, by default, require additional staff to cover the operation—ultimately leading to an inefficient and unsustainable arrangement.

Additionally, directly contacting a competitor to agree on a ticketing arrangement, while it may seem like common sense to some, is strictly prohibited under competition law. This is not something a single operator could initiate or manage unilaterally.

So, "howay man!" Think about it.

They're running late. 
They're not going to get back an hour early...

The alternative being they drop off in Whitby because they're way over their driving hours after undertaking a massive diversion...

I'd also love you to share the piece of legislation where 'directly contacting a competitor to agree on a ticketing arrangement, is strictly prohibited under competition law'.

I respect it might cause some issues in the early morning / late evening, but surely just running the X93 outright every hour and binning off the X94, bar maybe a short to Robinhoods Bay would be the best idea?

You could just drop the X93's back an hour giving them an extra 30 minutes each way to Scarborough running '30 minutes' late out of Scarborough.

Should be the same PVR if I've worked it out right and I assume the driver changeovers are in Whitby so it would be just some tinkering of which bus the drivers are running.

(28 Aug 2025, 12:07 pm)Andreos1 wrote Who said anything about extra drivers? 

There's route management for a start.
Such as terminating the X93 Middlesbrough bound, at Guisborough and ensuring connections with the 5.

There's running shuttles between Whitby and Scarborough. 

There's working in partnership with Transdev and/EYMS, for cross-service ticketing between Whitby/Pickering and Pickering/Scarborough.

---

And it inevitably will be all over the shop. But there's ways and means, like you mentioned. Plus plenty of others.

(28 Aug 2025, 4:15 pm)Superman wrote I can see there may be some gaps in your understanding of how bus operators function, so I’ll take that into account.

While those points are noted, they do not address the practical challenges around drivers’ duties and working hours. Drivers reporting on or being in incorrect locations at key times within their normal duty allowance, some without sufficient time to cover the proposed split duties or unrelated services. Resolving this requires additional drivers and significant coordination, and it is not something that can be arranged at the last minute—or even within just a few days.

Very crude and basic example -: Turning the X93 at Guisborough simply places the driver arriving from Whitby onto the timings of the previous trip for the return journey. As a result, they would arrive back in Whitby an hour earlier than their scheduled duty. The question then arises: what is the driver expected to do with that time? Their duty (or first element of) still ends at the originally scheduled time, and there is no productive work to fill the gap. Imagine this 12 times per day just for this short suggested change.

This very simple and one-off example highlights how such an approach would, by default, require additional staff to cover the operation—ultimately leading to an inefficient and unsustainable arrangement.

Additionally, directly contacting a competitor to agree on a ticketing arrangement, while it may seem like common sense to some, is strictly prohibited under competition law. This is not something a single operator could initiate or manage unilaterally.

I imagine there's only so much that can be done/allowed, can't imagine dropping a section would go down well with the traffic commissioners or whoever else who overseas such matters, also can't imagine passengers would be happy with their journeys being made longer by having to get a bus with a longer journey time especially when anyone wanting to go all the way to/from Scarborough will have their journey made longer later when it has to divert between Whitby & Scarborough.

Don't know the ins and outs of allowing mutual ticketing agreements in these scenarios, but the 128 & 840 timetables/routes aren't really suitable for an alternative travel option given both routes only run every 2 hours presently and there's only so much capacity especially when both the X93/X94 and 840 can carry full loads without carrying another's passengers. If possible, the only worthwhile section to allow mutual ticketing acceptance would be the Cloughton to Scarborough stretch which is being omitted by Arriva as a result of the diversions but are covered by EY services, albeit Cloughton only has two buses per day, fortunately Arriva have the 95 to cover the stops between Whitby Town Centre and Sainsbury's.

Given the unpredictability and constantly changing situation with what's going on, it must be very difficult to plan for anything in advance, on Tuesday they had to plan to both divert to Scarborough but also still cover Robin Hoods Bay, but for the last two days they've not been able to get to Robins Hoods Bay, so have had to rethink things again.

A bit unrealistic to think with almost no notice they could reorganise routes, curtail the X93s to connect with 5's at Guisborough, never mind connect at Pickering with another companies infrequent and full buses.

Passengers just have to accept if they want to travel (and its not been recommended to travel near the areas affected unless necessary) buses will often be severely delayed or cancelled.

But once they are on a bus, it will eventually get them to the destination - hopefully! Although the driver shortages have been an issue all summer, and its been known for passengers to be kicked off a bus at Whitby because there is no driver available to continue the route.

(28 Aug 2025, 11:02 pm)Jimmi wrote I imagine there's only so much that can be done/allowed, can't imagine dropping a section would go down well with the traffic commissioners or whoever else who overseas such matters, also can't imagine passengers would be happy with their journeys being made longer by having to get a bus with a longer journey time especially when anyone wanting to go all the way to/from Scarborough will have their journey made longer later when it has to divert between Whitby & Scarborough. 

Don't know the ins and outs of allowing mutual ticketing agreements in these scenarios, but the 128 & 840 timetables/routes aren't really suitable for an alternative travel option given both routes only run every 2 hours presently and there's only so much capacity especially when both the X93/X94 and 840 can carry full loads without carrying another's passengers. If possible, the only worthwhile section to allow mutual ticketing acceptance would be the Cloughton to Scarborough stretch which is being omitted by Arriva as a result of the diversions but are covered by EY services, albeit Cloughton only has two buses per day, fortunately Arriva have the 95 to cover the stops between Whitby Town Centre and Sainsbury's.

Given the unpredictability and constantly changing situation with what's going on, it must be very difficult to plan for anything in advance, on Tuesday they had to plan to both divert to Scarborough but also still cover Robin Hoods Bay, but for the last two days they've not been able to get to Robins Hoods Bay, so have had to rethink things again.

The alternative being buses run over an hour late (like with the example I shared), passengers being unable to get to/from work and the inevitable complaints (to both the authorities and directly) that result.

It's about managing the situation fluidly and making things as effective as possible for passengers. 
Running an X93 to Guisborough and transferring to a 5, is much more beneficial for all parties, than running late, having to drop boards due to drivers hours etc. 

The TC aren't going to be happy when reliability goes off the cliff, as much as they won't be happy with buses running short. 
But if ANE can justify those decisions with demonstrable positive solutions and communicating it effectively (rather than tossing a coin in the air and seeing which way it lands), then I imagine the TC would be a lot more understanding.

I'll refer Arriva to the expert on here in future...

(29 Aug 2025, 11:04 am)Superman wrote I'll refer Arriva to the expert on here in future...

Still no sign of that legislation you mentioned...

Believe Superman is refering to the Competitions Act 1998.

It's the main reason the 685 had slightly different fares over the same sections when Arriva and Stagecoach ran it, as it could be seen as collusion!

There is an exemption to allow such schemes such as Network One and other cross ticketing. However, there must be formal arrangements in place which involves the local authority.

(29 Aug 2025, 9:01 am)Andreos1 wrote The alternative being buses run over an hour late (like with the example I shared), passengers being unable to get to/from work and the inevitable complaints (to both the authorities and directly) that result.

It's about managing the situation fluidly and making things as effective as possible for passengers. 
Running an X93 to Guisborough and transferring to a 5, is much more beneficial for all parties, than running late, having to drop boards due to drivers hours etc. 

The TC aren't going to be happy when reliability goes off the cliff, as much as they won't be happy with buses running short. 
But if ANE can justify those decisions with demonstrable positive solutions and communicating it effectively (rather than tossing a coin in the air and seeing which way it lands), then I imagine the TC would be a lot more understanding.

The fact that you think transferring X93 passengers onto a 5 is a suitable solution is, in itself, ridiculous - and that's leaving aside your other points (the TC is likely to be pretty understanding of the reasoning behind the service reliability over this week - it's not exactly within their control). Could you please detail how you expect the 90+ passengers which can be carried by an E400 MMC or B9TL onto a 44 seater Pulsar - which itself will likely already have passengers on it? 

Even if capacity wasn't an issue (which it is), what's your plan with the 5? Hold it until the X93 is due? Okay, so then what happens to the driver for the 5 if they're late off as a result? What do you tell all of the passengers on the 5 who are either delayed, or can't fit onto the bus down the road because you've filled it with an X93?

There are areas where operational teams at bus companies should be criticised, I've experienced some questionable decision making tonight by Stagecoach on my trip home, but if you're going to criticise at least have a better solution!

(29 Aug 2025, 4:42 pm)PH - BQA wrote The fact that you think transferring X93 passengers onto a 5 is a suitable solution is, in itself, ridiculous - and that's leaving aside your other points (the TC is likely to be pretty understanding of the reasoning behind the service reliability over this week - it's not exactly within their control). Could you please detail how you expect the 90+ passengers which can be carried by an E400 MMC or B9TL onto a 44 seater Pulsar - which itself will likely already have passengers on it? 

Even if capacity wasn't an issue (which it is), what's your plan with the 5? Hold it until the X93 is due? Okay, so then what happens to the driver for the 5 if they're late off as a result? What do you tell all of the passengers on the 5 who are either delayed, or can't fit onto the bus down the road because you've filled it with an X93?

There are areas where operational teams at bus companies should be criticised, I've experienced some questionable decision making tonight by Stagecoach on my trip home, but if you're going to criticise at least have a better solution!

What do you suggest then? Leaving 2 hour or 3 hour gaps in service or slightly inconveniencing some passengers by a few minutes, but offering a service? 

I know which one I'd choose. 

If you're going to criticise at least have a better solution!

(29 Aug 2025, 6:20 pm)Andreos1 wrote What do you suggest then? Leaving 2 hour or 3 hour gaps in service or slightly inconveniencing some passengers by a few minutes, but offering a service? 

I know which one I'd choose. 

If you're going to criticise at least have a better solution!

Interesting that you've chosen not to solve the maths problem of how 80 goes into 44. Or any of the other problems raised with your 'solution'. 

Fortunately for me, it is not my job to come up with solutions to these problems - nor was I criticising those who were. That said, I have enough first hand industry experience to know a badly thought out solution - such as trying to make a full double decker worth of people fit onto an already loaded Pulsar. I feel it should have been clear in my post but, for avoidance of doubt, I think the operations staff in this instance are doing the best they can with the changing situation and thus I don't need to come up with a 'better solution'!

What I would suggest is having a temporary hourly service X93 which starts at the top of the Flyingthorpe Bank and heads down through Robins Hood Bay up to Whitby and to the Bus Station, then darts off and heads down the A169 and A170 straight to the Scarborough. This way the people of Robins Hood Bay gets a service still.

Also having another Hourly service X93 which starts at the same place at the top of Flyingthrope Bank and heads through Robins Hood Bay, up to Whitby and then onto Guisborough and Middlesbrough.

With the X94, have all 3 of them still start at Middlesbrough and head to Whitby Bus Station then straight Non Stop to Scarborough Rail Station and then return to Whitby. Then they do their Trips between Whitby and Scarborough directly with no stops. Unfortunately, the people of Cloughton, Burniston and Scalby will take the biggest hit with not many options as before with just the East Yorkshire's Service 5 but it is what it is unless East Yorkshire could help out too.

(29 Aug 2025, 6:59 pm)Mike_98 wrote What I would suggest is having a temporary hourly service X93 which starts at the top of the Flyingthorpe Bank and heads down through Robins Hood Bay up to Whitby and to the Bus Station, then darts off and heads down the A169 and A170 straight to the Scarborough. This way the people of Robins Hood Bay gets a service still.

Also having another Hourly service X93 which starts at the same place at the top of Flyingthrope Bank and heads through Robins Hood Bay, up to Whitby and then onto Guisborough and Middlesbrough.

With the X94, have all 3 of them still start at Middlesbrough and head to Whitby Bus Station then straight Non Stop to Scarborough Rail Station and then return to Whitby. Then they do their Trips between Whitby and Scarborough directly with no stops. Unfortunately, the people of Cloughton, Burniston and Scalby will take the biggest hit with not many options as before with just the East Yorkshire's Service 5 but it is what it is unless East Yorkshire could help out too.

Fylingthorpe & Robin Hoods Bay have been inaccessible to traffic since Wednesday, all bar one stop before the road closure is covered by the 95 to Whitby.

On Tuesday at least, the arrangement in place was:
X93 Middlesbrough - Whitby them diversion to Scarborough (hourly)
X94 shuttling between Whitby & Robin Hoods Bay (hourly) extending to/from Middlesbrough at start/end of the day as normal.

I think the whole thing is being overblown to be honest.

At the end of the day, the route is closed due to an emergency situation and these things happen. In the last 48 hours there has been talk of emergency evacuation plans for residents on that corridor. The last thing emergency services need are public buses on the road as well.

It's not throwing in the towel or giving customers a bad service. It's just sometimes sh1t happens and as a passenger you just have to lump it sometimes. This is one of those rare occasions.

(29 Aug 2025, 8:12 pm)DodgepotMcDougal wrote I think the whole thing is being overblown to be honest.

At the end of the day, the route is closed due to an emergency situation and these things happen. In the last 48 hours there has been talk of emergency evacuation plans for residents on that corridor. The last thing emergency services need are public buses on the road as well.

It's not throwing in the towel or giving customers a bad service. It's just sometimes sh1t happens and as a passenger you just have to lump it sometimes. This is one of those rare occasions.

Correct. They're not going to create even more logistical issues by coming up with new timetables, routes and connections for road closures which are reviewed and possibly changed on a daily basis. It's not possible to come up with a better solution given the circumstances, resources they have and the necessity to inform the passengers.

Worth pointing out again that in this situation, non essential travel is not advised anyway. If you still do need to travel, be prepared for lengthy diversions and delays!

(Yesterday, 8:03 am)tvd wrote Worth pointing out again that in this situation, non essential travel is not advised anyway.  If you still do need to travel, be prepared for lengthy diversions and delays!

Even known I understand there's issues, not sure this is the correct advice. 

You can't just not expect people to travel because of a road closure, unexpected or not.

This is an operator issue for not having the resources to be able to expand it at short notice when needed, let's not kid ourselves here. It's not the weather's fault they have a driver shortage.

(Yesterday, 8:07 am)Storx wrote Even known I understand there's issues, not sure this is the correct advice. 

You can't just not expect people to travel because of a road closure, unexpected or not.

This is an operator issue for not having the resources to be able to expand it at short notice when needed, let's not kid ourselves here. It's not the weather's fault they have a driver shortage.

It's advice, whether people wish to take it is another matter. Whitby being such a tourist area means a lot of people will be travelling to and around the area who don't really need to. People have got stranded in Scarborough recently, had to make their own arrangements or had waits of a couple of hours to get a bus. I'm pretty sure many of them will wish they didn't make the journey there to begin with.

Anyone expecting a bus company just to have extra vehicles and drivers on hand to use in these extreme circumstances, and employ them at great cost, is not being realistic.

Every year even in normal times with everything running well, tourists visit Whitby from afar by bus, don't check timetables and are caught out when they realise the last bus to Leeds, Middlesbrough or wherever has gone because its a Sunday/Bank holiday or just they expect buses to be as regular and late running here as in a large town or city.


But the advise is just that, people make their own decisions.

(Yesterday, 8:32 am)tvd wrote It's advice, whether people wish to take it is another matter.  Whitby being such a tourist area means a lot of people will be travelling to and around the area who don't really need to.  People have got stranded in Scarborough recently, had to make their own arrangements or had waits of a couple of hours to get a bus.  I'm pretty sure many of them will wish they didn't make the journey there to begin with. 

Anyone expecting a bus company just to have extra vehicles and drivers on hand to use in these extreme circumstances, and employ them at great cost, is not being realistic.

Every year even in normal times with everything running well, tourists visit Whitby from afar by bus, don't check timetables and are caught out when they realise the last bus to Leeds, Middlesbrough or wherever has gone because its a Sunday/Bank holiday or just they expect buses to be as regular and late running here as in a large town or city.


But the advise is just that, people make their own decisions.

Personally I don't think it is unrealistic. Realistically it's only an extra board to sort this out as it's only an extra 20 minutes or so via the moors if you dropped it to 1 BPH. 

Arriva down there are cancelling buses on a daily basis lately as they don't have enough drivers to do the normal work and are as always relying on overtime which is bad practice. 

Stuff like this is where overtime should be used, not running a normal service. 

Don't disagree on the rest of your comments though.

Edit: Mind that said, it would help if Arriva actually mentioned the closure aswell - https://www.arrivabus.co.uk/service-aler...north-east, it's missing completely.

(Yesterday, 9:27 am)Storx wrote Arriva down there are cancelling buses on a daily basis lately as they don't have enough drivers to do the normal work and are as always relying on overtime which is bad practice. 

Stuff like this is where overtime should be used, not running a normal service. 

All bus companies rely on overtime to cover their 'normal service', if you think they don't you're living in dreamland. 

Sickness? Overtime. Holidays? Overtime. Disciplinary action? Overtime. The list goes on.

(Yesterday, 11:01 am)PH - BQA wrote All bus companies rely on overtime to cover their 'normal service', if you think they don't you're living in dreamland. 

Sickness? Overtime. Holidays? Overtime. Disciplinary action? Overtime. The list goes on.

There's no excuse for not having enough staff to run a service - at all. 

There's a difference between relying on it to cover short term issues (which isn't an issue - requiring an extra board due to issues out of their control being another reason) and needing overtime to run the service since you've not got enough drivers (big issue). Stockton and Whitby both being very much in the second camp right now and they're not the ones either as it's been blighting GoNorthEast and Stagecoach aswell.

(29 Aug 2025, 6:43 pm)PH - BQA wrote Interesting that you've chosen not to solve the maths problem of how 80 goes into 44. Or any of the other problems raised with your 'solution'. 

Fortunately for me, it is not my job to come up with solutions to these problems - nor was I criticising those who were. That said, I have enough first hand industry experience to know a badly thought out solution - such as trying to make a full double decker worth of people fit onto an already loaded Pulsar. I feel it should have been clear in my post but, for avoidance of doubt, I think the operations staff in this instance are doing the best they can with the changing situation and thus I don't need to come up with a 'better solution'!

And here's me not realising that every X93 is decker operated and it's always full to capacity.

Silly me.

---

(29 Aug 2025, 8:12 pm)DodgepotMcDougal wrote I think the whole thing is being overblown to be honest.

At the end of the day, the route is closed due to an emergency situation and these things happen. In the last 48 hours there has been talk of emergency evacuation plans for residents on that corridor. The last thing emergency services need are public buses on the road as well.

It's not throwing in the towel or giving customers a bad service. It's just sometimes sh1t happens and as a passenger you just have to lump it sometimes. This is one of those rare occasions.

But what about all those workers needing to start their shifts at hospital?

(Yesterday, 11:07 am)Storx wrote There's no excuse for not having enough staff to run a service - at all. 

There's a difference between relying on it to cover short term issues (which isn't an issue - requiring an extra board due to issues out of their control being another reason) and needing overtime to run the service since you've not got enough drivers (big issue). Stockton and Whitby both being very much in the second camp right now and they're not the ones either as it's been blighting GoNorthEast and Stagecoach aswell.

There's a huge difference between having the numbers on paper, and dealing with day to day service though. 

The use of overtime in this industry will be a permanent thing. Utilised more frequently recently, maybe, to cover for staff shortages - but it has always and will always be needed. 

For example, you'll have holiday blocks at a depot where there are huge chunks of drivers off for multiple weeks at a time. The set-up of these blocks will differ between companies, and even between depots within a company, but as a simplistic example you could have 'summer' and 'winter' blocks which are each 6 months. There are some 'spare' drivers, which should be enough to cover the shifts when the drivers from each individual block are off, but then any other absence will need to be covered by overtime. If your spare percentage is even slightly lower than it should be (which it likely will be in most instances!) - then again overtime will need to be used. 

Add in drivers having a very short notice period, and the training time for a new one, and one resignation can create a gap in coverage for at least a month (even once trained and holding a licence, a new driver will be buddied up for an initial period too). Scale that up and it should be very easy to see how overtime is required to the level which it is. 

It's similar in other industries, I've worked across a few where overtime was relied upon. However, given the nature of those industries, to the outside it would be significantly less obvious to tell if the overtime wasn't happening. Ultimately with a bus, if even one shift is missing then that is displayed clearly to anyone wishing to use the service. If, for example, there's one less person working in hospitality then the service might be a bit slower - but you're still getting your food.

(Yesterday, 11:47 am)Andreos1 wrote And here's me not realising that every X93 is decker operated and it's always full to capacity.

Silly me.

---

But what about all those workers needing to start their shifts at hospital?

Simple, like Christmas Day, the Hospital can arrange transport.

(Yesterday, 12:45 pm)PH - BQA wrote There's a huge difference between having the numbers on paper, and dealing with day to day service though. 

The use of overtime in this industry will be a permanent thing. Utilised more frequently recently, maybe, to cover for staff shortages - but it has always and will always be needed. 

For example, you'll have holiday blocks at a depot where there are huge chunks of drivers off for multiple weeks at a time. The set-up of these blocks will differ between companies, and even between depots within a company, but as a simplistic example you could have 'summer' and 'winter' blocks which are each 6 months. There are some 'spare' drivers, which should be enough to cover the shifts when the drivers from each individual block are off, but then any other absence will need to be covered by overtime. If your spare percentage is even slightly lower than it should be (which it likely will be in most instances!) - then again overtime will need to be used. 

Add in drivers having a very short notice period, and the training time for a new one, and one resignation can create a gap in coverage for at least a month (even once trained and holding a licence, a new driver will be buddied up for an initial period too). Scale that up and it should be very easy to see how overtime is required to the level which it is. 

It's similar in other industries, I've worked across a few where overtime was relied upon. However, given the nature of those industries, to the outside it would be significantly less obvious to tell if the overtime wasn't happening. Ultimately with a bus, if even one shift is missing then that is displayed clearly to anyone wishing to use the service. If, for example, there's one less person working in hospitality then the service might be a bit slower - but you're still getting your food.

Yeah absolutely no arguments at all. Be silly to have a surplus of staff just to cover illness etc. 

I probably wasn't very clear but it feels like lately some of the companies literally don't have, what you'd call 'spare staff there' to do a weeks work even if the whole cohert was available. Stockton, in particular, seems to be really struggling lately and I know someone has mentioned that they're bailing out Whitby aswell. 

It's a bit of mess really and it's been going on for too long with no real solution. It doesn't seem to be unique to drivers either with engineering blighted aswell, but obviously that's one of those where it's less hidden - well unless it's Ashington, Riverside, Consett, Slatyford or Washington which have got to the stage of cancellations or having half a fleet of spare buses in Slatyford's case. Not to mention trains being in a similar dire state.

Obviously, I've never worked in the industry but a bus driver never seems a bad job compared to most other lower skilled jobs around (no malice meant there) for how much turnover there is so I can only assume there's reasons why people aren't staying, as the money isn't bad either really.

(Yesterday, 7:36 pm)Storx wrote Obviously, I've never worked in the industry but a bus driver never seems a bad job compared to most other lower skilled jobs around (no malice meant there) for how much turnover there is so I can only assume there's reasons why people aren't staying, as the money isn't bad either really.

Too many "Blakeys' who've barely done a shift on the road or under the pits....yet think they know it all and love kicking a driver down through disciplinaries etc.

What a disaster it has been for buses running on the X93/X94 yesterday. Arriva have been completely incompetent at delivering their service on these routes for quite a lengthy period now. Not their fault for the unfortunate situation they are dealing with now, although could have prepared for the day so much differently.

Over two hours without a bus to Scarborough, with buses diverted to Robin Hoods Bay or left parked up in the bus station, so much that every bus stop had a bus parked on it, with the X4 for Middlesbrough at one stage having to board passengers further up the road outside of a couple of buildings, holding traffic back with it too.

After the 12:36 X93 left to Scarborough, there was no other buses until 15:06 on the X94 for Scarborough, in that time Pulsar 1440 managed to run to Scarborough & back. They were running buses at random to Robin Hoods Bay, starting at 36 mins past, then reverting to 06 mins past, very obvious nothing was organised, nobody knew what was happening, not helped by the fact there was no notices of cancellations, nor could any information be found on the Arriva website or social platforms about the current situation.

Then without warning they stopped all buses to Robin Hood's Bay after 16:00, whilst many people had ventured down, under the impression they could travel back on the bus. I'm sure there would have many taxis getting booked by people to get themselves back to Whitby.

The entire planning of the service delivery was just in tatters, to add insult to injury the busier boards that were running through to Scarborough and Middlesbrough on X93s that weren't cancelled, included two single deckers, which when there are buses missing from the route is not useful at all, especially given there was three Double Deckers just parked up for hours in Whitby Bus Station just to make matters worse.

Understandable some of the buses missing were due to driver shortages, although the impact could have been reduced with a little bit more careful planning, especially given the fact the X94 wasn't properly running until after 15:00. If they had focused on running all the X93s to Scarborough at a 60 minute frequency & hourly shuttle bus to RHB, could have averted some of the chaos.

Arriva had a person in Whitby, although was quite uninformed himself with the information he had been given by higher powers, just relaying "I'm struggling to track the buses, the buses are everywhere & I'm not sure when the next bus will be, there should be one at 15:30 & all I can do is apologise." I did feel quite bad at one stage, as many people had questions for him, which some he just could not answer, although the impact on the ground could be felt much more than someone just logging onto a computer & seeing buses missing over a two hour gap.

I accept unforseen circumstances have caused this current situation, although as pointed out above, how things operated today should really have been thought out beforehand. For instance, if they knew they'd be leaving huge gaps & keeping the single deckers on the busier X93 boards, whilst standing the entire X94, with vehicles surplus to requirements for several hours, should have allocated the smaller vehicles to the boards that were curtailed or swapped them round. Then X93s just going missing, with one 'X94' going to Robin Hood's Bay but displaying X93 everytime it left, but running at the X94s timetable was causing quite a bit of confusion for near enough everybody.

Some things which could have made the situation so much easier:

- Strict Timetable, with one bus to RHB at 06 past as an X94, with Scarborough buses at 36 mins past as an X93, opposed to mixing it around & just running blind trying to run what they could & end up leaving huge gaps as a result. Also with exact times they'd be running to RHB for those who may have went to Whitby for the shops & those who went down to RHB.

- Posters up at Whitby Bus Station, with information of which buses were going to Robin Hood's Bay & which ones to Scarborough, including the times. Also to include cancellations, similar to what Nexus supply at Haymarket when Arriva services have previously been pre-cancelled on the day.

- Information online, with a clear format of what services are operating to where, including timetables of what would be running. I'm sure it wouldn't have been too hard to get somebody to put a temporary timetable together or just a list of what buses would be running, once they knew which shifts were covered...

- Single Deckers swapped for Double Deckers on the full length X93s once the services started getting cancelled.

I hope there can be a solution found for NYCC to safely reopen the road over the Moors & ensure those living along the route can regain their access to the service, aswell as for those returning to work & school & those who are planning holiday breaks etc. I will give Arriva credit for atleast trying to keep services operating in some way, but their running blind approach, did certainly backfire, demonstrated with the queues of passengers left & buses just getting curtailed throughout the day, with nobody, including staff with no idea what was going where...

(Today, 10:22 am)S830OFT wrote What a disaster it has been for buses running on the X93/X94 yesterday. Arriva have been completely incompetent at delivering their service on these routes for quite a lengthy period now. Not their fault for the unfortunate situation they are dealing with now, although could have prepared for the day so much differently.

Over two hours without a bus to Scarborough, with buses diverted to Robin Hoods Bay or left parked up in the bus station, so much that every bus stop had a bus parked on it, with the X4 for Middlesbrough at one stage having to board passengers further up the road outside of a couple of buildings, holding traffic back with it too.

After the 12:36 X93 left to Scarborough, there was no other buses until 15:06 on the X94 for Scarborough, in that time Pulsar 1440 managed to run to Scarborough & back. They were running buses at random to Robin Hoods Bay, starting at 36 mins past, then reverting to 06 mins past, very obvious nothing was organised, nobody knew what was happening, not helped by the fact there was no notices of cancellations, nor could any information be found on the Arriva website or social platforms about the current situation.

Then without warning they stopped all buses to Robin Hood's Bay after 16:00, whilst many people had ventured down, under the impression they could travel back on the bus. I'm sure there would have many taxis getting booked by people to get themselves back to Whitby.

The entire planning of the service delivery was just in tatters, to add insult to injury the busier boards that were running through to Scarborough and Middlesbrough on X93s that weren't cancelled, included two single deckers, which when there are buses missing from the route is not useful at all, especially given there was three Double Deckers just parked up for hours in Whitby Bus Station just to make matters worse.

Understandable some of the buses missing were due to driver shortages, although the impact could have been reduced with a little bit more careful planning, especially given the fact the X94 wasn't properly running until after 15:00. If they had focused on running all the X93s to Scarborough at a 60 minute frequency & hourly shuttle bus to RHB, could have averted some of the chaos.

Arriva had a person in Whitby, although was quite uninformed himself with the information he had been given by higher powers, just relaying "I'm struggling to track the buses, the buses are everywhere & I'm not sure when the next bus will be, there should be one at 15:30 & all I can do is apologise." I did feel quite bad at one stage, as many people had questions for him, which some he just could not answer, although the impact on the ground could be felt much more than someone just logging onto a computer & seeing buses missing over a two hour gap.

I accept unforseen circumstances have caused this current situation, although as pointed out above, how things operated today should really have been thought out beforehand. For instance, if they knew they'd be leaving huge gaps & keeping the single deckers on the busier X93 boards, whilst standing the entire X94, with vehicles surplus to requirements for several hours, should have allocated the smaller vehicles to the boards that were curtailed or swapped them round. Then X93s just going missing, with one 'X94' going to Robin Hood's Bay but displaying X93 everytime it left, but running at the X94s timetable was causing quite a bit of confusion for near enough everybody.

Some things which could have made the situation so much easier:

- Strict Timetable, with one bus to RHB at 06 past as an X94, with Scarborough buses at 36 mins past as an X93, opposed to mixing it around & just running blind trying to run what they could & end up leaving huge gaps as a result. Also with exact times they'd be running to RHB for those who may have went to Whitby for the shops & those who went down to RHB.

- Posters up at Whitby Bus Station, with information of which buses were going to Robin Hood's Bay & which ones to Scarborough, including the times. Also to include cancellations, similar to what Nexus supply at Haymarket when Arriva services have previously been pre-cancelled on the day.

- Information online, with a clear format of what services are operating to where, including timetables of what would be running. I'm sure it wouldn't have been too hard to get somebody to put a temporary timetable together or just a list of what buses would be running, once they knew which shifts were covered...

- Single Deckers swapped for Double Deckers on the full length X93s once the services started getting cancelled.

I hope there can be a solution found for NYCC to safely reopen the road over the Moors & ensure those living along the route can regain their access to the service, aswell as for those returning to work & school & those who are planning holiday breaks etc. I will give Arriva credit for atleast trying to keep services operating in some way, but their running blind approach, did certainly backfire, demonstrated with the queues of passengers left & buses just getting curtailed throughout the day, with nobody, including staff with no idea what was going where...

Despite all of that, there are comments earlier in the week, where some on here think ANE are doing the best the can in the circumstances. 

Quite bizarre when your experience yesterday, has been standard across the week and more likely, since the first road closures came in to place.