North East Buses

(27 Aug 2015, 5:52 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]Any reason why Blyth want rid of 1401-3?

I believe that 1401-3 make part of the Quorums allocations. Plus they're absolutely crap buses....

(27 Aug 2015, 5:52 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]Any reason why Blyth want rid of 1401-3?

They are approaching 12 years old and I understand they want some more Pulsars to MAX as spares for the X7/X8/X9

(27 Aug 2015, 5:53 pm)GX03 SVC wrote [ -> ]I believe that 1401-3 make part of the Quorums allocations. Plus they're absolutely crap buses....

Quite like the Commanders, aren't they on the same chassis as the Pulsars anyway? (VDL SB200) 

They're perfect for the 1.

(27 Aug 2015, 5:55 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]They are approaching 12 years old and I understand they want some more Pulsars to MAX as spares for the X7/X8/X9

But then plenty of depots have buses approaching, or over, 15 years old?

Durham have Lowlanders, Stockton have Cadets, Ashington have ALX400's, Jesmond have B10BLE's, which are all 14/15, why do Blyth want rid of vehicles that are approaching 12?

(27 Aug 2015, 5:47 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]Also presently rumours that Blyth are after more Pulsars to replace 1401-3 - we'll have to wait and see where they come from and where 1401-3 end up going.

Dare bet they'll end up at Darlington, seems like when we get even remotely modern buses on our services we then end up with old kit in exchange.

(27 Aug 2015, 5:57 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]But then plenty of depots have buses approaching, or over, 15 years old?

1401-3 are basically pointless at Blyth once the X7/X8/X9 go MAX - bar the minibus work (1/2 from 6th September) and the 308, the rest of Blyth's service work is MAX. And given their age, it makes little sense to refurbish 1401-3 when they at best have 3 years left in service.

(27 Aug 2015, 5:58 pm)Jimmi wrote [ -> ]Dare bet they'll end up at Darlington, seems like when we get even remotely modern buses on our services we then end up with old kit in exchange.

Only routes with low enough PVR for them are either the 21a or the 8/8a.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:03 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]Only routes with low enough PVR for them are either the 21a or the 8/8a.

Them three don't really fit in well anywhere though in fairness and some of the routes that do have a PVR of three currently use younger buses, examples being 8/8A, 12/12A, 21A and X75/X76.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:03 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]1401-3 are basically pointless at Blyth once the X7/X8/X9 go MAX - bar the minibus work (1/2 from 6th September) and the 308, the rest of Blyth's service work is MAX. And given their age, it makes little sense to refurbish 1401-3 when they at best have 3 years left in service.

Given 1401-3 were originally bought for the 1 (441), it would make perfect sense to me to put them on there, the service is always busy, and not suited to MPD's at all in my opinion, I frequently see pretty full MPD's on.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:13 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]Given 1401-3 were originally bought for the 1 (441), it would make perfect sense to me to put them on there, the service is always busy, and not suited to MPD's at all in my opinion, I frequently see pretty full MPD's on.

So, where do you then put the extra 3 MPDs? Blyth want Pulsars for MAX spares, you swap like-for-like so 1401-3 go elsewhere.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:13 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]Given 1401-3 were originally bought for the 1 (441), it would make perfect sense to me to put them on there, the service is always busy, and not suited to MPD's at all in my opinion, I frequently see pretty full MPD's on.

The 1 needs new buses....

(27 Aug 2015, 6:16 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]So, where do you then put the extra 3 MPDs? Blyth want Pulsars for MAX spares, you swap like-for-like so 1401-3 go elsewhere.

I don't care where the extra three MPD's go, withdraw them for all I care, it has been suggested on here many times in the past the 1 needs larger vehicles, this is an opportunity for that, and Arriva would be foolish to pass on it.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:17 pm)GX03 SVC wrote [ -> ]The 1 needs new buses....

Indeed it does, but larger vehicles would be a great step forward at the moment.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:17 pm)GX03 SVC wrote [ -> ]The 1 needs new buses....

If Arriva invest in the 1 they might aswell invest in the 2.  its common sense

(27 Aug 2015, 6:19 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]I don't care where the extra three MPD's go, withdraw them for all I care, it has been suggested on here many times in the past the 1 needs larger vehicles, this is an opportunity for that, and Arriva would be foolish to pass on it.

Indeed it does, but larger vehicles would be a great step forward at the moment.

Most of Blyth's MPDs will be withdrawn at the end of the year apparently, they're not DDA from 1st January(or whatever) after they've had the side destinations removed.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:19 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]I don't care where the extra three MPD's go, withdraw them for all I care, it has been suggested on here many times in the past the 1 needs larger vehicles, this is an opportunity for that, and Arriva would be foolish to pass on it.

And what about the depot losing the Pulsars to Blyth? If this rumour is true, then facts have to be faced - Blyth gain Pulsars in exchange for 1401-4. The MPDs are earmarked for replacement next year, probably by Solos. In my honest experience, the 1 does not need anything bigger than a 33 seater. I have never been on a 1 that had been full to capacity.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:22 pm)GX03 SVC wrote [ -> ]Most of Blyth's MPDs will be withdrawn at the end of the year apparently, they're not DDA from 1st January(or whatever) after they've had the side destinations removed.

They are still DDA - they wouldn't meet requirements if they were there but not working. If they aren't fitted, then it doesn't really matter I believe.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:22 pm)GX03 SVC wrote [ -> ]Most of Blyth's MPDs will be withdrawn at the end of the year apparently, they're not DDA from 1st January(or whatever) after they've had the side destinations removed.

There you go then, perfect opportunity.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:22 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]And what about the depot losing the Pulsars to Blyth? If this rumour is true, then facts have to be faced - Blyth gain Pulsars in exchange for 1401-4. The MPDs are earmarked for replacement next year, probably by Solos. In my honest experience, the 1 does not need anything bigger than a 33 seater. I have never been on a 1 that had been full to capacity.

Cascades can only help to a point, eventually there will need to be vehicles bought brand new. 

I have been on 1's close to capacity, and seen many more, I've seen standing loads on Pulsars and Commanders.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:22 pm)South Tyne Lad wrote [ -> ]If Arriva invest in the 1 they might aswell invest in the 2.  its common sense

The 2 goes through the Chav Lands, I've overheard some lovely conversations on that route... Hebburn is nicer than Bedlington Station, supposedly 

Anyway, if the 1/2 were to get new bigger buses, that would give the 1 and 2 a massive and welcomed upgrade....

(27 Aug 2015, 6:26 pm)GX03 SVC wrote [ -> ]The 2 goes through the Chav Lands, I've overheard some lovely conversations on that route... Hebburn is nicer than Bedlington Station, supposedly 

Anyway, if the 1/2 were to get new bigger buses, that would give the 1 and 2 a massive and welcomed upgrade....

The contrast between Bedlington and Bedlington Station is unreal, get on an X21 at the top end of Bedlington, and it's like a journey back in time the closer you get to the Clayton pub in Bedlington Station...

(27 Aug 2015, 6:22 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]In my honest experience, the 1 does not need anything bigger than a 33 seater. I have never been on a 1 that had been full to capacity.

Oh believe me, I've been deprived of personal space on the 1 when being allocated MPDs. I've seen heavy passengers loadings Ashington-Widdrington. At certain times throughout the day, MPDs have been at standing and unable to serve any more people.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:25 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]Cascades can only help to a point, eventually there will need to be vehicles bought brand new. 

I have been on 1's close to capacity, and seen many more, I've seen standing loads on Pulsars and Commanders.

The Nexus work all comes up for renewal next year. Going by recent results, it's quite possible that Arriva won't have any NexusBus runs. As stated before, there are too many MiniBuses in the fleet so nothing new is needed until the original 51 Solos are due for replacement about 2020-ish (minibuses have life expectance of about 12 years).

Then it might justify every 15 minutes if so.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:30 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]The Nexus work all comes up for renewal next year. Going by recent results, it's quite possible that Arriva won't have any NexusBus runs. As stated before, there are too many MiniBuses in the fleet so nothing new is needed until the original 51 Solos are due for replacement about 2020-ish (minibuses have life expectance of about 12 years).

Then it might justify every 15 minutes if so.

I imagine running an extra bus would cost a lot more than throwing on a slightly larger bus, I'm not sure on this though. Even so, that isn't until next year, so people will be struggling to move on packed MPD's until then?

(27 Aug 2015, 2:07 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]Think my lack of demonstrator knowledge lies in the fact that they've never ventured north of the Tyne then! 

But you hit the nail on the head, the X18, the X93 etc, are very demanding routes, if a bus performs well on those, they'll handle anything. You wouldn't want B9TL operating a city route though, like you wouldn't want a Streetdeck on the X93, which is why I don't agree with Arriva's 'E400 for everything' policy, although I'd prefer E400's everywhere than Streetdeck's everywhere...

The E400 Euro 5 onwards is a far cry from the likes of W*** SCU/EGR/PNL and W*** RBB. It's all down to who is looking after them at the end of the day. The likes of GNE who buy 1 spare for approximately 7 vehicles will make theirs last 7 years on a frontline service (TEN, Red Arrows, TTX, Pronto). The 57 plates which have suffered the most reliability issues have been in the hands of Blyth and Redcar depots with even a Blyth driver commenting on the state of the engine bays when they were there for the 308 and struggling on the Coast Road slip roads.

(27 Aug 2015, 6:22 pm)Kuyoyo wrote [ -> ]And what about the depot losing the Pulsars to Blyth? If this rumour is true, then facts have to be faced - Blyth gain Pulsars in exchange for 1401-4. The MPDs are earmarked for replacement next year, probably by Solos. In my honest experience, the 1 does not need anything bigger than a 33 seater. I have never been on a 1 that had been full to capacity.

I've used the 1 once, from Blyth to Ashington in the late morning. Only had a few seats available when we pulled away from the bus station, and it was a VDL Pulsar. I'd hate to have been landed with an MPD on that run. I personally think, going by what other members are saying and my one experience of it, is to either; keep the MPDs allocated to the route but pump it up to a 15 minutes frequency, or upgrade to larger vehicles than MPDs and maintain it's current frequency.

Given our merger with Yorkshire becoming very real, I wouldn't bet against them going to be with the others in their fleet as standardisation of the fleets continues.

Arriva in Northumbria pay drivers on full size buses more than they do minibus drivers.

So, with that in mind, upgrading the 1 and 2 isn't just about changing the vehicle type overnight. I suspect costs associated with increasing driver rates of pay overnight make it a far less simple option than some people may think.

(27 Aug 2015, 8:04 pm)RobinHood wrote [ -> ]Arriva in Northumbria pay drivers on full size buses more than they do minibus drivers.

So, with that in mind, upgrading the 1 and 2 isn't just about changing the vehicle type overnight. I suspect costs associated with increasing driver rates of pay overnight make it a far less simple option than some people may think.

I thought that Blyth's drivers drive all routes. Do Arriva have driving units like GNE?

(27 Aug 2015, 8:07 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote [ -> ]I thought that Blyth's drivers drive all routes. Do Arriva have driving units like GNE?

No, Ashington, Blyth and Jesmond still have different pay rates for minibus and conventional. New starters start on minibus and work up to conventional. Separate rotas and driving staff.

South of the Tyne however, Durham, Darlington, Stockton & Redcar have no such thing. Drivers are paid based on length of time with the company and drive all vehicle types.

(27 Aug 2015, 5:02 pm)Jimmi wrote [ -> ]Yes, Darlington trialled two Optare Solos at the same time in 2007 I think, one was allover white and was used on the 723, think at this point the 713/723 ran combined every 15 minutes between Darlington and Durham Arnison Centre, may be wrong on that. They also trialled another Solo at the same sort of time which I think they used on Darlington Town Service 21 (not to be confused with the current 21 route).

Sadly I have been unable to find any photos or information of these two Optare Solo demonstrators.

Around this time 723 regularly had one working operated by an MPD.

(27 Aug 2015, 9:42 pm)John_R wrote [ -> ]Around this time 723 regularly had one working operated by an MPD.

At that point it seemed like the 713/723 was a mix of everything and anything in fairness especially with it being split between Darlington and Durham depots.

Are there any plans for the 1/1B, 5/5A, 12, 19 or 21 in Darlo to be upgraded to a brand? They are the only services in 'normal' Arriva Livery in the town (even though 12 & 21 are in gas/green livery)