(23 Apr 2022, 11:57 am)F114TML wrote https://twitter.com/gonortheast/status/1...2685559808
When a service is cancelled for, say, a breakdown, why do they sometimes give a 'start' and 'terminating' point of the service that's not the actual start/end point of the route?

Because it broke down a university hostpital.

But I doubt it will start at West Aukland.

(23 Apr 2022, 11:57 am)F114TML wrote https://twitter.com/gonortheast/status/1...2685559808
When a service is cancelled for, say, a breakdown, why do they sometimes give a 'start' and 'terminating' point of the service that's not the actual start/end point of the route?

Bus might have expired at Framwellgate Moor in that example meaning the service will not continue past the next timing point. So, the 1026 (or whatever it was) service from University Hospital will not operate to West Auckland.

In another example, let's pretend the X21 goes to Barnard Castle, a bus and/or driver may have been sourced by the depot enabling the service to run. However the service has been regulated to get the bus back on time, thus it might start at a point, in this example West Auckland, where it is convenient to continue the journey as normal.

(23 Apr 2022, 12:06 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Bus might have expired at Framwellgate Moor in that example meaning the service will not continue past the next timing point. So, the 1026 (or whatever it was) service from University Hospital will not operate to West Auckland.

In another example, let's pretend the X21 goes to Barnard Castle, a bus and/or driver may have been sourced by the depot enabling the service to run. However the service has been regulated to get the bus back on time, thus it might start at a point, in this example West Auckland, where it is convenient to continue the journey as normal.

The Flexility StreetDeck was parked up at the hospital when I passed earlier so presumably they give out the place where break down?

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(23 Apr 2022, 12:10 pm)streetdeckfan wrote The Flexility StreetDeck was parked up at the hospital when I passed earlier so presumably they give out the place where break down?

Sent from my AC2003 using Tapatalk

To give a precise time, it would need to be at a timing point as that's where the 1min early/5min late rule, as decreed by the TC, applies.

(23 Apr 2022, 12:10 pm)streetdeckfan wrote The Flexility StreetDeck was parked up at the hospital when I passed earlier so presumably they give out the place where break down?

Sent from my AC2003 using Tapatalk

Do they have any cars nearby?
Imagine the PR spin on that one!

(23 Apr 2022, 12:06 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Bus might have expired at Framwellgate Moor in that example meaning the service will not continue past the next timing point. So, the 1026 (or whatever it was) service from University Hospital will not operate to West Auckland.

In another example, let's pretend the X21 goes to Barnard Castle, a bus and/or driver may have been sourced by the depot enabling the service to run. However the service has been regulated to get the bus back on time, thus it might start at a point, in this example West Auckland, where it is convenient to continue the journey as normal.

Ok, I get that, I just feel it'd be clearer if they did something like this:

"Due to a breakdown, the 09:25 Newcastle to West Auckland X21 journey (Durham 10:35; Bishop Auckland 11:13) has terminated at University Hospital of North Durham. We apologise for the inconvenience."

then, if necessary,

"Due to a breakdown, the 11:41 West Auckland to Newcastle X21 journey (Durham 12:46; Chester-le-Street 13:09) will start at Bishop Auckland Bus Station at 12:07. We apologise for the inconvenience."?

(just to be clear, I've checked and both are well within Twitter's character limit)
Yes, I know it's a week later.

(29 Apr 2022, 12:28 pm)F114TML wrote Ok, I get that, I just feel it'd be clearer if they did something like this:

"Due to a breakdown, the 09:25 Newcastle to West Auckland X21 journey (Durham 10:35; Bishop Auckland 11:13) has terminated at University Hospital of North Durham. We apologise for the inconvenience."

then, if necessary,

"Due to a breakdown, the 11:41 West Auckland to Newcastle X21 journey (Durham 12:46; Chester-le-Street 13:09) will start at Bishop Auckland Bus Station at 12:07. We apologise for the inconvenience."?

(just to be clear, I've checked and both are well within Twitter's character limit)
Yes, I know it's a week later.

I think the information provided is already a lot more than you'd get from the vast majority of operators.

The same format is used for the short notice journey cancellations (e.g. from Newcastle or from West Auckland), and this poses no issues, I don't know of any customers getting in touch to say they've missed their bus because they've misinterpreted what time it's due based on it's starting point. Usually, it's because they haven't utilised the information available in the first place, and this includes for general service updates such as breakdowns. A simple point in the right direction (either website or twitter) for future reference is all that's needed.

(30 Apr 2022, 7:17 am)LeeCalder wrote I think the information provided is already a lot more than you'd get from the vast majority of operators.

The same format is used for the short notice journey cancellations (e.g. from Newcastle or from West Auckland), and this poses no issues, I don't know of any customers getting in touch to say they've missed their bus because they've misinterpreted what time it's due based on it's starting point. Usually, it's because they haven't utilised the information available in the first place, and this includes for general service updates such as breakdowns. A simple point in the right direction (either website or twitter) for future reference is all that's needed.

This is an area where continuous improvement should always be looked at.
It should never be a case of maintaining the status quo when it comes to passenger information or just because it's perceived to be better than other operators, it's some sort of standard bearer.

Ditto being reactive to it and only doing something if passengers get in touch. 

There's been many times I've seen tweets like the ones mentioned and it's taken me a few moments to dig further and try to work out if it's going to affect me.
There's even been times when the tweet has put out a time that's not even correct.

(29 Apr 2022, 12:28 pm)F114TML wrote Ok, I get that, I just feel it'd be clearer if they did something like this:

"Due to a breakdown, the 09:25 Newcastle to West Auckland X21 journey (Durham 10:35; Bishop Auckland 11:13) has terminated at University Hospital of North Durham. We apologise for the inconvenience."

then, if necessary,

"Due to a breakdown, the 11:41 West Auckland to Newcastle X21 journey (Durham 12:46; Chester-le-Street 13:09) will start at Bishop Auckland Bus Station at 12:07. We apologise for the inconvenience."?

(just to be clear, I've checked and both are well within Twitter's character limit)
Yes, I know it's a week later.

Do people generally care where their bus has come from? If I am waiting in Chester-le-Street for the X21 to Newcastle, I do not need to know (nor do I care) that the service has started in West Auckland. I am only looking at the direction of the bus, based on the terminus displayed on the destination screen.

I can't see any issue with how the tweet is formatted.

(29 Apr 2022, 12:28 pm)F114TML wrote Ok, I get that, I just feel it'd be clearer if they did something like this:

"Due to a breakdown, the 09:25 Newcastle to West Auckland X21 journey (Durham 10:35; Bishop Auckland 11:13) has terminated at University Hospital of North Durham. We apologise for the inconvenience."

then, if necessary,

"Due to a breakdown, the 11:41 West Auckland to Newcastle X21 journey (Durham 12:46; Chester-le-Street 13:09) will start at Bishop Auckland Bus Station at 12:07. We apologise for the inconvenience."?

(just to be clear, I've checked and both are well within Twitter's character limit)
Yes, I know it's a week later.

Surely a better post would be:

Apologies due to a breakdown, the 9.25 X21 to West Auckland will not be running beyond University Hospital, please catch the GNE 21 to Durham and 6 Arriva service to West Auckland, tickets will be accepted.

and
 
Apologies due to a breakdown the 11:41 X21 between will not be running between West Auckland and Bishop Auckland, please catch the 11.XX 6 service to Bishop Auckland and connect with the X21 at 12.07, tickets will be accepted.

Working together and all that...

(01 May 2022, 7:01 pm)Storx wrote Surely a better post would be:

Apologies due to a breakdown, the 9.25 X21 to West Auckland will not be running beyond University Hospital, please catch the GNE 21 to Durham and 6 Arriva service to West Auckland, tickets will be accepted.

and
 
Apologies due to a breakdown the 11:41 X21 between will not be running between West Auckland and Bishop Auckland, please catch the 11.XX 6 service to Bishop Auckland and connect with the X21 at 12.07, tickets will be accepted.

Working together and all that...

But that means bus companies have to work together, I don't see that happening.

While it would be nice. If that were to happen surely some services would just be withdrawn e.g X12 to Durham.

(01 May 2022, 8:03 pm)Unber43 wrote But that means bus companies have to work together, I don't see that happening.

While it would be nice. If that were to happen surely some services would just be withdrawn e.g X12 to Durham.

Arguably it would be better for both if the BSIP goes through.

The X12 is an odd route as I've always seen it as a Sedgefield / Coxhoe and the areas around there to Newcastle service rather than being about the top part. You could say the same about the X21 really on the Southern section with the 6 every 15 minutes or whatever it is nowadays.

(01 May 2022, 8:33 pm)Storx wrote Arguably it would be better for both if the BSIP goes through.

The X12 is an odd route as I've always seen it as a Sedgefield / Coxhoe and the areas around there to Newcastle service rather than being about the top part. You could say the same about the X21 really on the Southern section with the 6 every 15 minutes or whatever it is nowadays.

To me, the only reason the X12 goes to Newcastle is so they have a service that connects Arriva Northumberland and Arriva Durham County. Otherwise you'd have to use another operator to travel between their areas.

If they operated them completely independently like GNE and EY, then I could see them withdrawing it. But with the way it's currently set up, I can't see it ever getting withdrawn to be honest.

(01 May 2022, 8:39 pm)streetdeckfan wrote To me, the only reason the X12 goes to Newcastle is so they have a service that connects Arriva Northumberland and Arriva Durham County. Otherwise you'd have to use another operator to travel between their areas.

If they operated them completely independently like GNE and EY, then I could see them withdrawing it. But with the way it's currently set up, I can't see it ever getting withdrawn to be honest.

Aye your probably right, must admit I've used it down to Birtley a few times to save money from up Blyth way so people definitely do it.

I know someone who used to travel from Sedgefield to Northumbria Uni every day aswell so people do use it through. Dedicated is all I can say as it's like 95 minutes each way. Then there's me moaning travelling 35 minutes and then ended up getting a lift to the Metro to save 15 minutes.

(01 May 2022, 8:44 pm)Storx wrote Aye your probably right, must admit I've used it down to Birtley a few times to save money from up Blyth way so people definitely do it.

I know someone who used to travel from Sedgefield to Northumbria Uni every day aswell so people do use it through. Dedicated is all I can say as it's like 95 minutes each way. Then there's me moaning travelling 35 minutes and then ended up getting a lift to the Metro to save 15 minutes.

95 minutes, is that all! It's 1 hr 50 for me to get to Newcastle on the X21

(01 May 2022, 8:44 pm)Storx wrote Aye your probably right, must admit I've used it down to Birtley a few times to save money from up Blyth way so people definitely do it.

I know someone who used to travel from Sedgefield to Northumbria Uni every day aswell so people do use it through. Dedicated is all I can say as it's like 95 minutes each way. Then there's me moaning travelling 35 minutes and then ended up getting a lift to the Metro to save 15 minutes.

There is definitely people that travel through beyond Durham City Centre on the X12, I caught a run recently and a fair few boarded in CLS with Arriva Day/Weekley tickets and were still on board when I alighted in Durham.

There's definitely passenger trends that aren't picked up on by spotters especially if it's not their local route, the X12 is constantly mentioned but only ever by the fact it runs Durham to Newcastle, the 7 is another that assume much of the custom is the full journey from Darlington to Durham whereas the reality is most aren't doing the full route often.

(01 May 2022, 9:02 pm)Jimmi wrote ] There is definitely people that travel through beyond Durham City Centre on the X12, I caught a run recently and a fair few boarded in CLS with Arriva Day/Weekley tickets and were still on board when I alighted in Durham. 

There's definitely passenger trends that aren't picked up on by spotters especially if it's not their local route, the X12 is constantly mentioned but only ever by the fact it runs Durham to Newcastle, the 7 is another that assume much of the custom is the full journey from Darlington to Durham whereas the reality is most aren't doing the full route often.

Few years back now, but I was regularly using it for a period between Durham and Stockton on a morning. Didn't always get it back, but when I did it was generally Stockton - Chester.

Not sure on overall numbers using it cross city though.

(01 May 2022, 8:48 pm)streetdeckfan wrote 95 minutes, is that all! It's 1 hr 50 for me to get to Newcastle on the X21

Couldn't be chewed with that, 35 mins is bad enough (make it > 60 mins at rush hour mind).

(01 May 2022, 9:02 pm)Jimmi wrote There is definitely people that travel through beyond Durham City Centre on the X12, I caught a run recently and a fair few boarded in CLS with Arriva Day/Weekley tickets and were still on board when I alighted in Durham.

There's definitely passenger trends that aren't picked up on by spotters especially if it's not their local route, the X12 is constantly mentioned but only ever by the fact it runs Durham to Newcastle, the 7 is another that assume much of the custom is the full journey from Darlington to Durham whereas the reality is most aren't doing the full route often.

Yeah I've noticed that before aswell. The GNE 4 and 56 are the two services which I've noticed are quite often the same. Quite see the famous X56 suggestion often on here, believe it was last week again, when reality the majority of people won't be going anywhere near Newcastle from North Sunderland. Then there was the Express 4 missing most the route between Washington and Heworth recently aswell which is the same.

Mind I'm surprised they've never tried some express down there (maybe fiddling with the 8 which is clearly the rotten apple) and just run it express from Aycliffe Village to Darlington and extend it from Spennymoor to Durham express aswell. I'm assuming Ferry Hill / Newton Aycliffe to Darlington will be one of the main flows down there. Might make the route actually useful. Would compensate for the frequency reductions on the 6 and can always remember you saying there's capacity problems with the 7 often pre Covid.