(21 Feb 2015, 11:22 am)gtom wrote Being totally pedantic as the holder of an Irish passport.  I can confirm there are no Streetlites manufactured in Ireland.

Hadn't seen this.
Saw a comment about vehicles being made in Ireland in the bus orders thread and naively queried which manufacturer was in Ireland - imagining a new plant outside say Dublin.
Was accused of being pedantic... At least you admitted you were being, I was asking a genuine question!
If I had seen this earlier, it probably would have saved asking the question.

Lets hope nobody mentions Wright buses being made in Ireland, next time they're on the Shanklin Road!

Aren't all service vehicles (Quaylink versas etc...) from Saltmeadows being transferred to Riverside tonight (or at least tomorrow)?

(21 Feb 2015, 5:33 pm)Robert wrote Aren't all service vehicles (Quaylink versas etc...) from Saltmeadows being transferred to Riverside tonight (or at least tomorrow)?

They went last night, all the vehicles ran out of Riverside today.  GNE drivers' rota's start on a Saturday, hence why Saltmeadows closed last night.

Re Tom's comment on the 17 running early. There is no excuse for a bus leaving a timing point in the timetable early. However, now each bus stop has it's own set of times, in my experience the times on County Durham stops, (obviously not affecting the 17, but also I think it applies to Nexus stops), whoever works out these things have invented times for stops not listed in the timetable which bear no relation to reality. In County Durham certainly the council have put times on stops which have been incorrectly calculated from the following timetabled point, instead of from the previous one as should be the case. This ignores the fact that recovery time is usually included at several points throughout the route so if you work out a time back from the next timetabled point you may find a time shown which is several minutes after the bus should pass the stop if running correctly according to the timetable, because the bus is scheduled recovery time at the next main stop. But anyone certainly has cause to complain if a bus leaves any point in the company's printed timetable more than one minute early.

The 17 came at 09:06, when it was supposed to come at 09:10.

And Wellsey18, how is it bad kicking off at a bus being four minutes early? It's unacceptable, simple as, and it's not a error as it happens constantly!

(21 Feb 2015, 6:49 pm)Tom wrote The 17 came at 09:06, when it was supposed to come at 09:10.

And Wellsey18, how is it bad kicking off at a bus being four minutes early? It's unacceptable, simple as, and it's not a error as it happens constantly!

Which bus stop was this from?

I've just looked at Rosehill, but there's not one due at 09:10... There's one due at 09:04?

(21 Feb 2015, 6:49 pm)Tom wrote The 17 came at 09:06, when it was supposed to come at 09:10.

And Wellsey18, how is it bad kicking off at a bus being four minutes early? It's unacceptable, simple as, and it's not a error as it happens constantly!

I'm just saying there could have been a timing error from either part, clocks or watches aren't going to be exactly the same for everyone are they? God calm down 

(21 Feb 2015, 8:16 pm)Dan wrote Which bus stop was this from?

I've just looked at Rosehill, but there's not one due at 09:10... There's one due at 09:04?

A minute or two after Savoury Road
Actually, it seems it was due at 09:09, but still...

(21 Feb 2015, 9:33 pm)Tom wrote A minute or two after Savoury Road
Actually, it seems it was due at 09:09, but still...

Looking at the liners on Nexus' website, it seems the 17 is due at 09:08 towards Cramlington from Savory Road:
http://liners.nexus.org.uk/10802.pdf

If it came at 09:06, could it be possible that the bus was one minute early (ie 09:07), which is within the VOSA guidelines as citaro5284 pointed out earlier, and whatever you use to tell the time was also a minute early?

A bus coming four minutes early at this stage of the route is incredibly odd, is all. Towards the end of the route when the bus is terminating, maybe slightly more usual...

(21 Feb 2015, 9:40 pm)Dan wrote Looking at the liners on Nexus' website, it seems the 17 is due at 09:08 towards Cramlington from Savory Road:
http://liners.nexus.org.uk/10802.pdf

If it came at 09:06, could it be possible that the bus was one minute early (ie 09:07), which is within the VOSA guidelines as citaro5284 pointed out earlier, and whatever you use to tell the time was also a minute early?

A bus coming four minutes early at this stage of the route is incredibly odd, is all. Towards the end of the route when the bus is terminating, maybe slightly more usual...

Yeah it was due at 09:09, as I've just checked on the Nexus site.

So three minutes early. I may be wrong, but I'll email customer services nevertheless, as the lateness is getting irritating too. 

(21 Feb 2015, 9:42 pm)Tom wrote Yeah it was due at 09:09, as I've just checked on the Nexus site.

So three minutes early. I may be wrong, but I'll email customer services nevertheless, as the lateness is getting irritating too. 

Also keep in mind what Greg in Weardale said earlier, as it was a very valid point. The times listed at bus stops are estimates rather than official times - Savory Road is not a timing point and consequently isn't given in Go North East's timetable, so it's a time that has been assumed.

I obviously can't provide an excuse for the late running as I'm not in a position to do so. Keep an eye on it over the next few days and report specific instances to Customer Services, watch for trends, and see if they can provide reasoning and/or pass your comments on to the Commercial Team to be reviewed.

(21 Feb 2015, 9:48 pm)Dan wrote Also keep in mind what Greg in Weardale said earlier, as it was a very valid point. The times listed at bus stops are estimates rather than official times - Savory Road is not a timing point and consequently isn't given in Go North East's timetable, so it's a time that has been assumed.

I obviously can't provide an excuse for the late running as I'm not in a position to do so. Keep an eye on it over the next few days and report specific instances to Customer Services, watch for trends, and see if they can provide reasoning and/or pass your comments on to the Commercial Team to be reviewed.

Cheers Dan.

I can't remember the last time I complained to Go North East, as I really don't like doing it. However, it is getting to the point where I can't rely on the service. 

(21 Feb 2015, 9:48 pm)Dan wrote Also keep in mind what Greg in Weardale said earlier, as it was a very valid point. The times listed at bus stops are estimates rather than official times - Savory Road is not a timing point and consequently isn't given in Go North East's timetable, so it's a time that has been assumed.

When listening in to a conversation between an experienced driver and a trainee today on the 8, I noted that he was constantly reminding him stuff like,

'Aye, you've got to be at the Galleries for 50 and you've got to leave at 52, and its 43 now so you can just take it slow'.

'You're meant to be at Waterview Park for 41, so you can just coast this along before you do that u-turn when you're there 'cos it's 33 now'.

So, I guess you're right about times for specific stopping points not being totally accurate. As long as all key points are met on time, everything is okay.

(21 Feb 2015, 9:52 pm)Tom wrote Cheers Dan.

I can't remember the last time I complained to Go North East, as I really don't like doing it. However, it is getting to the point where I can't rely on the service. 

No problem.

The Commercial Team are keeping an eye on AVL, and I think they'll be doing random spot checks at various points of the day to see how the system is performing whilst also looking out for major delays. I can't remember the specifics from last August, but I seem to recall anything outside of the VOSA 'on-time' guidelines comes up in a different colour.

If there's a major ongoing issue, they should already be aware of it. Just in case they aren't, you'd be best off trying to report the issue so it can be reviewed though.

(21 Feb 2015, 9:53 pm)MarcTheA4 wrote When listening in to a conversation between an experienced driver and a trainee today on the 8, I noted that he was constantly reminding him stuff like,

'Aye, you've got to be at the Galleries for 50 and you've got to leave at 52, and its 43 now so you can just take it slow'.

'You're meant to be at Waterview Park for 41, so you can just coast this along before you do that u-turn when you're there 'cos it's 33 now'.

So, I guess you're right about times for specific stopping points not being totally accurate. As long as all key points are met on time, everything is okay.

Spot on. We're probably quite quick to jump and suggest that some services are timed too tightly and this is the reason why we observe delays, but a lot of services have quite a bit of slack, too. This doesn't just apply to Go North East, but extends to other operators as well.

Drivers are only given times for the timing points, so it means that they have to use their experience and knowledge of the route to guess where they should be and if they need to speed up or slow down to get to the timing point on-time. 

As one hoary old bus driver told me - "There would be fewer problems keeping to the timetable if we didn't have to keep stopping to pick up passengers."

(21 Feb 2015, 10:06 pm)G-CPTN wrote As one hoary old bus driver told me - "There would be fewer problems keeping to the timetable if we didn't have to keep stopping to pick up passengers."

I imagine to have that attitude he must have lived in Stanley at some point in his life then..................

#marcused

(21 Feb 2015, 10:06 pm)G-CPTN wrote As one hoary old bus driver told me - "There would be fewer problems keeping to the timetable if we didn't have to keep stopping to pick up passengers."

A bus having to pick up passengers? Fancy that!

(21 Feb 2015, 10:18 pm)aureolin wrote A bus having to pick up passengers? Fancy that!

It's like On the Buses all over again!

(21 Feb 2015, 10:16 pm)MarcTheA4 wrote I imagine to have that attitude he must have lived in Stanley at some point in his life then..................

#marcused

hmm...you gave us a rough description of where in chester you lived earlier today didn't you  

(21 Feb 2015, 10:27 pm)Robert wrote hmm...you gave us a rough description of where in chester you lived earlier today didn't you  

Still make three times what you make Robert.

#marcused

Had conformation that the drivers were indeed running three and four minutes early. Great customer service from Go North East I have to say!

Does anyone know how the 33/33A are doing in Sunderland since they were introduced 25.1.15?

(22 Feb 2015, 11:17 am)Tom wrote Had conformation that the drivers were indeed running three and four minutes early. Great customer service from Go North East I have to say!

You had a reply within 12 hours?

It usually takes a couple of days for Go North East to investigate those sort of complaints, as they have to work out which bus was allocated to that specific service from the ETM data, and then request the vehicle tracking software data to check the data it provides against your claim, before the driver's manager is informed.

(22 Feb 2015, 11:58 am)Dan wrote You had a reply within 12 hours?

It usually takes a couple of days for Go North East to investigate those sort of complaints, as they have to work out which bus was allocated to that specific service from the ETM data, and then request the vehicle tracking software data to check the data it provides against your claim, before the driver's manager is informed.

Yeah, I did. I'll post the reply if you want?

(22 Feb 2015, 12:04 pm)Tom wrote Yeah, I did. I'll post the reply if you want?

Wonder if this is one of the perks of AVL?

You state the time and stop, they search on their system and hey presto!

(22 Feb 2015, 12:04 pm)Tom wrote Yeah, I did. I'll post the reply if you want?

It'd be interesting to see, but please remove any references to a specific employee if you do post it. Including whoever has responded to your complaint.

(22 Feb 2015, 12:12 pm)aureolin wrote It'd be interesting to see, but please remove any references to a specific employee if you do post it. Including whoever has responded to your complaint.

Yeah I always remove the names


Dear customer




This service will also be monitored as a result of late running with the intention of improving reliability.



 

It's concerning how Customer Services can play judge, jury and executioner, when logistically, it would be pretty much impossible to gather the facts in such a short period of time. They've stated "our driver has fallen short of our standards", yet further on in the response it seems to imply that the driver has yet to be asked for their side of the story? If they've used AVL data alone as gospel, then it's a dangerous game to get into. 

(22 Feb 2015, 12:28 pm)aureolin wrote It's concerning how Customer Services can play judge, jury and executioner, when logistically, it would be pretty much impossible to gather the facts in such a short period of time. They've stated "our driver has fallen short of our standards", yet further on in the response it seems to imply that the driver has yet to be asked for their side of the story? If they've used AVL data alone as gospel, then it's a dangerous game to get into. 

Yeah I suppose.

I'm sure they will let me know in more detail sometime. Good response anyway. 

(22 Feb 2015, 12:28 pm)aureolin wrote It's concerning how Customer Services can play judge, jury and executioner, when logistically, it would be pretty much impossible to gather the facts in such a short period of time. They've stated "our driver has fallen short of our standards", yet further on in the response it seems to imply that the driver has yet to be asked for their side of the story? If they've used AVL data alone as gospel, then it's a dangerous game to get into. 

Normally ETM data is used alongside AVL.  This is downloaded from the vehicles each night once the vehicles return to the depot and is available to view the following day.