Go North East service levels during the Coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic
Go North East service levels during the Coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic
(01 Apr 2020, 2:41 pm)Big O I'm seeing reports that Bus companies need a bailout due to this situation. Why do they need money from the Government haven't they got enough already from the extravagant fares?
(01 Apr 2020, 2:41 pm)Big O I'm seeing reports that Bus companies need a bailout due to this situation. Why do they need money from the Government haven't they got enough already from the extravagant fares?
(01 Apr 2020, 2:41 pm)Big O I'm seeing reports that Bus companies need a bailout due to this situation. Why do they need money from the Government haven't they got enough already from the extravagant fares?
(01 Apr 2020, 2:41 pm)Big O I'm seeing reports that Bus companies need a bailout due to this situation. Why do they need money from the Government haven't they got enough already from the extravagant fares?
(01 Apr 2020, 3:20 pm)mb134 And what fares would those be?
If you take the big 3 in the North East, they're largely all running a Sunday service with a few peak extras. There are fewer passengers than you'd find even on a Sunday, so you've got reduced income all 7 days of the week.
Ultimately wages still need paid, fuel still needs used and maintenance still needs carried out.
Shops, restaurants etc currently have a government paid workforce, little to no maintenance cost and so aren't in as bad of a position. Bus operators have all the usual costs, albeit on a slightly reduced scale (and with furloughed workers), so most will run into financial difficulty.
(01 Apr 2020, 3:20 pm)mb134 And what fares would those be?
If you take the big 3 in the North East, they're largely all running a Sunday service with a few peak extras. There are fewer passengers than you'd find even on a Sunday, so you've got reduced income all 7 days of the week.
Ultimately wages still need paid, fuel still needs used and maintenance still needs carried out.
Shops, restaurants etc currently have a government paid workforce, little to no maintenance cost and so aren't in as bad of a position. Bus operators have all the usual costs, albeit on a slightly reduced scale (and with furloughed workers), so most will run into financial difficulty.
Storx what you need to think about is bus companies have a massive cost every week, a depot with 300 staff with an average wage of £400 per week before tax is £120,000 per week, £480,000 a month, on top of that there is fuel, vehicle maintenance, utility bills e.t.c. suddenly the income drops by 90% with the same overheads, coach companies can not operate because all hotels have closed so they had no option but to close, all operators need help from the government as local service operators have no option but keep running a service because other key workers need to get to work, now lets just make my example of a company the size of go north east with approximate 3000 employees at £400 a week is £1.2M a week in wages alone or £4.8M a month in wages alone and you wonder where the money goes from those "profitable routes / desirable contracts".
(01 Apr 2020, 5:15 pm)N1cholas Storx what you need to think about is bus companies have a massive cost every week, a depot with 300 staff with an average wage of £400 per week before tax is £120,000 per week, £480,000 a month, on top of that there is fuel, vehicle maintenance, utility bills e.t.c. suddenly the income drops by 90% with the same overheads, coach companies can not operate because all hotels have closed so they had no option but to close, all operators need help from the government as local service operators have no option but keep running a service because other key workers need to get to work, now lets just make my example of a company the size of go north east with approximate 3000 employees at £400 a week is £1.2M a week in wages alone or £4.8M a month in wages alone and you wonder where the money goes from those "profitable routes / desirable contracts".
(01 Apr 2020, 5:15 pm)N1cholas Storx what you need to think about is bus companies have a massive cost every week, a depot with 300 staff with an average wage of £400 per week before tax is £120,000 per week, £480,000 a month, on top of that there is fuel, vehicle maintenance, utility bills e.t.c. suddenly the income drops by 90% with the same overheads, coach companies can not operate because all hotels have closed so they had no option but to close, all operators need help from the government as local service operators have no option but keep running a service because other key workers need to get to work, now lets just make my example of a company the size of go north east with approximate 3000 employees at £400 a week is £1.2M a week in wages alone or £4.8M a month in wages alone and you wonder where the money goes from those "profitable routes / desirable contracts".
(01 Apr 2020, 5:44 pm)Storx Dw I did think about that, aren't half the staff on furlong now anyway so the wage bill won't be that high. I just don't think the bus companies should be getting bailed out as they're not small companies and should have plans to be able to overcome stuff like that without anything any consequences ie losing shares etc. Not to mention 3 depots are closed and half the fleet are off the road.
https://www.go-ahead.com/media/press-rel...m-dividend - Btw I did do some research beforehand and 75% of GoAhead's money is contracted anyway and they believe they can get through this unharmed. They're share price is also still £8.00 so there's money which could be raised there.
I just think bailing out isn't the right thing here there's many other industries in similar issues; gardening, event venues, breweries, airlines, hotels etc and you can't start bailing everyone out we don't have an unlimited money tree. It's more the 'bailing out' part I have the issue with, no-one should be getting free money in the millions especially those that we're privitised for that exact reason. If this continues for awhile then the only money that possibly should be given is to the local LA's / Nexus and let them decide what they want running and what they don't and let them share funds out to continue running a limited service etc such as Boxing Day.
(01 Apr 2020, 5:44 pm)Storx Dw I did think about that, aren't half the staff on furlong now anyway so the wage bill won't be that high. I just don't think the bus companies should be getting bailed out as they're not small companies and should have plans to be able to overcome stuff like that without anything any consequences ie losing shares etc. Not to mention 3 depots are closed and half the fleet are off the road.
https://www.go-ahead.com/media/press-rel...m-dividend - Btw I did do some research beforehand and 75% of GoAhead's money is contracted anyway and they believe they can get through this unharmed. They're share price is also still £8.00 so there's money which could be raised there.
I just think bailing out isn't the right thing here there's many other industries in similar issues; gardening, event venues, breweries, airlines, hotels etc and you can't start bailing everyone out we don't have an unlimited money tree. It's more the 'bailing out' part I have the issue with, no-one should be getting free money in the millions especially those that we're privitised for that exact reason. If this continues for awhile then the only money that possibly should be given is to the local LA's / Nexus and let them decide what they want running and what they don't and let them share funds out to continue running a limited service etc such as Boxing Day.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:33 pm)Andreos1 Don't forget all the financial support operators have had with their BSOG, Green Bus Fund, ticketer machines, uplifts and whatever else.
And that's just the every day stuff!
If they want to be de-regulated, then they've got to be totally de-regulated and that includes the curtailment of all handouts, grants and subsidies imo.
Bus priority measures? Not a taxpayers problem.
Emniox conversions? Sort it themselves.
It really annoys me that operators seemingly never stop with their begging bowl and wide eyed stare of pity, but fought so hard against having that begging bowl taken off them under the QCS scheme.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:33 pm)Andreos1 Don't forget all the financial support operators have had with their BSOG, Green Bus Fund, ticketer machines, uplifts and whatever else.
And that's just the every day stuff!
If they want to be de-regulated, then they've got to be totally de-regulated and that includes the curtailment of all handouts, grants and subsidies imo.
Bus priority measures? Not a taxpayers problem.
Emniox conversions? Sort it themselves.
It really annoys me that operators seemingly never stop with their begging bowl and wide eyed stare of pity, but fought so hard against having that begging bowl taken off them under the QCS scheme.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:48 pm)mb134 But then, arguably, why should other companies be getting government help? Last I checked high street retailers are private businesses, but are mainly now paying their workforce through government money.
If airlines are getting bailed out, a far more lucrative industry than bus operations, then why shouldn't bus companies expect assistance? After all, right now, bus services are far more essential than flights.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:48 pm)mb134 But then, arguably, why should other companies be getting government help? Last I checked high street retailers are private businesses, but are mainly now paying their workforce through government money.
If airlines are getting bailed out, a far more lucrative industry than bus operations, then why shouldn't bus companies expect assistance? After all, right now, bus services are far more essential than flights.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:48 pm)mb134 But then, arguably, why should other companies be getting government help? Last I checked high street retailers are private businesses, but are mainly now paying their workforce through government money.
If airlines are getting bailed out, a far more lucrative industry than bus operations, then why shouldn't bus companies expect assistance? After all, right now, bus services are far more essential than flights.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:48 pm)mb134 But then, arguably, why should other companies be getting government help? Last I checked high street retailers are private businesses, but are mainly now paying their workforce through government money.
If airlines are getting bailed out, a far more lucrative industry than bus operations, then why shouldn't bus companies expect assistance? After all, right now, bus services are far more essential than flights.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:33 pm)Andreos1 Don't forget all the financial support operators have had with their BSOG, Green Bus Fund, ticketer machines, uplifts and whatever else.But at the moment they aren’t working in a deregulated market, because the government has specifically told everyone not to travel. That’s the big difference that can’t be planned for.
And that's just the every day stuff!
If they want to be de-regulated, then they've got to be totally de-regulated and that includes the curtailment of all handouts, grants and subsidies imo.
Bus priority measures? Not a taxpayers problem.
Emniox conversions? Sort it themselves.
It really annoys me that operators seemingly never stop with their begging bowl and wide eyed stare of pity, but fought so hard against having that begging bowl taken off them under the QCS scheme.
(01 Apr 2020, 6:33 pm)Andreos1 Don't forget all the financial support operators have had with their BSOG, Green Bus Fund, ticketer machines, uplifts and whatever else.But at the moment they aren’t working in a deregulated market, because the government has specifically told everyone not to travel. That’s the big difference that can’t be planned for.
And that's just the every day stuff!
If they want to be de-regulated, then they've got to be totally de-regulated and that includes the curtailment of all handouts, grants and subsidies imo.
Bus priority measures? Not a taxpayers problem.
Emniox conversions? Sort it themselves.
It really annoys me that operators seemingly never stop with their begging bowl and wide eyed stare of pity, but fought so hard against having that begging bowl taken off them under the QCS scheme.
(01 Apr 2020, 8:12 pm)Wybus But at the moment they aren’t working in a deregulated market, because the government has specifically told everyone not to travel. That’s the big difference that can’t be planned for.
And regarding funding for better emissions, if there was no funding then all the bus companies big and small would just say no, it’s not commercially viable.
(01 Apr 2020, 8:12 pm)Wybus But at the moment they aren’t working in a deregulated market, because the government has specifically told everyone not to travel. That’s the big difference that can’t be planned for.
And regarding funding for better emissions, if there was no funding then all the bus companies big and small would just say no, it’s not commercially viable.
74 tracking rather strangely on the app. Currently showing in Corbridge.
(28 Mar 2020, 2:33 pm)Storx Oh I can't disagree with that but a normal fare passenger wouldn't agree. Bench seating, high floor (OAP's and buggies), dark and quite dingey inside really - not to mention they were never refurbished since new. Plus they looked old design wise compared to say something 15 year old now especially since the Enviro and anything Wright haven't really changed their designs massively since about 2002 / 2006.
Shame you can't get buses like them nowadays rather than the crap (in comparison) produced now.
(28 Mar 2020, 2:33 pm)Storx Oh I can't disagree with that but a normal fare passenger wouldn't agree. Bench seating, high floor (OAP's and buggies), dark and quite dingey inside really - not to mention they were never refurbished since new. Plus they looked old design wise compared to say something 15 year old now especially since the Enviro and anything Wright haven't really changed their designs massively since about 2002 / 2006.
Shame you can't get buses like them nowadays rather than the crap (in comparison) produced now.
Go North East’s unsung bus drivers and support teams praised by fellow key workers
http://newsroom.gonortheast.co.uk/news/g...ers-399060
http://newsroom.gonortheast.co.uk/images...ne-1922133
(02 Apr 2020, 2:44 pm)Cock Robin The coach seated Olympians and Scaniss were far more comfortable for ANY passengers than the stuff around today.
(02 Apr 2020, 2:44 pm)Cock Robin The coach seated Olympians and Scaniss were far more comfortable for ANY passengers than the stuff around today.
(02 Apr 2020, 8:54 pm)Storx Not for wheelchairs :p The Scania N113's at Blyth urgently needed to be replaced though they pretty grim at the end because of the leaking windows for god knows how long. The smell of damp and actual wet seats if you sat where the window frame was, wasn't pleasant at all and tbh they're replacements weren't bad (VDL's).
The East Lancs Cityzens and European really we're modern buses interior wise for their age though, even more so than some of the stuff that came after (ALX400 in particular).
(02 Apr 2020, 8:54 pm)Storx Not for wheelchairs :p The Scania N113's at Blyth urgently needed to be replaced though they pretty grim at the end because of the leaking windows for god knows how long. The smell of damp and actual wet seats if you sat where the window frame was, wasn't pleasant at all and tbh they're replacements weren't bad (VDL's).
The East Lancs Cityzens and European really we're modern buses interior wise for their age though, even more so than some of the stuff that came after (ALX400 in particular).
(02 Apr 2020, 9:28 pm)Andreos1 East Lancs bodied?
The GNE Tridents were similar.
I've had a wet bum once or twice when riding their Omnidekka's in the rain too.
(02 Apr 2020, 9:38 pm)V514DFT Dont forget the leaking roofs on them
(02 Apr 2020, 9:28 pm)Andreos1 East Lancs bodied?
The GNE Tridents were similar.
I've had a wet bum once or twice when riding their Omnidekka's in the rain too.
(02 Apr 2020, 9:38 pm)V514DFT Dont forget the leaking roofs on them