I'm trying to understand what your suggesting with this 21/29's here but I think I get it.

Your suggesting, changing the 29A to do Harlow Green and Wrekenton, then a second to do the backwaters of Birtley and continue to Washington with the 21's from Chester being extended to Langley Park instead..?

If you want to go down that route though you'd be doing something like:

21 - Current 21 to Brandon, every 30 minutes.
22 - Current 21 to Chester Le Street, 25 to Langley Park, every 30 minutes.
23 - Current 21 to Harlow Green, turn right towards the Gold Medal then 29 route to Kibblesworth, every 30 minutes.
24 - Current 21 to Harlow Green turn left, current 25 as far as Vigo, turn left under the A1(M) and do the 84 loop in the opposite direction, every 30 minutes.
25 - Withdrawn
28 - Same route
28A - Direct from the Gold Medal to Birtley.
29 - Withdrawn

Admit I haven't thought about timetabling at all and whether it would actually work but it's much less confusing that what your suggesting and there's way too many 21's between The Angel and Chester Le Street which are never busy. It also removes the short and long 21's.

(04 Jan 2022, 6:13 pm)Storx wrote I'm trying to understand what your suggesting with this 21/29's here but I think I get it.

Your suggesting, changing the 29A to do Harlow Green and Wrekenton, then a second to do the backwaters of Birtley and continue to Washington with the 21's from Chester being extended to Langley Park instead..?

If you want to go down that route though you'd be doing something like:

21 - Current 21 to Brandon, every 30 minutes.
22 - Current 21 to Chester Le Street, 25 to Langley Park, every 30 minutes.
23 - Current 21 to Harlow Green, turn right towards the Gold Medal then 29 route to Kibblesworth, every 30 minutes.
24 - Current 21 to Harlow Green turn left, current 25 as far as Vigo, turn left under the A1(M) and do the 84 loop in the opposite direction, every 30 minutes.
25 - Withdrawn
28 - Same route
28A - Direct from the Gold Medal to Birtley.
29 - Withdrawn

Admit I haven't thought about timetabling at all and whether it would actually work but it's much less confusing that what your suggesting and there's way too many 21's between The Angel and Chester Le Street which are never busy. It also removes the short and long 21's.

Would this work by any chance? It was set up as an idea for GNE Competition.

I travelled on the 42A yesterday for the full route from Kingston Park to Wallsend and it got busier closer to Wallsend. Could this service be made fully commercially viable? What changes are needed to improve the service?

Does anyone know if the Newcastle & North Tyneside day ticket is available on the 74/X84/X85 or if this can only be purchased on North Tyneside depot based services?

(05 Jan 2022, 1:58 am)OrangeArrow49 wrote I travelled on the 42A yesterday for the full route from Kingston Park to Wallsend and it got busier closer to Wallsend. Could this service be made fully commercially viable? What changes are needed to improve the service?

Does anyone know if the Newcastle & North Tyneside day ticket is available on the 74/X84/X85 or if this can only be purchased on North Tyneside depot based services?

There isn't really much u can change. Its a nexus funded service but your asking GNE to do something about it. Good luck with that

Here's a weird one, how about a express version of the 8 or 78 maybe a couple of journeys a day.

(05 Jan 2022, 4:40 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote Here's a weird one, how about a express version of the 8 or 78 maybe a couple of journeys a day.

Can’t see that happening in these days, many decades ago the X6 used to be the express between Sunderland and consett, used to take an hour from end to end


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(05 Jan 2022, 1:58 am)OrangeArrow49 wrote I travelled on the 42A yesterday for the full route from Kingston Park to Wallsend and it got busier closer to Wallsend. Could this service be made fully commercially viable? What changes are needed to improve the service?

Does anyone know if the Newcastle & North Tyneside day ticket is available on the 74/X84/X85 or if this can only be purchased on North Tyneside depot based services?

What were the numbers like before it got closer to Wallsend, and by busier, roughly how many passengers?

Obviously it's only your experience of one journey, but be interesting to know the numbers involved.

(05 Jan 2022, 1:58 am)OrangeArrow49 wrote I travelled on the 42A yesterday for the full route from Kingston Park to Wallsend and it got busier closer to Wallsend. Could this service be made fully commercially viable? What changes are needed to improve the service?

Does anyone know if the Newcastle & North Tyneside day ticket is available on the 74/X84/X85 or if this can only be purchased on North Tyneside depot based services?

Withdraw the route north of Killingworth. It's impossible otherwise (it's the only part not commercial anyway I believe).

(05 Jan 2022, 4:58 pm)Adrian wrote What were the numbers like before it got closer to Wallsend, and by busier, roughly how many passengers?

Obviously it's only your experience of one journey, but be interesting to know the numbers involved.

Seemed busy. Quite a few people travel futher past Killingworth. I think the Kingston Park to Dinnington is only there because there isn't a link there. If gne were to withdraw that part. Arriva could possibly extend the 44 or 45 to the airport and have the metro link to Kingston Park

(05 Jan 2022, 4:58 pm)Adrian wrote What were the numbers like before it got closer to Wallsend, and by busier, roughly how many passengers?

Obviously it's only your experience of one journey, but be interesting to know the numbers involved.

There were 3 passengers on at Kingston Park, including myself. 25 passengers on arrival into Wallsend Town Centre. 40 passengers or so in total across the journey. From Kingston Park the other passenger alighted in Killingworth. Passengers boarded in Benton, Seaton Burn and Wideopen. A passenger also got off at Quorum Business Park.

I've used the 42A a small number of times, but only ever from Wallsend or Killingworth to Kingston Park and it's usually been empty for most of the route. Killingworth from Wallsend gets a small number of passengers.

(03 Jan 2022, 10:49 pm)Jimmi wrote I'm proposing GNE run multiple long distance services to/from Newton Aycliffe to the likes of York, Leeds, Sheffield, Manchester etc seem as we're suggesting stuff that offers little benefit to anyone and be commercial suicide

Seriously though, think 684 is at least partially funded (unsure if the Newcastle end is) and unsure why on earth the 74 would justify Versas when it doesn't even fill a Solo.

Is there anything with an X prefix that's actually an express these days in fairness?

Versa 5379 on the final trip each way on the 74 this afternoon. An Orbit StreetLite based at Hexham. Solos days numbered?

(05 Jan 2022, 6:17 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote There were 3 passengers on at Kingston Park, including myself. 25 passengers on arrival into Wallsend Town Centre. 40 passengers or so in total across the journey. From Kingston Park the other passenger alighted in Killingworth. Passengers boarded in Benton, Seaton Burn and Wideopen. A passenger also got off at Quorum Business Park.

I've used the 42A a small number of times, but only ever from Wallsend or Killingworth to Kingston Park and it's usually been empty for most of the route. Killingworth from Wallsend gets a small number of passengers.

I'd have thought those Solos would have been bursting at the seams in and out of Kingston Park, given all the 'potential' there is suggested on here.

(05 Jan 2022, 7:12 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote Versa 5379 on the final trip each way on the 74 this afternoon. An Orbit StreetLite based at Hexham. Solos days numbered?

You'd assume the Orbit Streetlite is on loan rather than a permanent allocation (perhaps covering for 5508 which hasn't been in service for a while according to BusTimes).

I think there are a few factors suggesting that the current Solo's won't be running out of Hexham for much longer. Firstly if GNE are successful in their ZEBRA bus fund bid then they will be replaced with electric vehicles. Secondly, service 74 at least will require a Euro 6 vehicle as it goes into Newcastle (and GNE don't seem to be upgrading any Solo's to Euro 6) and potentially (though I'm purely speculating) the contracts for the Hexham services may stipulate Euro 6 vehicles going forwards in which case the Solo's will almost certainly be replaced. I'd imagine, this will allow some of the older SR's to be withdrawn now they're pushing on 10 years.

(05 Jan 2022, 8:56 pm)peter wrote I'd imagine, this will allow some of the older SR's to be withdrawn or move into the driver training fleet (it's mentioned on the GNE Fleet Archive that Solo's are to become the main training vehicle).

I'd hope not.

Even if drivers start out typically driving minibus routes, learning and passing the test in a full size vehicle seems sensible longer term.

Fair enough use the Solos afterwards to allow the adjustment between the door forward and wheel forward configurations.

(05 Jan 2022, 7:12 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote Versa 5379 on the final trip each way on the 74 this afternoon. An Orbit StreetLite based at Hexham. Solos days numbered?

Seemingly down to operational issues, 670 was sat just outside of Maften (Hexham bound) for nearly an hour and likely was all that was avaliable to go on the 74 after 635 replaced 5379 on the X84/X85 at around 14:30 with 668 also being on X84/X85 for most of the day.

(05 Jan 2022, 8:56 pm)peter wrote You'd assume the Orbit Streetlite is on loan rather than a permanent allocation (perhaps covering for 5508 which hasn't been in service for a while according to BusTimes).

I think there are a few factors suggesting that the current Solo's won't be running out of Hexham for much longer. Firstly if GNE are successful in their ZEBRA bus fund bid then they will be replaced with electric vehicles. Secondly, service 74 at least will require a Euro 6 vehicle as it goes into Newcastle (and GNE don't seem to be upgrading any Solo's to Euro 6) and potentially (though I'm purely speculating) the contracts for the Hexham services may stipulate Euro 6 vehicles going forwards in which case the Solo's will almost certainly be replaced. I'd imagine, this will allow some of the older SR's to be withdrawn or move into the driver training fleet (it's mentioned on the GNE Fleet Archive that Solo's are to become the main training vehicle).

Yes, the Orbit Streetlite will be on loan to Hexham, but I think it might run on service 74, but I could be wrong and it could be covering for 5508, maybe on the X84/X85.

Interesting times ahead for Hexham depot, could GNE lose the Hexham contracts this year realistically?

(05 Jan 2022, 9:03 pm)S813 FVK wrote I'd hope not.

Even if drivers start out typically driving minibus routes, learning and passing the test in a full size vehicle seems sensible longer term.

Fair enough use the Solos afterwards to allow the adjustment between the door forward and wheel forward configurations.

Sorry I misread the quote slightly: "Increased training on minibuses will now take place after new drivers pass their PCV tests, with this being the main vehicle type most new drivers will drive" - so exactly as you say, increased use after drivers have passed.

(05 Jan 2022, 9:03 pm)S813 FVK wrote I'd hope not.

Even if drivers start out typically driving minibus routes, learning and passing the test in a full size vehicle seems sensible longer term.

Fair enough use the Solos afterwards to allow the adjustment between the door forward and wheel forward configurations.

Only one Solo is allocated to Driver Training (723). The other buses are, and will remain, full-size single decks.


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(05 Jan 2022, 9:12 pm)Dan wrote Only one Solo is allocated to Driver Training (723). The other buses are, and will remain, full-size single decks.


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Thanks for clearing that up Dan!

(05 Jan 2022, 9:12 pm)Dan wrote Only one Solo is allocated to Driver Training (723). The other buses are, and will remain, full-size single decks.


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Most enlightening m9

(05 Jan 2022, 7:28 pm)Adrian wrote I'd have thought those Solos would have been bursting at the seams in and out of Kingston Park, given all the 'potential' there is suggested on here.

Kingston Park does arguably have potential, being so close to Great Park and the airport with a good range of shops and plenty of people living there and in the surrounding area. Interesting how passengers do travel between Killingworth and Kingston Park, and even between Wallsend and Dinnington. Just wondered if anything would make the service more commercially viable (maybe quicker journeys or unique links?). 42A is a good route with nice scenery and some useful links. Also it seems difficult to get the North Tyne day ticket on Hexham depot services unfortunately, so the 42A from Kingston Park is useful for that.

(05 Jan 2022, 9:09 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote Yes, the Orbit Streetlite will be on loan to Hexham, but I think it might run on service 74, but I could be wrong and it could be covering for 5508, maybe on the X84/X85.

Interesting times ahead for Hexham depot, could GNE lose the Hexham contracts this year realistically?

I believe 5443 covered for a breakdown on the 10 at the Newcastle end, and therefore ended up at Hexham. Nothing much more to that.

I very much doubt GNE would lose the Hexham contracts. As much as you might think, I doubt anyone else is in a good position to bid for them.

(05 Jan 2022, 10:36 pm)Thomas12 wrote I believe 5443 covered for a breakdown on the 10 at the Newcastle end, and therefore ended up at Hexham. Nothing much more to that.

I very much doubt GNE would lose the Hexham contracts. As much as you might think, I doubt anyone else is in a good position to bid for them.

Didn't they lose a few last time they came around to PCL, Rural Link, whatever name it is this week. If anything they might gain some.

(05 Jan 2022, 11:07 pm)Storx wrote Didn't they lose a few last time they came around to PCL, Rural Link, whatever name it is this week. If anything they might gain some.

I think it was the opposite, that they gained a few contracts in recent years, I recall the 680 used to be operated by an independent and then they gained the X81/681/185. PCL operate a handful of services which operate 1-day a week in the Hexham area - don't think any of these were previously with GNE.

(05 Jan 2022, 11:14 pm)peter wrote I think it was the opposite, that they gained a few contracts in recent years, I recall the 680 used to be operated by an independent and then they gained the X81/681/185. PCL operate a handful of services which operate 1-day a week in the Hexham area - don't think any of these were previously with GNE.

Ah possibly then might have got mixed up with something elsewhere. I know there was the big scandal with tachometers at Snaiths which muddles everything up which is when they gained some of those I believe.

(05 Jan 2022, 10:36 pm)Thomas12 wrote I believe 5443 covered for a breakdown on the 10 at the Newcastle end, and therefore ended up at Hexham. Nothing much more to that.

I very much doubt GNE would lose the Hexham contracts. As much as you might think, I doubt anyone else is in a good position to bid for them.

Ah, okay. I like the Orbit Streetlites. 

Hopefully GNE will keep them. No idea when they are going to be awarded. GNE is the best operator, but Stagecoach and Phoenix could pick up a few. Stagecoach 74, Phoenix the Hexham town services. Yesterday I was thinking Henry Cooper having their depot in Annitsford could operate the 42/42A?

(05 Jan 2022, 11:42 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote Ah, okay. I like the Orbit Streetlites. 

Hopefully GNE will keep them. No idea when they are going to be awarded. GNE is the best operator, but Stagecoach and Phoenix could pick up a few. Stagecoach 74, Phoenix the Hexham town services. Yesterday I was thinking Henry Cooper having their depot in Annitsford could operate the 42/42A?

Bit impossible since they have 4 services "service " buses available 

This being Volvo B7RLE Wright Eclipse 2 
3515 HX & OBR 297

There Scania N230UD OmniCity HC10 PER & there Plaxton Concept HC04 BBB. In order for it to work during evening/Sunday would be to get two other Volvo B7RLE Wright Eclipse 2

(05 Jan 2022, 11:42 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote Ah, okay. I like the Orbit Streetlites. 

Hopefully GNE will keep them. No idea when they are going to be awarded. GNE is the best operator, but Stagecoach and Phoenix could pick up a few. Stagecoach 74, Phoenix the Hexham town services. Yesterday I was thinking Henry Cooper having their depot in Annitsford could operate the 42/42A?

I don’t think Stagecoach would operate the 74 - it’s a lot of dead mileage. 

Similar for Phoenix I guess - unless they were to open an outstation of some sort.

I guess ‘Rural Link’ or whatever they’re called these days would be the most likely apart from Go North East, although I’d like to hope they’d not get anything based on how bad they are.

(05 Jan 2022, 3:34 am)Train8261 wrote There isn't really much u can change. Its a nexus funded service but your asking GNE to do something about it. Good luck with that

Isn’t the 42A commercial from Wallsend to Dinnington? The destinations used to show Dinnington for Kingston Park.

(06 Jan 2022, 10:16 am)RMF1254 wrote Isn’t the 42A commercial from Wallsend to Dinnington? The destinations used to show Dinnington for Kingston Park.

Correct. 42A displayed the destination as Dinnington for Kingston Park because the service operated to and from North Shields and because Kingston Park is too far away from North Shields it needed to be a split registeration and destination. Since running only to and from Wallsend the destination has been displayed as Kingston Park.

The 42A was commercially operated between Dinnington and North Shields and is still a commercial service between Dinnington and Wallsend.