Seen this on another fourm:

Latest set of accounts for the year ending June 22 have been published and show a loss of over £4,000,000. Which is worse than the previous year.

------------


4 million loss?, that's crazy

Seen this on another fourm:

Latest set of accounts for the year ending June 22 have been published and show a loss of over £4,000,000. Which is worse than the previous year.

------------


4 million loss?, that's crazy

It's really only £1.9m when you take the bs out but it's still not ideal mind.

It's really only £1.9m when you take the bs out but it's still not ideal mind.

Ah right, have you got the full info?

Ah right, have you got the full info?

Aye, accounts are here - https://find-and-update.company-informat...ng-history

There's a £2.8m goodwill write off though which has knocked it to make it look worse because the value of the whole company has took a hit. There's absolutely nothing positive there mind and is pretty much all about cuts.

The COVID funds has dropped from £22m to £11m though. Not much more to say really.

Aye, accounts are here - https://find-and-update.company-informat...ng-history

There's a £2.8m goodwill write off though which has knocked it to make it look worse because the value of the whole company has took a hit. There's absolutely nothing positive there mind and is pretty much all about cuts.

The COVID funds has dropped from £22m to £11m though. Not much more to say really.

Thank you!

That's not good, if its all about cuts

Thank you!

That's not good, if its all about cuts 

Yeah, all about rationalisation of routes, backroom reductions etc, they're straight from it. Mind this is 7 months ago though. The last MD (I always spell his name wrong ha) did resign though and wasn't forced out.

Yeah, all about rationalisation of routes, backroom reductions etc, they're straight from it. Mind this is 7 months ago though. The last MD (I always spell his name wrong ha) did resign though and wasn't forced out.

Jumped before pushed springs to mind. 

His tenure was a disaster, seemed to have no idea how to rationalise spending post-Covid, and it'll take a lot of work for the staff who are left to get the company back to where it was.

Jumped before pushed springs to mind. 

His tenure was a disaster, seemed to have no idea how to rationalise spending post-Covid, and it'll take a lot of work for the staff who are left to get the company back to where it was.

Aye can't disagree at all tbh. I seen that Hornby has flee'd from Transdev Blazefield to McGills aswell which are absolute car crash lately aswell. 

Come across as MD's who can do well when the going is well but with any form of pressure fold like a pack of cards. Hornbys departure from Transdev is just weird as it's as if he got the boot with no thanks and going MIA for months.

Be interesting to see how the ENCTS reductions affect GNE as their remaining Durham ops are rather weak as it is. The Consett area in particular is in freefall.

£4m loss

If you look closely it is not really a loss and pretty much break even

The liabilities to be paid out within 1 year had reduced to bizarrely a similar figure

The operating costs for CLS depot will be a saving aswell as the sale of the site although yeah it is a one off offsett cash injection

£4M loss would of been capital expenditure to install Electric charging at Riverside as well as purchase of new buses etc... And diesel has been around £1.70-£1.80 a litre however wholesale is going down and average cheapest is around £1.41.9 £1.46.9 or just over 150p a litre at present that £4m will be saved just in fuel alone

Those figures in the balance sheet seem fair and nothing to be worried about

£4m loss

If you look closely it is not really a loss and pretty much break even

The liabilities to be paid out within 1 year had reduced to bizarrely a similar figure

The operating costs for CLS depot will be a saving aswell as the sale of the site  although yeah it is a one off offsett cash injection

£4M loss would of been capital expenditure to install Electric charging at Riverside as well as purchase of new buses etc... And diesel has been around £1.70-£1.80 a litre however wholesale is going down and average cheapest is around £1.41.9 £1.46.9 or just over 150p a litre  at present that £4m will be saved just in fuel alone  

Those figures in the balance sheet seem fair and nothing to be worried about

They bought the fuel in advance through the fuel hedging scheme.
Possibly 2-3 years ago when it was at recent lows.

The issue with resent fuel prices shouldn't impact until a year or twos time.

There was a section on the corporate website that showed shareholders how little they were paying for fuel and how proud they were of these savings. Contradicting everything we ever saw shared with passengers about fare increases due to fuel costs. 
However, it has either been removed or hidden, because a quick Google check can't find it.

£4m loss

If you look closely it is not really a loss and pretty much break even

The liabilities to be paid out within 1 year had reduced to bizarrely a similar figure

The operating costs for CLS depot will be a saving aswell as the sale of the site  although yeah it is a one off offsett cash injection

£4M loss would of been capital expenditure to install Electric charging at Riverside as well as purchase of new buses etc... And diesel has been around £1.70-£1.80 a litre however wholesale is going down and average cheapest is around £1.41.9 £1.46.9 or just over 150p a litre  at present that £4m will be saved just in fuel alone 

Those figures in the balance sheet seem fair and nothing to be worried about

I don't want to be a dick but your just completely wrong here. 

The loss was £1.9m there's no other ways of putting it. 

Capital expenditure doesn't affect the profit and loss at all and just affects the balance sheet so buying electric chargers etc won't change it and as someone said after fuel is hedged. The losses come on the balance sheet as depreciation over the life of the asset (15 years for buses etc) 

Not to mention that there's £11m worth of Covid funds there and Co. Durham has just cut the concessonary pass rebursal rate.

It's grim reading (hence the cuts left, right and centre).

I don't want to be a dick but your just completely wrong here. 

The loss was £1.9m there's no other ways of putting it. 

Capital expenditure doesn't affect the profit and loss at all and just affects the balance sheet so buying electric chargers etc won't change it and as someone said after fuel is hedged. The losses come on the balance sheet as depreciation over the life of the asset (15 years for buses etc) 

Not to mention that there's £11m worth of Covid funds there and Co. Durham has just cut the concessonary pass rebursal rate.

It's grim reading (hence the cuts left, right and centre).

The forthcoming replacement of Bus Recovery Grant by BSOG+ of about only 50% of the value ain’t going to help either…..

The forthcoming replacement of Bus Recovery Grant by BSOG+ of about only 50% of the value ain’t going to help either…..

Yeah totally agreed without radical change or subsidies I can see some bleak times ahead for buses and not just GNE. 

Sub urban networks regardless to where they are seem to be in free for all and is where they're struggling to pick up. 

Wouldn't be surprised to see more of what's happened with Arriva in Cheshire around the country and especially with one of the operators up here just saying enough is enough I'm not serving there anymore. Not sure where mind.

Tbf in the case of Hornby, as much as he’s a dull Stenning French acolyte…it’s likely he’s been working his 3 month notice/gardening leave hence his quiet period.

It’s clear GNE wasted a lot a of money, they didn’t adapt quickly enough to the post covid world and didn’t/don’t have the commercial expertise to innovate. I can’t blame them for frittering away the ridiculous money thrown at them during lockdown. Who wouldn’t?

MG was a failure. Right man, wrong time you could argue but the enthusiast lip service, the repaints, the branding…very naive.

The most disappointing post covid failure of GNE for me is that it’s abandoned customer service, it doesn’t interact on Twitter or any social media…who on gods earth thought that was a customer experience strategy? I can email, call or live chat….during office hours…it’s 2023. Let’s grow the customer base by…ignoring it and sticking to an early 2000s CEX strategy

But it’s investing in paper timetables…it’s so backward in coming forward it’s unreal.

How on earth have they lost 4 million

How on earth have they lost 4 million

For the same reasons all bus operators have seen a huge loss of revenue: poor patronage recovery following the pandemic.

Profits were hardly strong at GNE pre-Covid, and have been in constant decline since 2015.

The issues with Go North East’s finances have likely been exacerbated by fares which are, in the main, too cheap. The previous Managing Director took a huge gamble by reducing and simplifying fares. Unfortunately this did not result in the growth required for the scheme to wash its face.

One could argue this was due to the early recovery of services following the pandemic, or due to the poor operational performance (now, in the main, a thing of the past)… Who knows.

The large loss of revenue paired with ever-increasing costs (including a real terms pay increase of 15-20% in July 2022 to help attract and retain driving staff) is a recipe for disaster.

The new executive team in place at Go North East seem far more cost-focused - this is evident through a distinct lack of repaints/refurbishments, spend on discretionary items, the early termination of some loss-making contracts, and a well-publicised restructure of clerical staff and management.

The company is very clearly now in a turnaround. I suspect it will be a long time before any “gambles” to improve revenue will be taken - new fare initiatives, network changes, or otherwise.

The fact operators will only receive around 50% of the Government support they currently receive from 1 July, paired with alleged reductions in ENCTS payments from local authorities (as has been suggested is the reason for impending cuts at Arriva) won’t do any good at all for the profits of any operators in the region.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

For the same reasons all bus operators have seen a huge loss of revenue: poor patronage recovery following the pandemic.

Profits were hardly strong at GNE pre-Covid, and have been in constant decline since 2015.

The issues with Go North East’s finances have likely been exacerbated by fares which are, in the main, too cheap. The previous Managing Director took a huge gamble by reducing and simplifying fares. Unfortunately this did not result in the growth required for the scheme to wash its face.

One could argue this was due to the early recovery of services following the pandemic, or due to the poor operational performance (now, in the main, a thing of the past)… Who knows.

The large loss of revenue paired with ever-increasing costs (including a real terms pay increase of 15-20% in July 2022 to help attract and retain driving staff) is a recipe for disaster.

The new executive team in place at Go North East seem far more cost-focused - this is evident through a distinct lack of repaints/refurbishments, spend on discretionary items, the early termination of some loss-making contracts, and a well-publicised restructure of clerical staff and management.

The company is very clearly now in a turnaround. I suspect it will be a long time before any “gambles” to improve revenue will be taken - new fare initiatives, network changes, or otherwise.

The fact operators will only receive around 50% of the Government support they currently receive from 1 July, paired with alleged reductions in ENCTS payments from local authorities (as has been suggested is the reason for impending cuts at Arriva) won’t do any good at all for the profits of any operators in the region.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Do we know if SCNE/ANE have made any profits, or when/if we will know?

Are GNE in a profitable state, as ending July 22 was nearly a year ago

Do we know if SCNE/ANE have made any profits, or when/if we will know?

Are GNE in a profitable state, as ending July 22 was nearly a year ago

The accounts for April 2021-22 show:
Busways made a pre-tax profit of £4.565M and Transit made a pre-tax loss of £14.738M (Profit of £1.026M if you exclude the exceptional payment).

Busways: https://find-and-update.company-informat...ng-history
Transit: https://find-and-update.company-informat...ng-history

Arriva don't appear to have filed accounts beyond December 2020 - and they only filed that one in January last year.

Do we know if SCNE/ANE have made any profits, or when/if we will know?

Are GNE in a profitable state, as ending July 22 was nearly a year ago

Stagecoach made £3.9m upto Y/E Apr' 22 (excluding intercompany loans).
Arriva accounts are delayed.

Stagecoach has £9.5m in government grants though including the Covid funds and made £6.5m or so before Covid to put it into context. I wouldn't be surprised to see Stagecoach is in dire state as much as other operators outside of the core Newcastle routes which a monkey could run.

Stagecoach made £3.9m upto Y/E Apr' 22 (excluding intercompany loans).
Arriva accounts are delayed.

Stagecoach has £9.5m in government grants though including the Covid funds and made £6.5m or so before Covid to put it into context. I wouldn't be surprised to see Stagecoach is in dire state as much as other operators outside of the core Newcastle routes which a monkey could run.

Is that SCNE? Also yeah if GNE had 3-4 more strong routes like the 21, like SCNE do in Newcastle.

Is that SCNE? Also yeah if GNE had 3-4 more strong routes like the 21, like SCNE do in Newcastle.

Just the T&W Depots, the Stockton area depots are a separate company, someone posted it just before me believe they made loss without checking.

Yeah, Stagecoach pretty much have all the goldmine routes in Newcastle and to be fair in Sunderland aswell really.

Teesside sounds like it's in a dire state and if the rumoured pensioner pass cuts come in could mean big trouble in some areas, in particular Hartlepool, as whenever I see buses down there passing by the few times I'm there it's full of them. Mind it could be toxic in Derwentside / East Durham aswell, it's been cut to the bone already especially with GNE and Arriva done it years ago pretty much.

Just the T&W Depots, the Stockton area depots are a separate company, someone posted it just before me believe they made loss without checking.

Yeah, Stagecoach pretty much have all the goldmine routes in Newcastle and to be fair in Sunderland aswell really.

Teesside sounds like it's in a dire state and if the rumoured pensioner pass cuts come in could mean big trouble in some areas, in particular Hartlepool, as whenever I see buses down there passing by the few times I'm there it's full of them. Mind it could be toxic in Derwentside / East Durham aswell, it's been cut to the bone already especially with GNE and Arriva done it years ago pretty much.

Sunderland I would say is a mix but they do have a lot of great routes, 16/20/3/4, but clearly the 12/13 aren't doing the best, 

GNE i would say 20/56/60/33/2/2A

The new executive team in place at Go North East seem far more cost-focused - this is evident through a distinct lack of repaints/refurbishments, spend on discretionary items, the early termination of some loss-making contracts, and a well-publicised restructure of clerical staff and management.

The company is very clearly now in a turnaround. I suspect it will be a long time before any “gambles” to improve revenue will be taken - new fare initiatives, network changes, or otherwise.

The fact operators will only receive around 50% of the Government support they currently receive from 1 July, paired with alleged reductions in ENCTS payments from local authorities (as has been suggested is the reason for impending cuts at Arriva) won’t do any good at all for the profits of any operators in the region.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

In a turnaround? Fares are too cheap…uh huh….ok….

Until we get back to a point of public service being properly supported (and properly operated with that cash) and spend less time worrying about a faceless corporate entities profits then nothing will improve. It’ll be interesting to see how Liverpool and Manchesters franchised networks work out and whether we can follow that model regionally alas, I’ve even less faith in our regional leaders and nexus/Gannons whingy transport coalition than I do in GNE

In a turnaround? Fares are too cheap…uh huh….ok….

Until we get back to a point of public service being properly supported (and properly operated with that cash) and spend less time worrying about a faceless corporate entities profits then nothing will improve. It’ll be interesting to see how Liverpool and Manchesters franchised networks work out and whether we can follow that model regionally alas, I’ve even less faith in our regional leaders and nexus/Gannons whingy transport coalition than I do in GNE

I’d argue a lot of operators would jump at the chance of franchising when the industry is in the state it is in at the moment.

What’s to complain about - no revenue risk, guaranteed margin (assuming costings are correct!), and so on…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

In a turnaround? Fares are too cheap…uh huh….ok….

Until we get back to a point of public service being properly supported (and properly operated with that cash) and spend less time worrying about a faceless corporate entities profits then nothing will improve. It’ll be interesting to see how Liverpool and Manchesters franchised networks work out and whether we can follow that model regionally alas, I’ve even less faith in our regional leaders and nexus/Gannons whingy transport coalition than I do in GNE

Some GNE fares are clearly below the price that they need to be - Concord to Sunderland £2.30 single for example.

it will be interesting to see if Manchester can afford franchising - we won’t know until at least 2026 once all areas are franchised.
It will also be interesting to find out what the Bee Network fares are when Andy B announces them next month.

Some GNE fares are clearly below the price that they need to be - Concord to Sunderland £2.30 single for example.

it will be interesting to see if Manchester can afford franchising - we won’t know until at least 2026 once all areas are franchised.
It will also be interesting to find out what the Bee Network fares are when Andy B announces them next month.

It's still not cheap though and most customers aren't going to see it that way to be fair. And that's just for a one way journey for one person. Whole different ball game if people are traveling as a family. I can't blame people for choosing the car to be honest. Of course I understand that GNE needs to find a way of turning things around but at the same time they have to be careful not to push more people away because it will only make matters worse in the long run.

Some GNE fares are clearly below the price that they need to be - Concord to Sunderland £2.30 single for example.

Really? I'd argue £2.30 is about right for travel from Concord into Sunderland. It's a cross city fare after all, the old pricing used to be quite ridiculous imo.

Really? I'd argue £2.30 is about right for travel from Concord into Sunderland. It's a cross city fare after all, the old pricing used to be quite ridiculous imo.

Pre Covid. Birtley to Newcastle was £3.80, the same distance miles wise. 

Someone is either being massively undercharged or hugely overcharged. I’ve made a lot more leisure journeys since the £2 cam in but at full price. I’d always take a taxi in a group or a car if with just the family

Pre Covid. Birtley to Newcastle was £3.80, the same distance miles wise. 

Someone is either being massively undercharged or hugely overcharged….

i would say that's extortionate

wasn't sure where to put this but here seems the most reasonable.

The fun police was getting a GNE bus back home from work and a bloke go on with £10 note, She said the driver said to him just get on? I thought this was a bit strange, surley a driver would have 8 quid in change? Then last night on the 28b a bloke was going to let me on before him but he had been there longer than me and he got on with a tenner and the same thing happened? Then muggings ( me ) get on with 2 x £1 coins and i have to pay. to top it off he was still on the bus when i got off!! no wonder GNE are skink and i am skint to!!