(10 Apr 2014, 4:47 pm)Tom wrote I know the 1/17 is separate to the NTL.

i think one rota is 1/1A/9/17/17A
other rota is 19/309/310/X93 while the rest is 40/41/80/327 anyways my photo if 4931 is now on flickr the rear of it photod by me earlier on https://www.flickr.com/photos/bazza90/13762827604/

Are there any rotas are Jesmond, e.g Nexus Bus and normal services?

For me it would look like this;

* I'm pretty sure all Unit 1's drive the mainstream services as a result of experience and that all drivers start on Unit 2 and rise up to Unit 1.

Hexham Unit 1 - TEN, X84/X85
Hexham Unit 2 - H11, AD122 and all the other local services

Percy Main Unit 1 - Cobalts, Coaster
Percy Main Unit 2 - 9, 17, 17A, 40, 41

I know this was probably brought up when Riverside was formed, but I do know all Winlaton changeovers happen at the Metrocentre, and all Winlaton drivers no longer have the 5 at the beginning of their driver number but a 4 then a 5-9 number following it. I'm think Gateshead drivers got lucky and other than a few services transferred from Saltmeadows (driven by Saltmeadows drivers?), nothings really changed for them other than no parking spaces offered to neither near the depot (other than the main road). I wouldn't know where to start with their Units, other than that I know Unit 4 is for the X66 and other routes that require experienced drivers.

Also worth noting, I was told by one of Chester's Unit 1 drivers that their rotor is 36 weeks long and they work their way down it (obviously repeating several duties), however when the shift changes occur I believe the duty numbers stay the same but the shifts change slightly as a result. Basically to sum up this marathon post;

Unit 1 - Experienced drivers and Mainstream routes
Unit 2 - Less Experienced drivers and Less Mainstream routes

(10 Apr 2014, 5:35 pm)Marcus wrote Also worth noting, I was told by one of Chester's Unit 1 drivers that their rotor is 36 weeks long and they work their way down it (obviously repeating several duties), however when the shift changes occur I believe the duty numbers stay the same but the shifts change slightly as a result. Basically to sum up this marathon post;

There are multiple rota's within a business unit......4 and 5 day paid meal breaks, 4 and 5 day unpaid meal breaks, then there could be a late rota, part time rota, and even a rota whereby the drivers have requested a 'special' line due to personal issues.

By the way the Cobalts and Coaster are on separate units at PM, and the TEN's are separate to the Tynedale Xpress, but of course that does not stop drivers covering work from different business units if required.

(10 Apr 2014, 5:35 pm)Marcus wrote For me it would look like this;

* I'm pretty sure all Unit 1's drive the mainstream services as a result of experience and that all drivers start on Unit 2 and rise up to Unit 1.

Hexham Unit 1 - TEN, X84/X85
Hexham Unit 2 - H11, AD122 and all the other local services

Percy Main Unit 1 - Cobalts, Coaster
Percy Main Unit 2 - 9, 17, 17A, 40, 41

I know this was probably brought up when Riverside was formed, but I do know all Winlaton changeovers happen at the Metrocentre, and all Winlaton drivers no longer have the 5 at the beginning of their driver number but a 4 then a 5-9 number following it. I'm think Gateshead drivers got lucky and other than a few services transferred from Saltmeadows (driven by Saltmeadows drivers?), nothings really changed for them other than no parking spaces offered to neither near the depot (other than the main road). I wouldn't know where to start with their Units, other than that I know Unit 4 is for the X66 and other routes that require experienced drivers.

Also worth noting, I was told by one of Chester's Unit 1 drivers that their rotor is 36 weeks long and they work their way down it (obviously repeating several duties), however when the shift changes occur I believe the duty numbers stay the same but the shifts change slightly as a result. Basically to sum up this marathon post;

Unit 1 - Experienced drivers and Mainstream routes
Unit 2 - Less Experienced drivers and Less Mainstream routes

And the 71 falls into this category?

When it was the 21a, then it obviously fitted in due to the 21s interworking. If it still sits in Unit 1, then it is obviously just a legacy from that, other than anything else.

(10 Apr 2014, 5:35 pm)Marcus wrote For me it would look like this;

* I'm pretty sure all Unit 1's drive the mainstream services as a result of experience and that all drivers start on Unit 2 and rise up to Unit 1.

Hexham Unit 1 - TEN, X84/X85
Hexham Unit 2 - H11, AD122 and all the other local services

Percy Main Unit 1 - Cobalts, Coaster
Percy Main Unit 2 - 9, 17, 17A, 40, 41

I know this was probably brought up when Riverside was formed, but I do know all Winlaton changeovers happen at the Metrocentre, and all Winlaton drivers no longer have the 5 at the beginning of their driver number but a 4 then a 5-9 number following it. I'm think Gateshead drivers got lucky and other than a few services transferred from Saltmeadows (driven by Saltmeadows drivers?), nothings really changed for them other than no parking spaces offered to neither near the depot (other than the main road). I wouldn't know where to start with their Units, other than that I know Unit 4 is for the X66 and other routes that require experienced drivers.

Also worth noting, I was told by one of Chester's Unit 1 drivers that their rotor is 36 weeks long and they work their way down it (obviously repeating several duties), however when the shift changes occur I believe the duty numbers stay the same but the shifts change slightly as a result. Basically to sum up this marathon post;

Unit 1 - Experienced drivers and Mainstream routes
Unit 2 - Less Experienced drivers and Less Mainstream routes

Not true. Many Unit 2 employees have a considerable amount of service but choose to be there due to personal preference. When I first started at Chester I was asked to go into unit 1 as I had held my PCV for a number of years.

So is Saltmeadows all the same rota?

(10 Apr 2014, 6:08 pm)Tom wrote So is Saltmeadows all the same rota?

No

(10 Apr 2014, 5:35 pm)Marcus wrote For me it would look like this;

* I'm pretty sure all Unit 1's drive the mainstream services as a result of experience and that all drivers start on Unit 2 and rise up to Unit 1.

Hexham Unit 1 - TEN, X84/X85
Hexham Unit 2 - H11, AD122 and all the other local services

Percy Main Unit 1 - Cobalts, Coaster
Percy Main Unit 2 - 9, 17, 17A, 40, 41

I know this was probably brought up when Riverside was formed, but I do know all Winlaton changeovers happen at the Metrocentre, and all Winlaton drivers no longer have the 5 at the beginning of their driver number but a 4 then a 5-9 number following it. I'm think Gateshead drivers got lucky and other than a few services transferred from Saltmeadows (driven by Saltmeadows drivers?), nothings really changed for them other than no parking spaces offered to neither near the depot (other than the main road). I wouldn't know where to start with their Units, other than that I know Unit 4 is for the X66 and other routes that require experienced drivers.

Also worth noting, I was told by one of Chester's Unit 1 drivers that their rotor is 36 weeks long and they work their way down it (obviously repeating several duties), however when the shift changes occur I believe the duty numbers stay the same but the shifts change slightly as a result. Basically to sum up this marathon post;

Unit 1 - Experienced drivers and Mainstream routes
Unit 2 - Less Experienced drivers and Less Mainstream routes

think X40 and X66 are the same it requires you to know how to drive an artic

(10 Apr 2014, 6:33 pm)danpick wrote think X40 and X66 are the same it requires you to know how to drive an artic

2 different rota's within Riverside

(10 Apr 2014, 6:26 pm)citaro5284 wrote No

Nexus Bus/Quaylink/27X and South Tyne?

(10 Apr 2014, 5:57 pm)RGR756V wrote Not true. Many Unit 2 employees have a considerable amount of service but choose to be there due to personal preference. When I first started at Chester I was asked to go into unit 1 as I had held my PCV for a number of years.

I know that a lot of Unit 2 employees (I know one who did cover on Unit 1 for a couple of months and went back to Unit 2 because Unit 1 was like hell going backwards and forwards all day on the 21, for some reason he didn't get many runs on the X25 or 71) choose to stay on Unit 2 instead of going backwards and forwards all day, I'm just saying new PCV qualified drivers that have trained with the company start on Unit 2 for a number of reasons.

* A lot of varied routes to get them used to learning and remembering
* A variety of vehicles (mainly single deckers)
* Less pressure and less demanding than Unit 1

With Stanley I'm not entirely sure however, I think they start on Unit 1 and go onto Unit 2, or like Chester it could be the other way around?

(10 Apr 2014, 5:44 pm)citaro5284 wrote There are multiple rota's within a business unit......4 and 5 day paid meal breaks, 4 and 5 day unpaid meal breaks, then there could be a late rota, part time rota, and even a rota whereby the drivers have requested a 'special' line due to personal issues.

By the way the Cobalts and Coaster are on separate units at PM, and the TEN's are separate to the Tynedale Xpress, but of course that does not stop drivers covering work from different business units if required.

I'm quite surprised that unpaid breaks exist, baring in mind the nature of the industry. I realise it's not a legal requirement in the UK, but is this industry standard nowadays?

What happens if a late running service causes you to run into your break. Does the driver still get the full break, or would that cause a potential knock on affect on the driver's next assignment on rota? Not to mention that it creates a two tier workforce.

(10 Apr 2014, 6:42 pm)aureolin wrote I'm quite surprised that unpaid breaks exist, baring in mind the nature of the industry. I realise it's not a legal requirement in the UK, but is this industry standard nowadays?

What happens if a late running service causes you to run into your break. Does the driver still get the full break, or would that cause a potential knock on affect on the driver's next assignment on rota? Not to mention that it creates a two tier workforce.

Depends on the length of the break - if you're only 5 minutes late off for an hour, then that would be legal. But come off 5 minutes late for a 36 minutes break, then either part of your second half is covered to allow you to finish having your break or you take the service over late (legally the minimum break is 35 minutes after 4 hours 30minutes+).

Plus, there's now very few operators that offer paid meal breaks - as far as I know, no Stagecoach North East depot has paid meal break contracts (there's one shift at Stockton that does but only due to the driver's break being away from the depot and the break rooms in Stockton and Middlesbrough and is only once a week).

(10 Apr 2014, 6:42 pm)aureolin wrote I'm quite surprised that unpaid breaks exist, baring in mind the nature of the industry. I realise it's not a legal requirement in the UK, but is this industry standard nowadays?

What happens if a late running service causes you to run into your break. Does the driver still get the full break, or would that cause a potential knock on affect on the driver's next assignment on rota? Not to mention that it creates a two tier workforce.

I've been standing with supervisors when just such an incident has happened and the drivers complained that he's so late 'he's ran into his bait' or he's 'gotta leave now or he's going to miss out on his next bait' for examples. I do believe it's a legal requirement to have their full break time as stated on their duty, so if a guy pulls in 10 minutes late on the 50 and has a 1 hour break to fulfill, then when he goes and does his next run on the 28 he can't sign on for another 10 minutes because he needs to have that amount of time not driving, thus delaying the service by 10 minutes (that would carry on for the rest of the day, because if he hasn't made up time then the next driver who comes back after him in the same vehicle might have run 5 minutes into his break and as a result delays his next run trying to catch up). I think it's the driving laws or something like that.

(10 Apr 2014, 6:42 pm)aureolin wrote I'm quite surprised that unpaid breaks exist, baring in mind the nature of the industry. I realise it's not a legal requirement in the UK, but is this industry standard nowadays?

What happens if a late running service causes you to run into your break. Does the driver still get the full break, or would that cause a potential knock on affect on the driver's next assignment on rota? Not to mention that it creates a two tier workforce.

Most companies are heading towards unpaid meal breaks, and I think it will become the industry standard if not already. I work in an office, and I do not get paid for my lunch break.

There is normally only a % of the meal break unpaid, say 30 or 35 mins (most duties have more than that for a meal break) unless low cost and that can be up to an hour unpaid (providing there is an hour of meal break).

Spare drivers are available to take over the drivers next portion of work if the driver has come in late, of course this applies to paid meal break staff as well as they need a certain amount of time off anyway. You can only drive 5:30 then you need a break under driving regulations.

(10 Apr 2014, 6:54 pm)Marcus wrote I've been standing with supervisors when just such an incident has happened and the drivers complained that he's so late 'he's ran into his bait' or he's 'gotta leave now or he's going to miss out on his next bait' for examples. I do believe it's a legal requirement to have their full break time as stated on their duty, so if a guy pulls in 10 minutes late on the 50 and has a 1 hour break to fulfill, then when he goes and does his next run on the 28 he can't sign on for another 10 minutes because he needs to have that amount of time not driving, thus delaying the service by 10 minutes (that would carry on for the rest of the day, because if he hasn't made up time then the next driver who comes back after him in the same vehicle might have run 5 minutes into his break and as a result delays his next run trying to catch up). I think it's the driving laws or something like that.

That might be a Union agreement, but as long as you have 30 or 35 mins off, you are legal.

The bible so to speak.....the PSV 375. Most local services come under section 2. TTX comes under section 1.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/sy...europe.pdf

(10 Apr 2014, 6:58 pm)citaro5284 wrote That might be a Union agreement, but as long as you have 30 or 35 mins off, you are legal.

I think it must be a Union agreement because nearly all drivers get frustrated when their bus comes in late and it runs into their bait. The two union representatives at Chester are Unit 2 drivers, just out of interest, do they hold like elections or nominations etc to become part of the union?

(10 Apr 2014, 7:04 pm)Marcus wrote I think it must be a Union agreement because nearly all drivers get frustrated when their bus comes in late and it runs into their bait. The two union representatives at Chester are Unit 2 drivers, just out of interest, do they hold like elections or nominations etc to become part of the union?

Anyone can join a union, but the reps can be elected/voted in.

(10 Apr 2014, 7:04 pm)Marcus wrote The two union representatives at Chester are Unit 2 drivers,

You sure, as one drives the 21 every morning

(10 Apr 2014, 7:10 pm)citaro5284 wrote You sure, as one drives the 21 every morning

He must have changed units! I got told this about six months ago!

EDIT: Or another one was elected.

(10 Apr 2014, 6:58 pm)citaro5284 wrote That might be a Union agreement, but as long as you have 30 or 35 mins off, you are legal.

But for those with unpaid breaks, this would be written into their particulars of employment. It's legally got to include working hours, so the unpaid break would need to be noted or it would be argued that it is a paid break. That being the case, if a driver is entitled to a 60 minute break as per the particulars of their employment, then they're well within their rights to take it. Regardless of whether 5 minutes late or 25 minutes late. Anything else would be deemed a gesture of good will.

(10 Apr 2014, 7:04 pm)Marcus wrote I think it must be a Union agreement because nearly all drivers get frustrated when their bus comes in late and it runs into their bait. The two union representatives at Chester are Unit 2 drivers, just out of interest, do they hold like elections or nominations etc to become part of the union?

Everyone has the legal right to join a union (and it's daft not to for that matter). Most drivers will be represented by Unite, which is predominantly FTO led, but you'll have workplace reps elected by the membership (usually of that brach) on either an annual or bi-annual basis (not sure which in the case of Unite!).

(10 Apr 2014, 8:24 pm)aureolin wrote But for those with unpaid breaks, this would be written into their particulars of employment. It's legally got to include working hours, so the unpaid break would need to be noted or it would be argued that it is a paid break. That being the case, if a driver is entitled to a 60 minute break as per the particulars of their employment, then they're well within their rights to take it. Regardless of whether 5 minutes late or 25 minutes late. Anything else would be deemed a gesture of good will.

Not all of your break is unpaid. So if you have a 45 minute meal break, and you are a 30 min meal break deduction, 15 mins of this is paid, so you can operate providing you have had the legal requirement off, which normally is the unpaid element.

524 is now yellow, heading to Hexham now.

(11 Apr 2014, 10:44 am)Tom wrote 524 is now yellow, heading to Hexham now.

Am on 5232 heading there gonna kill 2 birds with one stone seeing if 5210 is branded too

What do I win for matching 3x 56s in a row?

The 71 is omitting Avenue Vivian in Fencehouses again.

(11 Apr 2014, 10:44 am)Tom wrote 524 is now yellow, heading to Hexham now.

That's strange I didn't think 524 would end up Yellow.

(11 Apr 2014, 2:32 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote The 71 is omitting Avenue Vivian in Fencehouses again.

What has the Avenue Vivian seperatists done noe...threatning drivers with an atomic wedgie or shooting vehicle with spud guns