(07 Aug 2014, 9:09 pm)mb134 wrote Yes but it's business, and Arriva wouldn't just give away custom when they can do something about it, it's not how business works

Yes, but they make plenty of money without competing with the OK1, business or not, considering they are the main operator in that area anyway...

(07 Aug 2014, 9:11 pm)Robert wrote Yes, but they make plenty of money without competing with the OK1, business or not, considering they are the main operator in that area anyway...

If Arriva had sat back, GNE's network in Bishop could have grown further and further.

The success of the OK1 could have led to more and more services being brought in, and that is why they had to act.

(07 Aug 2014, 9:11 pm)Robert wrote Yes, but they make plenty of money without competing with the OK1, business or not, considering they are the main operator in that area anyway...

Yes but look at it this way, passengers of the OK1 may see it as better than Arrivas services, GNE may then launch more services in the area and these passengers will then use those because of the experience on the OK1, this therefore loses quite a lot of money for Arriva. So you may see it as competition against just the OK1 however in the long run it could have expanded into much more

(07 Aug 2014, 9:01 pm)Robert wrote To be honest, i dont think Arriva should have even came in with competition for the service. GNE just wanted to revive the whole 'OK' travel name back to Bishop Auckland - which arriva wouldnt have done i must say and have a bus service that arriva didnt operate. In the OK1s case, it was just Arriva's greed that killed the OK1 by timing it so, as has already been said, passengers would get on the first bus that came to them. Arriva have plenty of services around that area and could easily manage without the X1 and just let GNE get on with the OK1 just like they have with service 18. It all comes down to that saying 'would you like it if somebody did that to you' and in arriva's case the answer would be no because they would be losing out on money for the sake of a few minutes.

At least the OK1 struck some fear for Arriva to improve their services in Bishop Auckland, after the OK1 was launched the X1 was introduced which offered faster journey times than the 1/1b and sometime afterwards the 6 was changed to run to run to West Auckland on a 12 minute frequency.

Yes passengers would just get on the first bus that turned up, the other issue was Arriva had more services in Bishop Auckland and Darlington which were more frequent and GNE had no other services in Darlington and little other services in Bishop Auckland.

(07 Aug 2014, 9:33 pm)Jimmi wrote At least the OK1 struck some fear for Arriva to improve their services in Bishop Auckland, after the OK1 was launched the X1 was introduced which offered faster journey times than the 1/1b and sometime afterwards the 6 was changed to run to run to West Auckland on a 12 minute frequency.

Yes passengers would just get on the first bus that turned up, the other issue was Arriva had more services in Bishop Auckland and Darlington which were more frequent and GNE had no other services in Darlington and little other services in Bishop Auckland.

In hindsight, it was a bit ambitious taking on one of Arriva's prime routes. Perhaps they should have looked at running into Bishop from places like Shildon, Evenwood etc, and feed into the Pronto for Durham and Newcastle. That is one of the jobs of the 18.

(07 Aug 2014, 9:40 pm)RGR756V wrote In hindsight, it was a bit ambitious taking on one of Arriva's prime routes. Perhaps they should have looked at running into Bishop from places like Shildon, Evenwood etc, and feed into the Pronto for Durham and Newcastle. That is one of the jobs of the 18.

Perhaps they could have done a faster version of the 5/5A from Bishop to Darlington missing out many of the estates.

(07 Aug 2014, 9:50 pm)Jimmi wrote Perhaps they could have done a faster version of the 5/5A from Bishop to Darlington missing out many of the estates.

BIB:

(07 Aug 2014, 9:40 pm)RGR756V wrote In hindsight, it was a bit ambitious taking on one of Arriva's prime routes. Perhaps they should have looked at running into Bishop from places like Shildon, Evenwood etc, and feed into the Pronto for Durham and Newcastle. That is one of the jobs of the 18.

I would consider the 5/5a still a 'prime route' - its main role is to provide a Newton Aycliffe-Bishop Auckland service, as well as an back-up to the 7 between Newton Aycliffe and Darlington.

(07 Aug 2014, 10:03 pm)Kuyoyo wrote BIB:


I would consider the 5/5a still a 'prime route' - its main role is to provide a Newton Aycliffe-Bishop Auckland service, as well as an back-up to the 7 between Newton Aycliffe and Darlington.

Yeah the 5/5A is actually a busy route my suggestion would have been a different route but it would probably still lose to Arriva.

(07 Aug 2014, 9:12 pm)Dan wrote If Arriva had sat back, GNE's network in Bishop could have grown further and further.

The success of the OK1 could have led to more and more services being brought in, and that is why they had to act.

I doubt they would have grown that far, baring in mind Arriva already have most of the main routes in that area and GNE would be left with the small town services which would pick up nothing except pensioners with their passes making them a bit of money off the odd fare paying passenger. Arrivas input in this whole situation to me was unneeded and was just an act of greed. When arriva moved into Darlington Stagecoach didnt do a single thing apart from letting arriva dominate them so much they had to leave Darlington with this only been part of the reason. GNE had been wiped out of Bishop Auckland just because of (presumably) the income from services in that area, in their opinion, wasnt good enough for them to keep operating there. Therefore, although Arriva are coping now because of services elsewhere (which will be presumably be keeping most of the services running), Go North East wont be prepared to start up operations there again after what happened all those years ago...

(07 Aug 2014, 10:29 pm)Robert wrote I doubt they would have grown that far, baring in mind Arriva already have most of the main routes in that area and GNE would be left with the small town services which would pick up nothing except pensioners with their passes making them a bit of money off the odd fare paying passenger. Arrivas input in this whole situation to me was unneeded and was just an act of greed. When arriva moved into Darlington Stagecoach didnt do a single thing apart from letting arriva dominate them so much they had to leave Darlington with this only been part of the reason. GNE had been wiped out of Bishop Auckland just because of (presumably) the income from services in that area, in their opinion, wasnt good enough for them to keep operating there. Therefore, although Arriva are coping now because of services elsewhere (which will be presumably be keeping most of the services running), Go North East wont be prepared to start up operations there again after what happened all those years ago...

Maybe they shouldn't have sold their operations in Bishop Auckland then...

(08 Aug 2014, 8:11 am)tyresmoke wrote Maybe they shouldn't have sold their operations in Bishop Auckland then...

That was for a valid reason though, the situation now is that they are obviously making more money (over a period of time) with 2 routes along with others around the region then they were around 10 years ago. I have a feeling that if they were to grow the same thing would happen. Not like it would as the chances are they woud need a depot over there, which they dont have at the moment...Crook certainly isnt big enough and thats probably going to be the case if Weardale wasnt there either.

Presumably available on the UK market, I wonder if the Man Regio could be an alternative to deckers on the x9/10?

Easy access, aircom, able to accommodate a decent load AND able to pump out upto 400bhp.

http://www.bus.man.eu/global/en/intercit...ssion.html

(11 Aug 2014, 4:02 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Presumably available on the UK market, I wonder if the Man Regio could be an alternative to deckers on the x9/10?

Easy access, aircom, able to accommodate a decent load AND able to pump out upto 400bhp.

http://www.bus.man.eu/global/en/intercit...ssion.html

DB... What's your thoughts and opinions???

(11 Aug 2014, 4:09 pm)Dan wrote DB... What's your thoughts and opinions???

Decent

(11 Aug 2014, 7:14 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote Decent

Any slogans or adverts that could be used to promote these?
60 odd seats, high back seats, individually controlled air con - can be dual door, to assist with unloading too.

Reckon they could be onto a winner here.

Would be perfect along the Coast Road too!

(11 Aug 2014, 8:04 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Any slogans or adverts that could be used to promote these?
60 odd seats, high back seats, individually controlled air con - can be dual door, to assist with unloading too.

Reckon they could be onto a winner here.

Would be perfect along the Coast Road too!

60-odd seats is the downside, like...
Even the B9s struggle to shift the punters sometimes - and I'm sure they have 70-odd.

(11 Aug 2014, 8:08 pm)Dan wrote 60-odd seats is the downside, like...
Even the B9s struggle to shift the punters sometimes - and I'm sure they have 70-odd.

They have 72 or 74 seats. But at 60 odd, it shouldn't struggle too much. Better than having to pay Alpha to bail out one of Souter's machines or Volvo's eco dreams!

(11 Aug 2014, 8:17 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote They have 72 or 74 seats. But at 60 odd, it shouldn't struggle too much. Better than having to pay Alpha to bail out one of Souter's machines or Volvo's eco dreams!

Actually, you'll still be paying for Alpha to bail these out - they are MANs after all (or do some people not pay attention to Stagecoach's MANs).

MAN aren't likely to move into deckers for the UK again anyway - their first attempt didn't last long, one example was built to European Height and a second full height one for London was never built.

(11 Aug 2014, 8:20 pm)Kuyoyo wrote Actually, you'll still be paying for Alpha to bail these out - they are MANs after all (or do some people not pay attention to Stagecoach's MANs).

MAN aren't likely to move into deckers for the UK again anyway - their first attempt didn't last long, one example was built to European Height and a second full height one for London was never built.

DB have reached agreement for upto 815 of the Regio range across Germany. (http://automotivemegatrends.com/news/deu...815-buses/)
If they can cope on the autobahns over there and the heat of Spain, Greece etc - the a19 and UK summertime could be a stroll in the park.

The DB link may not stop there. Could be a perfect replacement for some ANE stock on Teesside

(11 Aug 2014, 8:29 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote DB have reached agreement for upto 815 of the Regio range across Germany. (http://automotivemegatrends.com/news/deu...815-buses/)
If they can cope on the autobahns over there and the heat of Spain, Greece etc - the a19 and UK summertime could be a stroll in the park.

The DB link may not stop there. Could be a perfect replacement for some ANE stock on Teesside

MANs in Europe work find - as they drive on the right so their radiators grills are on the offside. In the UK, the grills are on the UK nearside so they are forever drawing the rubbish out of the gutter and clogging up the vents, hence why Stagecoach stopped buying them (that and MANs at Euro4 were cr*p anyway) hence they are busy replacing MAN engines in Solos, Versa and Euro4 MANs with Cummins engines.

(11 Aug 2014, 8:42 pm)Kuyoyo wrote MANs in Europe work find - as they drive on the right so their radiators grills are on the offside. In the UK, the grills are on the UK nearside so they are forever drawing the rubbish out of the gutter and clogging up the vents, hence why Stagecoach stopped buying them (that and MANs at Euro4 were cr*p anyway) hence they are busy replacing MAN engines in Solos, Versa and Euro4 MANs with Cummins engines.

I wonder whether or not Volvo and Wrightbus will take into consideration the Go Ahead Group and launch a heavyweight engine / chassis combination. I know they want to be efficient but in 2018 and over the few years after that? GNE are going to have to start buying 104 new buses to replace the B9TL's, B5TL's and various other types for the Red Arrows (14+2), TTX (7+1), Angel (18+2), TEN (14+2) Fab 56 (15+2), Pronto (8+1) and Cobalt Clipper (16+2). And lets not forget potential capacity increases that maybbe required like the Laser, Prince Bishops, Toon Link, West Durham Swift, Crusader and WTX

(11 Aug 2014, 9:19 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote I wonder whether or not Volvo and Wrightbus will take into consideration the Go Ahead Group and launch a heavyweight engine / chassis combination. I know they want to be efficient but in 2018 and over the few years after that? GNE are going to have to start buying 104 new buses to replace the B9TL's, B5TL's and various other types for the Red Arrows (14+2), TTX (7+1), Angel (18+2), TEN (14+2) Fab 56 (15+2), Pronto (8+1) and Cobalt Clipper (16+2). And lets not forget potential capacity increases that maybbe required like the Laser, Prince Bishops, Toon Link, West Durham Swift, Crusader and WTX

They probably wouldn't, MOST routes in the UK that require double deckers will be fine with the B5TL or E400 MMC. We're just unlucky enough to live in the place where most double deck operated routes need a vehicle with a far more power than the rest of the country...

(11 Aug 2014, 8:42 pm)Kuyoyo wrote MANs in Europe work find - as they drive on the right so their radiators grills are on the offside. In the UK, the grills are on the UK nearside so they are forever drawing the rubbish out of the gutter and clogging up the vents, hence why Stagecoach stopped buying them (that and MANs at Euro4 were cr*p anyway) hence they are busy replacing MAN engines in Solos, Versa and Euro4 MANs with Cummins engines.

I have never heard the positioning of the grill and it sucking up rubbish from the roads as the reason for poor performance before.

I wonder if the same happens with the Merc Citaro in Europe?
With the radiator grill being on the near side, they should be ok in the UK - but in Europe, will presumably encounter the issues you mentioned with MAN vehicles in the UK?

With the engine now being a few euro ratings higher than the poor performer at Euro 4, hopefully performance/reliability has improved too.

(11 Aug 2014, 9:25 pm)mb134 wrote They probably wouldn't, MOST routes in the UK that require double deckers will be fine with the B5TL or E400 MMC. We're just unlucky enough to live in the place where most double deck operated routes need a vehicle with a far more power than the rest of the country...

And don't forget Brighton and Hove, Arriva NE and Yorkshire for a handful of their routes, Transdev Coastliner and EYMS as they like their power too.

(12 Aug 2014, 5:23 am)Andreos Constantopolous wrote I have never heard the positioning of the grill and it sucking up rubbish from the roads as the reason for poor performance before.

I'm sure I read on a recent review (although I can't remember which one it was) that engineers can flick a switch and the fan blows the other way - i.e blows all the rubbish back through. Saves engineering having to manually clean them and is a lot quicker.

A friend is asking.... any update on orders?

(12 Aug 2014, 2:18 pm)Michael wrote A friend is asking.... any update on orders?

Whilst en-route to Gateshead from Riverside a few days ago, a driver was discussing with another how capital expenditure (a bid, to you and I) has been submitted for approximately 50 vehicles.

9120's trial on the X66 has got drivers on said rota discussing how they think it'll become an 'open rota' when new single deckers arrive for it.

(12 Aug 2014, 2:22 pm)Dan wrote Whilst en-route to Gateshead from Riverside a few days ago, a driver was discussing with another how capital expenditure (a bid, to you and I) has been submitted for approximately 50 vehicles.

9120's trial on the X66 has got drivers on said rota discussing how they think it'll become an 'open rota' when new single deckers arrive for it.

Hopefully they hear about it soon.

Be interesting to see what they have ordered for each service... i would think at least each service will have 1 or 2 spares ordered...

With the increase on the X66 to, i would say at least 6 buses will be ordered for the X66?

(12 Aug 2014, 2:22 pm)Dan wrote Whilst en-route to Gateshead from Riverside a few days ago, a driver was discussing with another how capital expenditure (a bid, to you and I) has been submitted for approximately 50 vehicles.

9120's trial on the X66 has got drivers on said rota discussing how they think it'll become an 'open rota' when new single deckers arrive for it.

I spoke to a Driver last week in Gateshead while taking an Interior shot of 9120 and again Briefly when I got off at The MetroCentre, and he had nothing but nice things to say about the Citaro K, have to admit I loved the 10 Minutes I spent on it, which I mentioned to the Driver when I got off, after he asked if I enjoyed the Journey.

(12 Aug 2014, 2:31 pm)NEBCD Malarkey wrote I spoke to a Driver last week in Gateshead while taking an Interior shot of 9120 and again Briefly when I got off at The MetroCentre, and he had nothing but nice things to say about the Citaro K, have to admit I loved the 10 Minutes I spent on it, which I mentioned to the Driver when I got off, after he asked if I enjoyed the Journey.

Shame bet they don't even get citaro's =(

I just hope we get them on the Lime.... just because the versa's won't cope on its LONG route