(06 Sep 2014, 9:36 pm)mb134 wrote If they cant get them branded by then, there's something seriously wrong!!

It was without

http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teessi...ed-7728011

(06 Sep 2014, 10:41 pm)jaimz13 wrote What depot is 1310 at cause on here it says darlo but I've seen it in durham

It's at Belmont depot.

Was out in Northumberland yesterday. Was very impressed with Sapphire. The bus arrived on time, was very clean, and the driver was friendly. The ride quality was average, and the rattles did get on my nerves a bit. Also the Wi-Fi worked well and was fast.

However, the 1 was very late from Ashington, and sadly it was those horrid ALX200's. I really think something needs to be done to improve the reliability on the 1, and possibly some bigger buses as there was standees from Bedlington to Blyth. The 2, however was on time, it was 1773, and was quite overcrowded so possibly it could do with some bigger buses also. Maybe it could be jointly operated by Ashington and Blyth, with them interworking at Blyth to allow a longer layover.

I was annoyed with the X18 though, it didn't turn up at all (or was at least 20 minutes late), so I hope this won't continue when Max gets revealed on the X18. The X14 was also late, but only by about 5 minutes. Was a DAF ALX400 but can't remember what one.

Overall, I think some changes need to be made in Northumberland to maintain reliability, and with the X18, it is a ongoing problem.

(07 Sep 2014, 9:47 am)Roland Pratt wrote http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teessi...ed-7728011

Nice to see Arriva portrayed in a positive light for a change.

(07 Sep 2014, 10:14 am)Tom wrote Was out in Northumberland yesterday. Was very impressed with Sapphire. The bus arrived on time, was very clean, and the driver was friendly. The ride quality was average, and the rattles did get on my nerves a bit. Also the Wi-Fi worked well and was fast.

However, the 1 was very late from Ashington, and sadly it was those horrid ALX200's. I really think something needs to be done to improve the reliability on the 1, and possibly some bigger buses as there was standees from Bedlington to Blyth. The 2, however was on time, it was 1773, and was quite overcrowded so possibly it could do with some bigger buses also. Maybe it could be jointly operated by Ashington and Blyth, with them interworking at Blyth to allow a longer layover.

I was annoyed with the X18 though, it didn't turn up at all (or was at least 20 minutes late), so I hope this won't continue when Max gets revealed on the X18. The X14 was also late, but only by about 5 minutes. Was a DAF ALX400 but can't remember what one.

Overall, I think some changes need to be made in Northumberland to maintain reliability, and with the X18, it is a ongoing problem.

Can you remember which Sapphire E400 you got?
I agree about the joint operation of the 1 and 2 by Ashington and Blyth, could allow buses to be changed at more than one place..

(07 Sep 2014, 10:34 am)mb134 wrote Can you remember which Sapphire E400 you got?
I agree about the joint operation of the 1 and 2 by Ashington and Blyth, could allow buses to be changed at more than one place..

I can't, all I know is it was a 14 reg one
Yes exactly. I think a extra bus should be added with timetable changes to assist reliability.

(07 Sep 2014, 10:47 am)Tom wrote I can't, all I know is it was a 14 reg one
Yes exactly. I think a extra bus should be added with timetable changes to assist reliability.

Ah ok thanks, just on a couple of 57 reg ones I don't even bother trying to connect, seriously slow (7506 springs to mind)
I agree with the extra bus on the 1 and 2 also, and I think if they do get bigger buses they should only be allocated to the runs that justify them

(07 Sep 2014, 10:57 am)mb134 wrote Ah ok thanks, just on a couple of 57 reg ones I don't even bother trying to connect, seriously slow (7506 springs to mind)
I agree with the extra bus on the 1 and 2 also, and I think if they do get bigger buses they should only be allocated to the runs that justify them

I would say that quite a few runs could justify it.
Maybe the 1 could be extended to Amble and replace the 20?

(07 Sep 2014, 11:00 am)Tom wrote I would say that quite a few runs could justify it.
Maybe the 1 could be extended to Amble and replace the 20?

Oh yeah, nearly all I see are busy however a couple I've seen have been pretty empty for the duration (however I've only seen this on the 2)
Instead of replacing the 20 I would suggest extending that to Alnwick , as the 420 used to, this would hopefully relieve the X15/X18 also and keeping the 1 as it is, after all extending it back to Amble (as I believe it used to) could only hinder reliability?

(07 Sep 2014, 11:06 am)mb134 wrote Oh yeah, nearly all I see are busy however a couple I've seen have been pretty empty for the duration (however I've only seen this on the 2)
Instead of replacing the 20 I would suggest extending that to Alnwick , as the 420 used to, this would hopefully relieve the X15/X18 also and keeping the 1 as it is, after all extending it back to Amble (as I believe it used to) could only hinder reliability?

I made a suggestion a while back on the service suggestions thread:
http://northeastbuses.co.uk/forum/showth...03&page=11

(07 Sep 2014, 11:13 am)Tom wrote I made a suggestion a while back on the service suggestions thread:
http://northeastbuses.co.uk/forum/showth...03&page=11

Liking those suggestions, especially the X16, I believe my suggestion of extending the 20 would help those further as it would decrease passengers from Ashington using the X15, X18 and your suggestion of the X16, to Alnwick.

(07 Sep 2014, 11:33 am)mb134 wrote Liking those suggestions, especially the X16, I believe my suggestion of extending the 20 would help those further as it would decrease passengers from Ashington using the X15, X18 and your suggestion of the X16, to Alnwick.

I'm not sure - because the 420 was withdrawn due to low usage?

(07 Sep 2014, 11:39 am)Tom wrote I'm not sure - because the 420 was withdrawn due to low usage?

I know it was then but a few weeks ago I was in Ashington and the amount of people getting onto the 20 shocked me a bit, at least 20 fare paying people getting on with some already on the bus from Newcastle, surely this would make up for the potential lack of customers from Amble to Alnwick?

(07 Sep 2014, 11:49 am)mb134 wrote I know it was then but a few weeks ago I was in Ashington and the amount of people getting onto the 20 shocked me a bit, at least 20 fare paying people getting on with some already on the bus from Newcastle, surely this would make up for the potential lack of customers from Amble to Alnwick?

I suppose it could, if passenger numbers are high, maybe it can be combined with the 1 to provide a half-hourly service Amble-Ashington, with the 20 extending to Alnwick, combining with the X16 to provide a half-hourly service from Amble to Alnwick?

(07 Sep 2014, 11:49 am)mb134 wrote I know it was then but a few weeks ago I was in Ashington and the amount of people getting onto the 20 shocked me a bit, at least 20 fare paying people getting on with some already on the bus from Newcastle, surely this would make up for the potential lack of customers from Amble to Alnwick?

Apart from the adding of an additional vehicle to enable the run to Alnwick (the 20 only gets a timetabled 3 minutes turn-round in Amble) would increase running costs.

(07 Sep 2014, 11:53 am)Kuyoyo wrote Apart from the adding of an additional vehicle to enable the run to Alnwick (the 20 only gets a timetabled 3 minutes turn-round in Amble) would increase running costs.

If they operated it with 4 Single Deckers would the running costs be the same as with 3 Double Deckers?

(07 Sep 2014, 12:15 pm)mb134 wrote If they operated it with 4 Single Deckers would the running costs be the same as with 3 Double Deckers?

MPG will need to be taken into account (amongst other things), but there would be an additional driver to include in costs.

(07 Sep 2014, 12:20 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote MPG will need to be taken into account (amongst other things), but there would be an additional driver to include in costs.

Oh aye, forgot about that
However they're never going to know if they don't give it a shot, people will want to get from Amble to Alnwick and people will be more inclined to use the bus if they are more frequent surely? I know the 420 was poorly used but things may have changed and you may as well give it another go, they make millions so it cant do too much harm if it doesn't go well?

Would it be better to brand the MAX E400's for both the X15 and X18, just like the X10/11 Gemini's are? Just so that they can be allocated to either service?

(07 Sep 2014, 12:32 pm)mb134 wrote Oh aye, forgot about that
However they're never going to know if they don't give it a shot, people will want to get from Amble to Alnwick and people will be more inclined to use the bus if they are more frequent surely? I know the 420 was poorly used but things may have changed and you may as well give it another go, they make millions so it cant do too much harm if it doesn't go well?

There is very little organic methods in the way of identifying passenger trends.
Granted, with the advent of technology, it is possible to identify individual journeys and hopefully this is analysed - but if you, me or someone else boards the bus, say with a paper day/week ticket, then the operators won't know where we travel.
It is impossible to analyse each and every paper ticket, in the way the smartcard tickets can be.

I think operators need to be more proactive in finding out what passengers need/want - rather than forcing passengers to travel within the confines of what the operators offer.

There will be countless other similar examples up and down the country, but I know of someone living in Bournmoor. If they need to travel to a certain place beginning with F(or make the return journey home), just a mile up the road beyond 9pm - it involves getting a taxi or using three buses.
I get that the buses are taken off due to lack of revenue (and other operational issues), but what else can passengers do, if the operators can't/won't listen or are not proactive in finding out what their passengers are needing?
Look at Spirit Buses. They have designed their network around what residents need/want. Hopefully it will work for the guy behind it.

You are right in what you say about people needing to travel from Amble to Alnwick. It is a given that there will be commuters and people needing to go about their lives.
It seems strange the last bus wasn't used that often.

(07 Sep 2014, 12:32 pm)mb134 wrote Oh aye, forgot about that
However they're never going to know if they don't give it a shot, people will want to get from Amble to Alnwick and people will be more inclined to use the bus if they are more frequent surely? I know the 420 was poorly used but things may have changed and you may as well give it another go, they make millions so it cant do too much harm if it doesn't go well?

BIB: People from Amble travelling to Alnwick already have 2 buses an hour - the X18 and the Travelsure-operated 472. Can't see them needing any more than that to be perfectly honest.

(07 Sep 2014, 1:32 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote There is very little organic methods in the way of identifying passenger trends.
Granted, with the advent of technology, it is possible to identify individual journeys and hopefully this is analysed - but if you, me or someone else boards the bus, say with a paper day/week ticket, then the operators won't know where we travel.
It is impossible to analyse each and every paper ticket, in the way the smartcard tickets can be.

I think operators need to be more proactive in finding out what passengers need/want - rather than forcing passengers to travel within the confines of what the operators offer.

There will be countless other similar examples up and down the country, but I know of someone living in Bournmoor. If they need to travel to a certain place beginning with F(or make the return journey home), just a mile up the road beyond 9pm - it involves getting a taxi or using three buses.
I get that the buses are taken off due to lack of revenue (and other operational issues), but what else can passengers do, if the operators can't/won't listen or are not proactive in finding out what their passengers are needing?
Look at Spirit Buses. They have designed their network around what residents need/want. Hopefully it will work for the guy behind it.

You are right in what you say about people needing to travel from Amble to Alnwick. It is a given that there will be commuters and people needing to go about their lives.
It seems strange the last bus wasn't used that often.

I agree that it is hard to find out where people are travelling to but could they look at the route as a whole, say if a journey got 100 passengers from start to finish, does it really matter where they get on/off? That journey overall should make up for any potential non-profit bits of the route shouldn't it?

The fact that people need 3 buses to travel a mile, as you've pointed out, is shocking and as the two places must be close together I imagine if three buses are needed it takes said person quite far from where they want to be.

I think only good things can come of operators such as Spirit Buses, if they take off then not only is it good for them and their passengers, but it should give bigger operators the kick they need to improve their services in these rural areas as well, resulting in a very high quality service

(07 Sep 2014, 1:58 pm)Kuyoyo wrote BIB: People from Amble travelling to Alnwick already have 2 buses an hour - the X18 and the Travelsure-operated 472. Can't see them needing any more than that to be perfectly honest.

But that was my reasoning behind it in the first place, to improve reliability to the X18, if that's going through Amble on its way to Alnwick and its 15 minutes late, for example, the last thing it going to want is a boat load of people going to work. Now if the 20 was extended not only would there be less people from Morpeth (people from Ashington in reality) there would be less from Amble also, improving reliability and if it's on time more often, more people from Morpeth etc. would be inclined to use the X18 resulting in overall growth. Also, if people in Alnwick have the option of the X18, X15 and 20 (which will turn into the X20) to go to Newcastle then they may spread between the three again improving timekeeping.

I haven't quoted the post, cos its a canny size - but the bit you mentioned about the hundred passengers , was something I wanted to build on.

What I was trying to get at initially, is those passengers who transfer somewhere, due to the lack of a direct service.

Person A and B gets on x1 at Oldcastle. She gets off at Beaton Road.
She uses a paper day ticket.

At Beaton Road, they change onto the x2, to go to Five Lane Ends.
Person A, continues to Lenton Road Hypermarket via the x3. Person C and D also boards the bus, having travelled from Oldcastle, but via Losforth.
Person B, continues from Five Lane ends to Billingworth, joined by person E, who has came from Lenton Road Hypermarket.

There is no record of where those individuals ended up once they left their original stop in Oldcastle.
It could be argued, that there should be a direct bus to Lenton Road Hypermarket, but there is no system in place to monitor numbers making the journey between the two points.
Just data showing where people boarded and disembarked each bus.

(07 Sep 2014, 11:53 am)Kuyoyo wrote Apart from the adding of an additional vehicle to enable the run to Alnwick (the 20 only gets a timetabled 3 minutes turn-round in Amble) would increase running costs.

WELL NO WONDER THE X20 / 20 RUNS LATE ALL THE TIME! That's absolutely ridiculous!

(07 Sep 2014, 2:30 pm)mb134 wrote But that was my reasoning behind it in the first place, to improve reliability to the X18, if that's going through Amble on its way to Alnwick and its 15 minutes late, for example, the last thing it going to want is a boat load of people going to work. Now if the 20 was extended not only would there be less people from Morpeth (people from Ashington in reality) there would be less from Amble also, improving reliability and if it's on time more often, more people from Morpeth etc. would be inclined to use the X18 resulting in overall growth. Also, if people in Alnwick have the option of the X18, X15 and 20 (which will turn into the X20) to go to Newcastle then they may spread between the three again improving timekeeping.

I just think the X18 needs a more robust timetable as there are issues with timekeeping - but Northumberland isn't my area of expertise so I'm unsure what exactly is causing these problems. People closer to the area may know better.
However I'm not sure whether spreading the loadings over more services would be the answer? If they are leaving people behind then maybe that would be a good idea...

(07 Sep 2014, 2:57 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote I haven't quoted the post, cos its a canny size - but the bit you mentioned about the hundred passengers , was something I wanted to build on.

What I was trying to get at initially, is those passengers who transfer somewhere, due to the lack of a direct service.

Person A and B gets on x1 at Oldcastle. She gets off at Beaton Road.
She uses a paper day ticket.

At Beaton Road, they change onto the x2, to go to Five Lane Ends.
Person A, continues to Lenton Road Hypermarket via the x3. Person C and D also boards the bus, having travelled from Oldcastle, but via Losforth.
Person B, continues from Five Lane ends to Billingworth, joined by person E, who has came from Lenton Road Hypermarket.

There is no record of where those individuals ended up once they left their original stop in Oldcastle.
It could be argued, that there should be a direct bus to Lenton Road Hypermarket, but there is no system in place to monitor numbers making the journey between the two points.
Just data showing where people boarded and disembarked each bus.

Ah right ok, understand it now Then I agree with what you said in the last post, operators need to do something to understand better where people are travelling to/from, and then act on it.

(07 Sep 2014, 3:00 pm)tyresmoke wrote I just think the X18 needs a more robust timetable as there are issues with timekeeping - but Northumberland isn't my area of expertise so I'm unsure what exactly is causing these problems. People closer to the area may know better.
However I'm not sure whether spreading the loadings over more services would be the answer? If they are leaving people behind then maybe that would be a good idea...

I don't think it would be the answer but it could be a start.

Another reason for it would be that, as the X18 is hourly if the bus breaks down at Alnwick, would it not be better to have the option of the 20 there also, as currently there would only be 2 options, wait on the next X18 or wait for the X15 and hope that there was enough room for you, everyone else from the X18 and the people already on the X15. I just think that as the X18 is, for the most part, a rural service, having another option available wouldn't be the worst thing in the world

4005 now scrapped: https://flic.kr/p/p6FiYD

4809 is back on the road, still with last years Christmas advert on the side!

http://flic.kr/p/oQ3NoH

(07 Sep 2014, 2:59 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote WELL NO WONDER THE X20 / 20 RUNS LATE ALL THE TIME! That's absolutely ridiculous!

The X15 and X18 only have 4 minutes turnaround at Berwick after a journey of well over 60 miles!

However I am told that in October the X18 will terminate at Belford rather that Berwick so using only 5 buses. Hence my query re the branding of the X18 MAXs. Do they brand them now showing Berwick or wait till the service change and show Belford.