(15 Nov 2015, 9:31 pm)tyresmoke wrote Noticed today there's a temporary one at the Bowburn junction advertising Lumiere, but with a permanent one just going in alongside.

As for Durham Bus Station, it's just one thing in a massive list of things this region cannot do properly. The bus stations in Yorkshire are 3 times the size

Somehow, Eldon Square seems to tick over OK, most of the time, even though it's a similar capacity with a similar volume of traffic.

I think the big problem with Durham bus station is that it's built for a city the size it is, forgetting that it's a major hub. Peterlee is the same size as Durham, but is both less of a destination (understatement) and less of a hub so it's only slightly lower capacity bus station is rarely overcrowded (though it tends to be so full of people who have conversations at the top of their voice that we tend to join the people shivering in front of the doors, there!)

(24 Nov 2015, 10:05 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Somehow, Eldon Square seems to tick over OK, most of the time, even though it's a similar capacity with a similar volume of traffic.

I think the big problem with Durham bus station is that it's built for a city the size it is, forgetting that it's a major hub. Peterlee is the same size as Durham, but is both less of a destination (understatement) and less of a hub so it's only slightly lower capacity bus station is rarely overcrowded (though it tends to be so full of people who have conversations at the top of their voice that we tend to join the people shivering in front of the doors, there!)

With Eldon Square, you can probably have about 6-7 buses queueing to get into the bus station. At Durham you can have 2, before you're overhanging on to the roundabout. 

The other difference is that Eldon Square is fully managed. Two Nexus clowns, and a GNE supervisor during the day. Give Nexus their credit, as they seem to communicate stand changes straight away, and it runs as clockwork. There's also a lot more space inside too, which allows queues to flow better. 

Durham on the other hand is unmanaged, at least as far as I'm concerned. I know they have staff on, but they couldn't make it more obvious that it's the last place they want to be. They offer absolutely no knowledge about the bus network, and generally hide away in their little cupboard at the top. Not great, when you have buses being dumped into stands, and buses due off those stands having to find alternatives. It causes chaos at peak times.

(24 Nov 2015, 10:14 pm)Adrian wrote With Eldon Square, you can probably have about 6-7 buses queueing to get into the bus station. At Durham you can have 2, before you're overhanging on to the roundabout. 

The other difference is that Eldon Square is fully managed. Two Nexus clowns, and a GNE supervisor during the day. Give Nexus their credit, as they seem to communicate stand changes straight away, and it runs as clockwork. There's also a lot more space inside too, which allows queues to flow better. 

Durham on the other hand is unmanaged, at least as far as I'm concerned. I know they have staff on, but they couldn't make it more obvious that it's the last place they want to be. They offer absolutely no knowledge about the bus network, and generally hide away in their little cupboard at the top. Not great, when you have buses being dumped into stands, and buses due off those stands having to find alternatives. It causes chaos at peak times.

It's chaotic enough off peak.

Staff who aren't drivers wondering which stand their next bus will land on only seem to emerge when there's tetchy drunks to clear out, while they're waiting for the police to arrive. It can get a bit lairy mid afternoon, sometimes.

(24 Nov 2015, 10:05 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Somehow, Eldon Square seems to tick over OK, most of the time, even though it's a similar capacity with a similar volume of traffic.

I think the big problem with Durham bus station is that it's built for a city the size it is, forgetting that it's a major hub. Peterlee is the same size as Durham, but is both less of a destination (understatement) and less of a hub so it's only slightly lower capacity bus station is rarely overcrowded (though it tends to be so full of people who have conversations at the top of their voice that we tend to join the people shivering in front of the doors, there!)

Although the design has changed, the footprint (as far as I am aware), hasn't changed much, if anything since the days of United owning the site and building it way back when.

Obviously Eldon Square is a new bus station, moved from its previous location - supposedly designed to suit modern requirements.

I'm not a fan of either, but taking into account the limitations Durham bus station has, I think it copes as well as it can.
The road network around Eldon Square, the car park and Haymarket just aren't suited to additional bus station.

(24 Nov 2015, 10:25 pm)Andreos1 wrote Although the design has changed, the footprint (as far as I am aware), hasn't changed much, if anything since the days of United owning the site and building it way back when.

Obviously Eldon Square is a new bus station, moved from its previous location - supposedly designed to suit modern requirements.

I'm not a fan of either, but taking into account the limitations Durham bus station has, I think it copes as well as it can.
The road network around Eldon Square, the car park and Haymarket just aren't suited to additional bus station.

The old Eldon Square bus station was horrific (the last time I used it, I was pregnant with Big'un - and instantly told Husband that if he was a girl, I was NOT going to call her Caitlyn because I'd heard enough of it being yelled to have decided I hate it!). Not many people used it. IIRC, fewer buses ran from there, too - I think the only services via Low Fell were the Arriva runs of the then equivalent of the 21. The GNE 21 went from Haymarket and the 1 from outside the Odeon.

Access to Newcastle city centre from the South is and always has been problematic.

And, while it wouldn't do much to improve access, given that the plans online for Durham look to be trying to incorporate the North road stops into the footprint of the station, I think it would be better if it took over that section of North road. ith the area where the current bike shop, newsagent etc used as a central island, past the church (which would obviously have to stand, but wouldn't get in the way) a lot more stops could be fitted in and buses being more equally divided between 2 exits from the roundabout would ease congestion, somewhat, as it's always inbound.

(24 Nov 2015, 10:14 pm)Adrian wrote With Eldon Square, you can probably have about 6-7 buses queueing to get into the bus station. At Durham you can have 2, before you're overhanging on to the roundabout. 

The other difference is that Eldon Square is fully managed. Two Nexus clowns, and a GNE supervisor during the day. Give Nexus their credit, as they seem to communicate stand changes straight away, and it runs as clockwork. There's also a lot more space inside too, which allows queues to flow better. 

Durham on the other hand is unmanaged, at least as far as I'm concerned. I know they have staff on, but they couldn't make it more obvious that it's the last place they want to be. They offer absolutely no knowledge about the bus network, and generally hide away in their little cupboard at the top. Not great, when you have buses being dumped into stands, and buses due off those stands having to find alternatives. It causes chaos at peak times.

Durham Bus Station is too small in every sense, not enough room for buses and there is not enough room for passengers to move or queue.

There is certainly not enough room for buses with there not being enough stands and there isn't a great deal of space to layover, although there is markings for two buses on that drop off stand, there is only realistically room for one and when a bus pulls in behind it can block the entrance causing traffic queuing onto the roundabout. I was in Durham on a weekday morning during the October half term so buses were arriving earlier than normal so buses had to find somewhere to wait time and there wasn't anywhere in the bus station, so buses were waiting in all sorts of different places including North Road, Millburngate and the stop by the County Hospital (21's frequently seem to layover there).

I have a few issues being in a crowded environment and Durham Bus Station certainly makes me feel on edge at times, on Friday when I was stood right at the front of the queue for service 7 and in typical fashion the 24 pulled onto the 7's stand so I ended up with the large queue for the 24 plus the people waiting for the 7 crowding round me and smashing into myself and my camera bag so I was in a bit of a mess until I managed to get on the 7. Somedays you are queuing for the 7 outside the bus station with all the scum who hang around there inhaling their smoke.

(24 Nov 2015, 10:54 pm)Jimmi wrote Durham Bus Station is too small in every sense, not enough room for buses and there is not enough room for passengers to move or queue.

There is certainly not enough room for buses with there not being enough stands and there isn't a great deal of space to layover, although there is markings for two buses on that drop off stand, there is only realistically room for one and when a bus pulls in behind it can block the entrance causing traffic queuing onto the roundabout. I was in Durham on a weekday morning during the October half term so buses were arriving earlier than normal so buses had to find somewhere to wait time and there wasn't anywhere in the bus station, so buses were waiting in all sorts of different places including North Road, Millburngate and the stop by the County Hospital (21's frequently seem to layover there).

I have a few issues being in a crowded environment and Durham Bus Station certainly makes me feel on edge at times, on Friday when I was stood right at the front of the queue for service 7 and in typical fashion the 24 pulled onto the 7's stand so I ended up with the large queue for the 24 plus the people waiting for the 7 crowding round me and smashing into myself and  my camera bag so I was in a bit of a mess until I managed to get on the 7. Somedays you are queuing for the 7 outside the bus station with all the scum who hang around there inhaling their smoke.

If I get to stand J early for the 22 that pillar is great for blotting out the world. If the queues are long, I sit on the bench at the exit end until the queues have subsided. I figure that if I'm at the back of the queue I'm no worse off and, if it's not my queue (Ok, so not an issue with stand L) I'm also no worse off.

If the weather is good and it's not busy season, I just wait at Milburngate. That's rare, though.

Edit - how the hell did that quote-post split happen?

(24 Nov 2015, 10:44 pm)BusLoverMum wrote The old Eldon Square bus station was horrific (the last time I used it, I was pregnant with Big'un - and instantly told Husband that if he was a girl, I was NOT going to call her Caitlyn because I'd heard enough of it being yelled to have decided I hate it!). Not many people used it. IIRC, fewer buses ran from there, too - I think the only services via Low Fell were the Arriva runs of the then equivalent of the 21. The GNE 21 went from Haymarket and the 1 from outside the Odeon.

Access to Newcastle city centre from the South is and always has been problematic.

And, while it wouldn't do much to improve access, given that the plans online for Durham look to be trying to incorporate the North road stops into the footprint of the station, I think it would be better if it took over that section of North road. ith the area where the current bike shop, newsagent etc used as a central island, past the church (which would obviously have to stand, but wouldn't get in the way) a lot more stops could be fitted in and buses being more equally divided between 2 exits from the roundabout would ease congestion, somewhat, as it's always inbound.

I didn't mind the old Eldon Square bus station.
The dust, muck, grime and diesel fumes just seemed to add to the atmospherics.

Similarly, I quite liked Worswick Street - which although dirty, grimy and totally unsuitable for todays H&S red tape bureaucracy, was perfect for services coming from the south.

Didn't have a soft spot for Newgate Street and disliked the Odeon stops when they were used.

Getting back to Durham, I am surprised there haven't been many injuries or fatalities at the point where buses exit.
The tiny little blind exit, is far from ideal.

I can't remember it and to be honest, it could have been before my time (very rarely ventured to Durham) - the old bus station was similar in design to Worswick St in that the buses entered the main road, from their stands.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/8755708@N07/4402878463

Even when it was re-designed (70's or 80's), there is no way it would have seen the amount of vehicles it sees now.

I try and use the Leazes Bowl stops over Milburngate or the bus station.
The stop the 20's use at Milburngate isn't best positioned for spotting a purple Solar (or the replacement vehicle ) until the last minute.
The regular queues out of the door at the bus station aren't too appealing - especially at this time of year.

(25 Nov 2015, 11:38 am)Andreos1 wrote I try and use the Leazes Bowl stops over Milburngate or the bus station.
The stop the 20's use at Milburngate isn't best positioned for spotting a purple Solar (or the replacement vehicle ) until the last minute.
The regular queues out of the door at the bus station aren't too appealing - especially at this time of year.

Wish I had an alternative bus stop to Durham Bus Station (can't be bothered walking to Crossgate Peth), if the 7 still went up to Framwellgate Moor out of peak times I'd board there if I was changing from the 21/X12/X21 etc. At peak times I often still do.

(25 Nov 2015, 11:38 am)Andreos1 wrote I didn't mind the old Eldon Square bus station.
The dust, muck, grime and diesel fumes just seemed to add to the atmospherics.

Similarly, I quite liked Worswick Street - which although dirty, grimy and totally unsuitable for todays H&S red tape bureaucracy, was perfect for services coming from the south.

Didn't have a soft spot for Newgate Street and disliked the Odeon stops when they were used.

Getting back to Durham, I am surprised there haven't been many injuries or fatalities at the point where buses exit.
The tiny little blind exit, is far from ideal.

I can't remember it and to be honest, it could have been before my time (very rarely ventured to Durham) - the old bus station was similar in design to Worswick St in that the buses entered the main road, from their stands.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/8755708@N07/4402878463

Even when it was re-designed (70's or 80's), there is no way it would have seen the amount of vehicles it sees now.

I try and use the Leazes Bowl stops over Milburngate or the bus station.
The stop the 20's use at Milburngate isn't best positioned for spotting a purple Solar (or the replacement vehicle ) until the last minute.
The regular queues out of the door at the bus station aren't too appealing - especially at this time of year.

I only catch the 22 at the leazes underpass stops if carrying onto the station would mean missing a connection and having another half hour to wait. It's too easy to be missed if it's busy with either people or buses, though.

I don't imagine it causes too much bother during the day, but the conflicting timetables on a night confused me recently.

The last time I posted something similar, it went in the 'lifes little mysteries' thread.
This time this one is most apt.

Mooched down into the bus station for my 20 after getting off the train and the display said one thing. The paper timetable display said another.
Without technology to hand, I wouldnt have had a clue which was correct.
In the end, I realised the paper display (with an issue date of August 15) was incorrect.
Which was a pain, as it meant I didn't have time to get a bag of chips!

No idea whether other services are in a similar position.

(05 Feb 2016, 10:39 am)Andreos1 wrote I don't imagine it causes too much bother during the day, but the conflicting timetables on a night confused me recently.

The last time I posted something similar, it went in the 'lifes little mysteries' thread.
This time this one is most apt.

Mooched down into the bus station for my 20 after getting off the train and the display said one thing. The paper timetable display said another.
Without technology to hand, I wouldnt have had a clue which was correct.
In the end, I realised the paper display (with an issue date of August 15) was incorrect.
Which was a pain, as it meant I didn't have time to get a bag of chips!

No idea whether other services are in a similar position.

Some of the 22s are missing from the digital display entirely - the 16:07 is one of them, IIRC. There's also a lot missing on a Saturday morning.

Peterlee is a lot worse. There's very little correlation between the paper timetables and digital displays, with a few services even having discrepancies when it comes to stands.

If you think those are bad, the screen at Aycliffe Town Centre only displays Durham bound service 7's, for some reason the 5/5A and town service 17 don't show up.

I've noticed differences between screens and paper timetables.

(05 Feb 2016, 11:26 am)BusLoverMum wrote Some of the 22s are missing from the digital display entirely - the 16:07 is one of them, IIRC. There's also a lot missing on a Saturday morning.

Peterlee is a lot worse. There's very little correlation between the paper timetables and digital displays, with a few services even having discrepancies when it comes to stands.

Maybe operators need to carry out additional audits and checks on the information local authorities are putting out?

It is in the operators interests to see up to date and correct data displayed for theie passengers.

Whilst not suggesting it would be cost effective to check every stop in the back of beyond, I am sure the odd check in various locations, covering a variety of routes may help.

It could be part of the new, improved working relationships seen by both sides of rhe fence, as opposed to the head in the sand/shrug of the shoulders/finger pointing we see all to often, such as the Edmondsley Cross

Any updates on the new bus station?

Although not Durham bus station but its the town centre:


Milburngate-public-exhibition-information-boards.

http://www.durhamriversiderenewal.co.uk/...boards.pdf


It looks really good, can't wait for the work to start, i love Durham and this is what it needs.

(19 Feb 2016, 6:18 pm)Michael wrote Although not Durham bus station but its the town centre:


Milburngate-public-exhibition-information-boards.

http://www.durhamriversiderenewal.co.uk/...boards.pdf


It looks really good, can't wait for the work to start, i love Durham and this is what it needs.

They could demolish North Road and leave it as a pile of rubble and it wouldn't be much worse, in places.

So, the new X21s will be departing from stand K, Bishop Auckland bound, at Durham bus station.

http://www.simplygo.com/news/changes-to-...om-5-march

That'll be fun when the 43 is sat in stand J, empty, for 10 minutes or more, leaving it a case of first come, first served for the 24 and the 7 and, now, the X21.

GNE's shiny new streetlites will end up hanging off the end, without a proper stand.

(03 Mar 2016, 5:05 pm)BusLoverMum wrote So, the new X21s will be departing from stand K, Bishop Auckland bound, at Durham bus station.

http://www.simplygo.com/news/changes-to-...om-5-march

That'll be fun when the 43 is sat in stand J, empty, for 10 minutes or more, leaving it a case of first come, first served for the 24 and the 7 and, now, the X21.

GNE's shiny new streetlites will end up hanging off the end, without a proper stand.

Just looked at the timetable and it should depart at 02 and 32 minutes past the hour which could be a problem as the 7 should arrive at 01 and 31 minutes past the hour, so especially in the event of the X21 running late it could cause havoc with the 7, it can be difficult enough with the 22/24 and 43 often pulling onto stand K if a bus is early or late. Wonder if this has been done as it follows the same route as the 7 between Durham Bus Station and Croxdale, should be intresting to see how it impacts passenger numbers on the 6, 7 and X21.

(03 Mar 2016, 5:25 pm)Jimmi wrote Just looked at the timetable and it should depart at 02 and 32 minutes past the hour which could be a problem as the 7 should arrive at 01 and 31 minutes past the hour, so especially in the event of the X21 running late it could cause havoc with the 7, it can be difficult enough with the 22/24 and 43 often pulling onto stand K if a bus is early or late. Wonder if this has been done as it follows the same route as the 7 between Durham Bus Station and Croxdale, should be intresting to see how it impacts passenger numbers on the 6, 7 and X21.

The pairing makes sense, it's just unfortunate that the allocated stand doesn't work.

And with that new time, I think we can be pretty certain that the 22 will never get a slot in stand J. (I hadn't realised that the new time was a tiny bit later than the old one - that's going to be tight for connections if I get the X21 home from Newcastle - just with the advantage of no longer having to run from one end of the station to the other!)

Durham Bus Station have double booked stand B for departures on the same time slot. The 21 and X21 are both booked for 06:55 and as expected they both arrived on time yesterday so the X21 had to take up an alternative stand to ensure both services departed on time.

(08 Mar 2016, 11:39 am)GuyParkRoyal wrote Durham Bus Station have double booked stand B for departures on the same time slot. The 21 and X21 are both booked for 06:55 and as expected they both arrived on time yesterday so the X21 had to take up an alternative stand to ensure both services departed on time.

Stand A often ends up being an overflow for stand B.

Peterlee is the same. The bus station is never even full as it has half the traffic, but still has stands double booked.

(08 Mar 2016, 11:39 am)GuyParkRoyal wrote Durham Bus Station have double booked stand B for departures on the same time slot. The 21 and X21 are both booked for 06:55 and as expected they both arrived on time yesterday so the X21 had to take up an alternative stand to ensure both services departed on time.

On Saturday mornings the 15 and 16A both leave Durham Bus Station at 08:50.

Sure enough, I came into Durham on a Bishop Auckland bound X21 yesterday afternoon and the 7 had to pull onto the 20/20A/X20/40 stand to drop off/load passengers as the X21 was on the stand the 7 uses. Yay, I sure that this won't happen on a regular basis! *sighs*

(08 Mar 2016, 11:39 am)GuyParkRoyal wrote Durham Bus Station have double booked stand B for departures on the same time slot. The 21 and X21 are both booked for 06:55 and as expected they both arrived on time yesterday so the X21 had to take up an alternative stand to ensure both services departed on time.

I'd suggest that some onus is on the operator here, rather than Durham Bus Station having double booked. It'd be difficult to specify that a particular run departs from a different stand, as it'd confuse customers.

Having said that, I can't see the logic in having two services follow each other between Durham and Chester, either.

---

(08 Mar 2016, 11:39 am)GuyParkRoyal wrote Durham Bus Station have double booked stand B for departures on the same time slot. The 21 and X21 are both booked for 06:55 and as expected they both arrived on time yesterday so the X21 had to take up an alternative stand to ensure both services departed on time.

I'd suggest that some onus is on the operator here, rather than Durham Bus Station having double booked. It'd be difficult to specify that a particular run departs from a different stand, as it'd confuse customers.

Having said that, I can't see the logic in having two services follow each other between Durham and Chester, either.

As predicted, this was the situation at 10:30

J 43
K 22
L x21
Hanging off the end: Prince Bishops

Thankfully, everything but the 22 had left by the time the 7 arrived. We ended up in stand G when I got here at 9:30

Oh, it's fun today!

Some buses parked up on stands for 10-15 minutes with other ones going twice around the block trying to get into one!

(18 Apr 2016, 5:20 pm)LeeCalder wrote I would just like to point out that there have been massive delays in Durham thanks to a National Express coach (I believe Go North East) breaking down on the roundabout outside of Durham Bus Station, as well as the Gilesgate Roundabout roadworks...

That doesn't help matters like.

Neither does late buses not being able to get on to stands, because other buses have been left there unmanned. It caused a bit of chaos with quite a bit running off timetable.

(18 Apr 2016, 8:53 pm)Adrian wrote That doesn't help matters like.

Neither does late buses not being able to get on to stands, because other buses have been left there unmanned. It caused a bit of chaos with quite a bit running off timetable.

One of my major gripes is drivers (particularly Prince Bishops drivers, although a lot of Arriva drivers do so as well) leaving the bus where the drop off point is and causing a massive tailback.

(18 Apr 2016, 9:01 pm)LeeCalder wrote One of my major gripes is drivers (particularly Prince Bishops drivers, although a lot of Arriva drivers do so as well) leaving the bus where the drop off point is and causing a massive tailback.

It used to be a case that the two layover stands at the entrance, were allocated specifically for the use of the ANE 7 and GNE 21. If that's still the case, then no other services should be using these stands.

It's more so hogging the actual stands that cause me the biggest gripe.