Skip to main content
(23 Apr 2022, 2:59 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Husband and youngest spied the flexility Street deck with very fed up looking driver and passengers at county hallI would be aswell if i just got that at CLS and it broke down 20 mins later.
(23 Apr 2022, 1:54 pm)JP6004 wrote Amazing no one ever comments when all 7 are out day after day, but soon as its not a full allocation all hell breaks loose on here
(23 Apr 2022, 5:32 pm)Storx wrote Are all 7 ever out on one day?I think I have only seen it once and that was back in February
In fairness though, it doesn't help it doesn't have any reasonable spares so they get flogged out every day no doubt some day with minor faults.
It's similar to Ashington and their Enviros.
A 20 year old B7 going to Berwick is never going to work. 15 year old Omnidekkas / B9's being the equivilant at CLS even known both could do it and no doubt actually better at it aswell.
(23 Apr 2022, 5:32 pm)Storx wrote Are all 7 ever out on one day?The original Pronto B7TLs seem better reliability wise! Those B5TLs need to come off given they could barely hack two years on the X9/X10. X70/X71/X72 would be better suited for them with Enviros covering the evening & Sunday boards on the X30/X72.
In fairness though, it doesn't help it doesn't have any reasonable spares so they get flogged out every day no doubt some day with minor faults.
It's similar to Ashington and their Enviros.
A 20 year old B7 going to Berwick is never going to work. 15 year old Omnidekkas / B9's being the equivilant at CLS even known both could do it and no doubt actually better at it aswell.
(23 Apr 2022, 9:02 pm)L469 YVK wrote The original Pronto B7TLs seem better reliability wise! Those B5TLs need to come off given they could barely hack two years on the X9/X10. X70/X71/X72 would be better suited for them with Enviros covering the evening & Sunday boards on the X30/X72.But will E400's be able to do those hills. I mean they seem to be handling the A19 okay.
(23 Apr 2022, 9:02 pm)L469 YVK wrote The original Pronto B7TLs seem better reliability wise! Those B5TLs need to come off given they could barely hack two years on the X9/X10. X70/X71/X72 would be better suited for them with Enviros covering the evening & Sunday boards on the X30/X72.
(23 Apr 2022, 9:29 pm)Storx wrote Good buses the B7's imo. I always think it's a shame they didn't make a 2 axle B8TL for routes that need a bit more rather relying on a turbo. The B5TL is fine for the likes of London though.Do you really think EYMS would give up 69 Plate E400 for some Hybrids.
For swapping things around, not sure how connected GNE and EYMS are but you'd probably be better sending all the B5TL's and as useless up here B5LH's for their 11 plate Enviros 400's (901 - 910) for the 16/16A and 69 plate Enviro 400 MMC's (911 - 921) for the X5/X15/X21. Least then the B5's are doing work which their pretty much designed for especially now the Zebra bid failed.
(23 Apr 2022, 9:49 pm)DaveFromUpNorth wrote Howay divint criticse GNE because services are taken out of serviceI hate to break it to you but buses are designed to run from 5-6 till 11. THe reason GNE is "targeted" is because there branded buses are branded to a route whcih they are never on because they are always off. Why brand a bus if its never going to be on the route. The X21 might aswell be called Voyager X21 not Xlines X21.
You never critise Arriva in the same way
X7 This week was taken out of service at Haymarket and driven to Jesmond Depot
GNE is targeted because of branded buses
I am more than happy to see every 15-21 days buses taken out of services for a service check they can run
But service 21 you complain about it but wow do some maths
Even think about it Newcastle to Durham and back to Newcastle how many miles is a round trip then work out how.many times in a day it is done
These buses are workhorses from 6am to 11pm
Decide what you want to complain about
Old buses running aka 10yr plus buses or want everything brand new then think about passengers on board and 'cutting services" because you think passengers don't use the service aka 309 310 311 evening services and Coast road as you deem so many passengers use it
Wake up and smell the coffee
(23 Apr 2022, 9:41 pm)Unber43 wrote Do you really think EYMS would give up 69 Plate E400 for some Hybrids.
And the hybrids will have to come here for maintence won't they? Might aswell bring the Volvo B7RLE MCV Evolution for 61
(23 Apr 2022, 9:49 pm)DaveFromUpNorth wrote Howay divint criticse GNE because services are taken out of service
You never critise Arriva in the same way
X7 This week was taken out of service at Haymarket and driven to Jesmond Depot
GNE is targeted because of branded buses
I am more than happy to see every 15-21 days buses taken out of services for a service check they can run
But service 21 you complain about it but wow do some maths
Even think about it Newcastle to Durham and back to Newcastle how many miles is a round trip then work out how.many times in a day it is done
These buses are workhorses from 6am to 11pm
Decide what you want to complain about
Old buses running aka 10yr plus buses or want everything brand new then think about passengers on board and 'cutting services" because you think passengers don't use the service aka 309 310 311 evening services and Coast road as you deem so many passengers use it
Wake up and smell the coffee
(23 Apr 2022, 9:29 pm)Storx wrote Good buses the B7's imo. I always think it's a shame they didn't make a 2 axle B8TL for routes that need a bit more rather relying on a turbo. The B5TL is fine for the likes of London though.EY are GNE's subsidary and fall under GNE's management. A swap like that would be logical if PVR's matched.
For swapping things around, not sure how connected GNE and EYMS are but you'd probably be better sending all the B5TL's and as useless up here B5LH's for their 11 plate Enviros 400's (901 - 910) for the 16/16A and 69 plate Enviro 400 MMC's (911 - 921) for the X5/X15/X21 with 6338 - 6340 filling the gaps. Least then the B5's are doing work which their pretty much designed for especially now the Zebra bid failed.
(23 Apr 2022, 9:29 pm)Storx wrote Good buses the B7's imo. I always think it's a shame they didn't make a 2 axle B8TL for routes that need a bit more rather relying on a turbo. The B5TL is fine for the likes of London though.Would you not take the EvoSetis for the X5/X15, or for the 47.
For swapping things around, not sure how connected GNE and EYMS are but you'd probably be better sending all the B5TL's and as useless up here B5LH's for their 11 plate Enviros 400's (901 - 910) for the 16/16A and 69 plate Enviro 400 MMC's (911 - 921) for the X5/X15/X21 with 6338 - 6340 filling the gaps. Least then the B5's are doing work which their pretty much designed for especially now the Zebra bid failed.
(24 Apr 2022, 4:59 pm)streetdeckfan wrote It'd be interesting to see actual reliability statistics on the B5s since they've moved to the X21. Without seeing the actual stats, I'd hazard a guess and say that reliability on the X21 has actually gone up. I certainly see less off-brand vehicles on it compared to when the 16 plate StreetDecks operated.X21 reliability has definitely gone up since the B5's were introduced, but it is still poor.
In my view, the issue with the 'reliability' is probably less down to the vehicles being less reliable, and more down to the vehicles being down for longer due to issues getting parts, which compounds resulting in multiple vehicles being off the road at once, whereas in the past there would just be one at a time, in rotation.
(24 Apr 2022, 4:28 pm)Unber43 wrote Would you not take the EvoSetis for the X5/X15, or for the 47.
Also 69' Plates don't have tables, wonder if they were moved whether they would be added.
Or because the EvoSetis are low height you could run them on the X70/71/72 leaving some E400 for X30/31/. Allowing for E400's to be on X5/X15 & X21
(24 Apr 2022, 6:22 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Nope, but they do have seat belts, which you can stretch across the gangway and click into the seats opposite thus creating your very own VIP section towards the rear of the bus.
(24 Apr 2022, 5:37 pm)Storx wrote Tbh it was more thinking about keeping all the B5's together down in Hull / EYMS where arguably they'd be best be. They're good buses on city work hence there's loads in service in London so would be ideal working around in Hull. The EvoSetis are B5's aswell so you'd just be swapping B5's for B5's.I just really want some EvoSeti's instead of more E400 MMC. I think they would suit the routes, especially the 47 (if they are Euro 6).
What comes up doesn't really matter though I suppose with the 69 plate Enviros. More B9's instead of the Enviro 400's could work either really for the 16/16A and have more fleet continuity. Even if it's the older ones so it balances out the age of the fleets a bit or if it doesn't actually need deckers bring some singles instead either.
(24 Apr 2022, 6:13 pm)mb134 wrote Isn't the X21 PVR 9? Without spares in the same spec/livery a missing B5 is always going to be noticeable - and with a reasonably high vehicle requirement it's always likely that one will be off the road.
MOT preparation, vandalism, regular servicing inspections, and accident damage repair are all reasons a vehicle could be off the road relatively long term without being linked to actual vehicle reliability. Couple that with apparent increased waiting times for parts, and the B5s being oddballs in the GNE fleet, it means that minor defects can potentially keep them off for longer than on more common vehicle types where there are possibly more parts kept in stores.
That said, realistically a PVR of 9 should probably have a branded spare, and I agree it's not a good look when you're trying to push the new X-Lines brand in the #betterthanever campaigns when there are Voyager deckers (that aren't even clearly GNE buses - especially with the "contract bus hire" taglines which gives the impression they've been hired in) operating the service on a regular basis. Have the Voyager B9s had USBs fitted, or seat retrims?
(24 Apr 2022, 7:10 pm)streetdeckfan wrote The fact that the two generic X-Lines 'Spares' now form part of the PVR for the X21 really does show how little they seem to care about it now. 20% of the allocated vehicles don't meet the promised spec of the route (assuming they're still promising tables, which they were last time I checked), so should I really expect anything better from whatever they have laying around to shove on the route?Would you rather have a Citaro or E400 seats over the Ex Lothian's.
I honestly wouldn't mind if the Voyagers were the same spec, but they're not. The seats, while tolerable, aren't the most comfortable for a 2 hour journey, there's no USB/sockets, no tables. I believe there's NSA, but it doesn't always work.
Sent from my AC2003 using Tapatalk
(24 Apr 2022, 7:19 pm)Unber43 wrote Would you rather have a Citaro or E400 seats over the Ex Lothian's.No, not in the slightest!
(24 Apr 2022, 6:26 pm)mb134 wrote Oh, in preparation for the installment of the Best Impressions sofa? Forward planning, I like it.Not a patch on this bad boy.
https://twitter.com/creatingdesire/statu...64?lang=en
(24 Apr 2022, 5:37 pm)Storx wrote Tbh it was more thinking about keeping all the B5's together down in Hull / EYMS where arguably they'd be best be. They're good buses on city work hence there's loads in service in London so would be ideal working around in Hull. The EvoSetis are B5's aswell so you'd just be swapping B5's for B5's.Eyms don't generally operate city only services in Hull. They go out to the surrounding villages. The city roads are very cobwebby in their layout, though, so they will serve main roads like holderness Road and Beverley Road, just like the angel serves Durham Road and the 56 Old Durham Road, before they leave the city.
What comes up doesn't really matter though I suppose with the 69 plate Enviros. More B9's instead of the Enviro 400's could work either really for the 16/16A and have more fleet continuity. Even if it's the older ones so it balances out the age of the fleets a bit or if it doesn't actually need deckers bring some singles instead either.
(25 Apr 2022, 12:45 am)streetdeckfan wrote So, I did some crude reliability stats based on the info available on Bustimes.You could do like different aged vehicles
I based it on the number of days that the vehicles were in service over the last 31 days, obviously it doesn't take into account the days were the PVR is reduced (ie. Sundays and bank holidays), but I also did a comparison excluding these days as in theory all vehicles should be in service. If a vehicle was only out for half a day, I counted it as half a day etc.
Of the 67 plate B5s, the average 'reliability' was 79%, or 90% if we only include days with a full PVR
For the B5 spares, the average 'reliability' was 68%, or 78%
It breaks down per vehicle thusly:
6308 - 77% - 92%
6309 - 97% - 100%
6310 - 61% - 72%
6311 - 80% - 94%
6312 - 84% - 96%
6313 - 75% - 88%
6314 - 79% - 90%
6334 - 73% - 82%
6335 - 63% - 74%
In the last 31 days, there have been 6 days where all B5s (including spares) have been in service, 10 days with one out of service, 7 days with 2 out of service, 1 day with 3 out of service, and 1 day with 6 out of service.
6310 has been out of service since the 14th April, but other than that, the longest a vehicle has been out of service was 3 days (with one of those days being a Sunday, so it could well have been out of service due to the reduced PVR)
As a comparison, I picked a new StreetDeck (6369) and E400 (6342) at 'random' (nothing to do with the numbers), with the StreetDeck being 74% reliable, and the E400 being 81% reliable. I couldn't be arsed to do a larger sample of them, so that's probably not that representative.
So, taking all that into consideration, I'd say the B5s are actually, on the whole, fairly reliable on the X21, with most of the issues stemming from the lack of branded spares other than the ones forming part of the PVR.
If the X21 had 2 extra branded vehicles (like it's supposed to), then there would have only been 2 days in the last month that there would have been 2 days with non X-lines vehicles
If I have some free time next week, I might calculate the reliability stats on some other vehicle types, maybe not doing a full month on them because I'm lazy, but I imagine checking 2 weeks worth would probably be enough
(25 Apr 2022, 12:45 am)streetdeckfan wrote So, I did some crude reliability stats based on the info available on Bustimes.I wouldn't say the B5s on X21 are any more reliable/unreliable than most of the other modern stock, there's always going to be times when a bus needs to be off the road whether that be for maintenance or has suffered some other issue (eg vandalism or something like a passenger taking ill on board), they're 4 years old now so have certainly been broken in by now.
I based it on the number of days that the vehicles were in service over the last 31 days, obviously it doesn't take into account the days were the PVR is reduced (ie. Sundays and bank holidays), but I also did a comparison excluding these days as in theory all vehicles should be in service. If a vehicle was only out for half a day, I counted it as half a day etc.
Of the 67 plate B5s, the average 'reliability' was 79%, or 90% if we only include days with a full PVR
For the B5 spares, the average 'reliability' was 68%, or 78%
It breaks down per vehicle thusly:
6308 - 77% - 92%
6309 - 97% - 100%
6310 - 61% - 72%
6311 - 80% - 94%
6312 - 84% - 96%
6313 - 75% - 88%
6314 - 79% - 90%
6334 - 73% - 82%
6335 - 63% - 74%
In the last 31 days, there have been 6 days where all B5s (including spares) have been in service, 10 days with one out of service, 7 days with 2 out of service, 1 day with 3 out of service, and 1 day with 6 out of service.
6310 has been out of service since the 14th April, but other than that, the longest a vehicle has been out of service was 3 days (with one of those days being a Sunday, so it could well have been out of service due to the reduced PVR)
As a comparison, I picked a new StreetDeck (6369) and E400 (6342) at 'random' (nothing to do with the numbers), with the StreetDeck being 74% reliable, and the E400 being 81% reliable. I couldn't be arsed to do a larger sample of them, so that's probably not that representative.
So, taking all that into consideration, I'd say the B5s are actually, on the whole, fairly reliable on the X21, with most of the issues stemming from the lack of branded spares other than the ones forming part of the PVR.
If the X21 had 2 extra branded vehicles (like it's supposed to), then there would have only been 2 days in the last month that there would have been 2 days with non X-lines vehicles
If I have some free time next week, I might calculate the reliability stats on some other vehicle types, maybe not doing a full month on them because I'm lazy, but I imagine checking 2 weeks worth would probably be enough
(24 Apr 2022, 10:24 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Eyms don't generally operate city only services in Hull. They go out to the surrounding villages. The city roads are very cobwebby in their layout, though, so they will serve main roads like holderness Road and Beverley Road, just like the angel serves Durham Road and the 56 Old Durham Road, before they leave the city.
