(02 Aug 2022, 12:39 am)col87 wrote The problem Go north east have done they gone to over the top. East Durham worked and it was more than a brand it was like a little company of its own within Go North East it was the local bus service for east Durham.

See personally I don't see the point in brands like that. Brands need to be unique to specific routes so you can distinguish it from others otherwise what's the point. It might aswell be just GNE and save the bother with difficulties with allocations.

You wouldn't go into a supermarket and see all the Kelloggs products all branded as let's say Super Cereal with the only difference being a small piece of text saying Chocolate Rings or Supergrain. They're all unique like CocoPops or Rice Krispies etc. It's the same with the brands imo.

There's a serious problem in Consett / Stanley now with the X Lines where everything is the same brand so it's pointless or Venture so the branding has no impact. Get shot of it imo and there's nothing different about X Lines X5/X15 buses and say the Diamond to further complicate things.

(02 Aug 2022, 9:45 am)Storx wrote See personally I don't see the point in brands like that. Brands need to be unique to specific routes so you can distinguish it from others otherwise what's the point. It might aswell be just GNE and save the bother with difficulties with allocations.

You wouldn't go into a supermarket and see all the Kelloggs products all branded as let's say Super Cereal with the only difference being a small piece of text saying Chocolate Rings or Supergrain. They're all unique like CocoPops or Rice Krispies etc. It's the same with the brands imo.

There's a serious problem in Consett / Stanley now with the X Lines where everything is the same brand so it's pointless or Venture so the branding has no impact. Get shot of it imo and there's nothing different about X Lines X5/X15 buses and say the Diamond to further complicate things.

It could be Durham Diamond 

Durham Diamond Express

(02 Aug 2022, 9:46 am)Unber43 wrote It could be Durham Diamond 

Durham Diamond Express

Wasn't the reason the Diamond was originally orange on the renowns so they could be seen in the snow? Weren't they also one of the few buses to have fleet number on the roof too, so it was easily spotted from the air?

(02 Aug 2022, 10:15 am)JP6004 wrote Wasn't the reason the Diamond was originally orange on the renowns so they could be seen in the snow? Weren't they also one of the few buses to have fleet number on the roof too, so it was easily spotted from the air?

Why?

(02 Aug 2022, 10:31 am)F114TML wrote Why?

In case it got stranded I imagine

The Prince Bishop have had there cant rails changed to show ,. SUNDERLAND / HOUGHTON / DURHAM...... Unfortunately I haven't got a picture

(02 Aug 2022, 1:40 pm)Retro Nero wrote The Prince Bishop have had there cant rails changed to show  ,. SUNDERLAND / HOUGHTON / DURHAM...... Unfortunately I haven't got a picture

The rear has also been changed to show stopping points from Durham to Sunderland

Apparently the Violet Mercs are having there cant rails rebranded for service 61 in the next few days, according to staff at Deptford this morning

(04 Aug 2022, 12:16 pm)Retro Nero wrote Apparently the Violet Mercs are having there cant rails rebranded in the next few days, according to staff at Deptford this morning

Prince Bishops is probably the priority. 

Then the Purples Debrand, Deptford have way too many solo's, you have 2 solo's on X20, 24/26/5/9 circuit.

Where will be contracts coming up hopefully they can use some of the spares if they will some contracts, especially in Durham, Bishop Auckland area which could hopefully come into a Out station.

All the Prince Bishops have already had there cant rails and rear updated this week.

(01 Aug 2022, 1:30 pm)F114TML wrote I'm on holiday in the lakes right now. Have to say, I'm quite impressed by Stagecoach's Lakes Connection branding - because they're actually putting a bit of effort into it.

Been to Bowness and saw this (sold already)

and in one of the shops, they had a stack of timetables (and when I say a stack, I mean a big crate about 4 feet high). The buses have a nice livery (and it is actually a livery, not just beachball but in a different colour, even though it is based on beachball. I notice they've updated the logo on it so i assume they're continuing with it - at least for now). Also, looked through the timetable leaflet I picked up - don't see any cheesy slogans (although it lists tickets, but directs you to a QR code for the prices - hmm), and the "Lakes Connection" name makes sense.

They say first impressions count - the bus service through the village I was expecting to be a Solo; cue me quite surprised when a branded E400 came through, making me look the route up myself. Want to do it myself (if I get the chance to is another question). I've not had that feeling from GNE (although is that because I'm from the area and know the network anyway?).

Update on this, I spent a day out riding the buses (and a boat and steam train). Very nice views, and got more chance to study the branding.

I said no "cheesy slogans", well...

... it's borderline. At least it makes sense unlike GNE's purple emperor flitting.

Right, onto more things I like and I think GNE should do.

Network maps at bus stops - you can't move for the fecking things (sorry these aren't the best pictures - not sure what's happened to the 2nd one tbh). Also note that they advertise the website and contactless payments at the stop.


The stop near to where I'm staying has a small fares advert in it, too

Also, all the buses carry the same livery; certain routes are sub-branded (the X4/X5 and 555 are what I've seen; what I find odd is the X4/X5 buses feature the route numbers, the 555 buses don't, though), but they're just additions of saying where the routes go, rather than the generic "See the best of the lakes by bus" tagline.

What I did notice (hard not to tbh) on the sub-branded buses (400MMCs on the 555, E300s on the X4/X5) was the coach-style seats.

I found there to be ample legroom (something that I struggle to find on most buses), and I did wonder why, for Xlines, GNE didn't go for these kinds of seats, over what is fitted in more conventional buses - it'd certainly set the Xlines routes out in terms of interior spec from the other routes, where it seems the only real difference is the cream headrest. I spent 2 hours in one of these seats and it was largely fine (would've been better if people didn't keep sitting next to me though). In case you're wondering, the USB port is under the seat in front.

What I'm trying to say is, Lakes Connection is good route branding (not perfect though) because they actually put effort into it. It's more than just some paint slapped on the vehicle. I've just gone on the twitter page and... would you look at that! Who thought you could advertise specific routes?!
https://twitter.com/StagecoachCNL/status...1154241540
https://twitter.com/StagecoachCNL/status...9038954496
https://twitter.com/StagecoachCNL/status...2717768709
They also seem to use the hashtag #LakesConnection on service updates affecting branded routes. Probably wouldn't work for GNE as they have so many, but maybe they could make one out of #SunderlandDistrict, #Xlines, #EastGateshead ?

New (nearly new) Euro 6 Citaros for the 57/58:

https://twitter.com/davc32001/status/1555525325236457473?s=21&t=EIU6FzusPcTu9_VtvajuGg

EDIT: oh, nope, our roads strips are the other way round. 

Here's a thing I noticed while on the 61 this morning.

I was on a Violet Citaro, closely followed by a Blonde solo on the 60 (I later saw it on the X6). I noticed passengers would stick their hand out for the significantly busier 60, rather than the 61 which runs exactly the same route. There can't be that many people on a morning returning to Sunderland on a return ticket, surely (that's even assuming a return on that section is only valid on the 60)? Did they go for the 60 because the 60 is branded, despite it being an off-brand bus? Are they passing the Citaro because they don't like them for one reason or another?

It seemed very odd.

(10 Aug 2022, 2:38 pm)F114TML wrote Here's a thing I noticed while on the 61 this morning.

I was on a Violet Citaro, closely followed by a Blonde solo on the 60 (I later saw it on the X6). I noticed passengers would stick their hand out for the significantly busier 60, rather than the 61 which runs exactly the same route. There can't be that many people on a morning returning to Sunderland on a return ticket, surely (that's even assuming a return on that section is only valid on the 60)? Did they go for the 60 because the 60 is branded, despite it being an off-brand bus? Are they passing the Citaro because they don't like them for one reason or another?

It seemed very odd.

I suppose it happens a lot, it happens with the 28 they just let them go and wait for a 21. 

And wouldn't you pick the 60 over the 61 it is more often 5ph over 2ph. THe 61 should not be doing the same route from Seaton to Sunderland, the 60 should move upto every 10 mins and the 61 should be extended via Avenue and Station Road then Moorside, Farringdon, A690 Sunderland. 

There has been no need for the 61 to follow the same route as the 60 for ages.

(10 Aug 2022, 2:48 pm)Unber43 wrote I suppose it happens a lot, it happens with the 28 they just let them go and wait for a 21. 

And wouldn't you pick the 60 over the 61 it is more often 5ph over 2ph. THe 61 should not be doing the same route from Seaton to Sunderland, the 60 should move upto every 10 mins and the 61 should be extended via Avenue and Station Road then Moorside, Farringdon, A690 Sunderland. 

There has been no need for the 61 to follow the same route as the 60 for ages.

And what's in it for the people of Murton who now have an extra 20-30 minutes onto their journey?

(10 Aug 2022, 2:51 pm)F114TML wrote And what's in it for the people of Murton who now have an extra 20-30 minutes onto their journey?

 The only people who use the 61 is the people coming from Peterlee Murton to Sunderland and going to Dalton Park. 

You could bring out a route saver for the 61/60 for day tickets, surprised GNE haven't done that for the 20/X20.

(10 Aug 2022, 2:48 pm)Unber43 wrote And wouldn't you pick the 60 over the 61 it is more often 5ph over 2ph.

Also, I'd pick the first one that came.

I think there’s a lot of assumptions that go on here, the first is that we assume everyone knows the bus network inside out - whilst in this case the 60 and 61 follow the same route from New Seaham into Sunderland, there’s plenty of examples where just because a bus says “XX Sunderland” does not mean it’s going the same route and arriving the same time you need to be there for. Think about Peterlee up until last month you’ve had the X6, 22, 23, 55 and 61 all displaying “Sunderland” when leaving Peterlee Bus Station but they all go different routes, even now there’s four routes with the same terminus. Can you imagine if someone was told by a journey planner use the X6 but then used the 61 instead just because they both said they were going to Sunderland. In the 60 vs 61 case, if people are using journey planners, the likelihood is it’s said get the 60 as it’s more frequent, so I think we can excuse a lot of passenger for not willing choosing the 61.

Second, is people might meet friends/family on the bus too. Particularly young people might have mate who gets on the 60 on The Avenue so they’ll get the same 60 with them through to Sunderland therefore won’t get the 61 even if it arrives first. But even young families I’ve seen met up on the bus on their way somewhere.

(10 Aug 2022, 2:38 pm)F114TML wrote Here's a thing I noticed while on the 61 this morning.

I was on a Violet Citaro, closely followed by a Blonde solo on the 60 (I later saw it on the X6). I noticed passengers would stick their hand out for the significantly busier 60, rather than the 61 which runs exactly the same route. There can't be that many people on a morning returning to Sunderland on a return ticket, surely (that's even assuming a return on that section is only valid on the 60)? Did they go for the 60 because the 60 is branded, despite it being an off-brand bus? Are they passing the Citaro because they don't like them for one reason or another?

It seemed very odd.

One thing to consider is the fact that the 61 runs via Park Road, Burdon Road, Holmeside etc to reach Park Lane Interchange from Murton on most journeys whereas the 60 goes straight up Stockton Road to enter Park Lane Interchange.

I would ditch the branding of individual services with the exception of XLines. I would keep the existing style of the corporate livery but have different colours for each area. Something like: -

Yellow/Orange for Tyne Valley/Tynedale area - All Services to be branded as Tyne Valley Ranger
Two tone green for County Durham (Chester le Street, Durham and Consett) - All Services to be branded County Durham Diamonds
Two tone blue for both North and South Tyneside (Existing Coaster Livery - which is very smart imo!), All services branded Coaster
Silver and Black for Newcastle and Gateshead - All services branded Toon and Tyne
Two tone red for Wearside (Existing S&D Cherry livery - for all services in Washington, Houghton and Sunderland) - All services branded Wear and There
Lilac/Purple for East Durham - All services branded East Durham Explorers

All Xlines would retain the Gold at the front, with the back the corresponding colour of the area they serve.

(11 Aug 2022, 9:44 pm)Washingtonian wrote I would ditch the branding of individual services with the exception of XLines. I would keep the existing style of the corporate livery but have different colours for each area. Something like: -

Yellow/Orange for Tyne Valley/Tynedale area - All Services to be branded as Tyne Valley Ranger
Two tone green for County Durham (Chester le Street, Durham and Consett) - All Services to be branded County Durham Diamonds
Two tone blue for both North and South Tyneside (Existing Coaster Livery - which is very smart imo!), All services branded Coaster
Silver and Black for Newcastle and Gateshead - All services branded Toon and Tyne
Two tone red for Wearside (Existing S&D Cherry livery - for all services in Washington, Houghton and Sunderland) - All services branded Wear and There
Lilac/Purple for East Durham - All services branded East Durham Explorers

All Xlines would retain the Gold at the front, with the back the corresponding colour of the area they serve.

Tbf thats what they tried with Sunderland & District an overall name with different sub names separating them I think that would work better.

(11 Aug 2022, 9:51 pm)Unber43 wrote Tbf thats what they tried with Sunderland & District an overall name with different sub names separating them I think that would work better.

Yeah I like the idea of an overall brand name for each area but I think there are way too many colours going on. They need to simplify it I think.

(11 Aug 2022, 9:56 pm)Washingtonian wrote Yeah I like the idea of an overall brand name for each area but I think there are way too many colours going on. They need to simplify it I think.

I mean you could have like

Sunderland Based Services have a blue main part, then the rear is a differnt colour e.g 

Sunderland & District Voilet would have a Blue Front Half, with a Purple rear.

(11 Aug 2022, 9:58 pm)Unber43 wrote I mean you could have like

Sunderland Based Services have a blue main part, then the rear is a differnt colour e.g 

Sunderland & District Voilet would have a Blue Front Half, with a Purple rear.

Yeah maybe. I thiink there are too many brand names now though and I think if there was one colour per area it wouldn't confuse people so much if the wrong bus allocation turns up on a route.

(11 Aug 2022, 10:06 pm)Washingtonian wrote Yeah maybe. I thiink there are too many brand names now though and I think if there was one colour per area it wouldn't confuse people so much if the wrong bus allocation turns up on a route.

Maybe, or maybe GNE just needs to sort out its allocations.

(11 Aug 2022, 9:44 pm)Washingtonian wrote I would ditch the branding of individual services with the exception of XLines. I would keep the existing style of the corporate livery but have different colours for each area. Something like: -

Yellow/Orange for Tyne Valley/Tynedale area - All Services to be branded as Tyne Valley Ranger
Two tone green for County Durham (Chester le Street, Durham and Consett) - All Services to be branded County Durham Diamonds
Two tone blue for both North and South Tyneside (Existing Coaster Livery - which is very smart imo!), All services branded Coaster
Silver and Black for Newcastle and Gateshead - All services branded Toon and Tyne
Two tone red for Wearside (Existing S&D Cherry livery - for all services in Washington, Houghton and Sunderland) - All services branded Wear and There
Lilac/Purple for East Durham - All services branded East Durham Explorers

All Xlines would retain the Gold at the front, with the back the corresponding colour of the area they serve.

Why not just have one brand... Go North East... Using the same new colour scheme they undoubtedly spent big bucks on redesigning? Worked before and it'll work again

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk

(11 Aug 2022, 10:37 pm)northern156 wrote Why not just have one brand... Go North East... Using the same new colour scheme they undoubtedly spent big bucks on redesigning? Worked before and it'll work again

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk

Well I would personally much prefer one brand and one livery too but I can't see this happening to be honest. Some of the current two tone liveries are very smart and my suggestion was based on the old set up in the 90s of Wear Buses, Go-Ahead Gateshead etc but in an up to date form. Either way whether its painting them all one livery or several it is going to cost a lot.

It doesn't look like branding is going anywhere, according to MG the 57 are getting a brand, there is still no news of what buses they're getting. However where the QuayCity's are going is still unknown I could imagine the 12.

(11 Aug 2022, 11:47 pm)Washingtonian wrote Well I would personally much prefer one brand and one livery too but I can't see this happening to be honest. Some of the current two tone liveries are very smart and my suggestion was based on the old set up in the 90s of Wear Buses, Go-Ahead Gateshead etc but in an up to date form. Either way whether its painting them all one livery or several it is going to cost a lot.

I'd much prefer to have the return of Northern, Coastline, Wear Buses to replace brands that have zero meaning and there is quite a few of them dotting about. 

I haven't done any paperbuses for a long time, might have to brush my MS Paint Skills and create some.

(12 Aug 2022, 7:19 pm)Unber43 wrote It doesn't look like branding is going anywhere, according to MG the 57 are getting a brand, there is still no news of what buses they're getting. However where the QuayCity's are going is still unknown I could imagine the 12.

Another utterly pointless brand which will no doubt last a few months before changing.