(16 Apr 2023, 4:27 pm)N1cholas wrote The biggest problem with the 135/136 is revenue, the high minority of passengers are concessions, very few paying customers so Nexus were paying for a service and also for the passengers to have a free taxi to the club as well, a bit like most Nexus secured services, the passengers don't really contribute with paying fares to keep the service running

This isn't aimed at you personally so no offence intended but I really don't get it when someone says a Nexus service "doesn't have many paying customers and isn't making enough money and therefore it needs to be scrapped". Isn't the whole point of Nexus funding a service to allow people to get to the club, to work, to the shops, and to towns and cities etc? In particular the elderly should rightly have free travel and have buses to the places they need to or want to be.

When it comes to a Nexus secured service it should come down to the number of people using it and not down to money or profit. To me if a service is being regularly used by a minimum average of around 5 to 10 people per journey regardless if they pay or not then the service is needed and should remain funded. It is being used.

Also, I don't understand why Nexus states that a bus used for a secured service must be no older than a certain age. It doesnt make sense to me why new buses are being bought to run services that are never going to get huge loadings. As long as a bus is safe, clean, and relaible then what does it matter about it's age?

(16 Apr 2023, 5:55 pm)purplesolo wrote The 520 has been saved for some reason and will also be ran by GNE. Assuming the 79’s and 520’s will interwork.

They will probably stand alone as the 79 will possibly be done with a streetlight and the 520 a solo, but they could use a sprinter

(17 Apr 2023, 1:23 pm)Washingtonian wrote Also, I don't understand why Nexus states that a bus used for a secured service must be no older than a certain age. It doesnt make sense to me why new buses are being bought to run services that are never going to get huge loadings. As long as a bus is safe, clean, and relaible then what does it matter about its age?

Is it to do with emissions standards and/or meeting disability requirements, or just generally newer vehicles will be more appealing to customers? 

I haven’t read the detail so I don’t know their requirements but the stricter the requirements the better surely.
Within a few years NSAs will likely (and rightly) be a mandatory requirement too.

(16 Apr 2023, 6:28 pm)Tiger5105 wrote A couple of corporate streetlites have appeared back at Consett, one being 5453 which, according to bustimes, has been used on the 1 recently. I wonder if the E200's are earmarked for a short stay at Consett and are transferring depots?

5453 has returned to Consett for MOT test preparation, not to be used.

5454 and 5455 are both still VOR and have yet to transfer.

(16 Apr 2023, 2:49 pm)Storx wrote Aye totally agreed to be honest, it's the same everywhere though. Every bus goes to Sunderland and Newcastle and that's about it want to travel around the city then tough luck, travel 20 minutes into Sunderland and then travel 30 minutes back and let's be honest who the hell wants to go to Sunderland.

Always reminds me of someone who lives in the West End of Newcastle who shops in Byker as it's the only place they can actually get from where they live (Benwell). At the time I was like wtf you going there for there's like 5 supermarkets around here but then you look at a route map, good luck getting to them.

Btw. on the 99 I really don't get the point of it, is it funded by ASDA or something? As it seems the only point of it.

(16 Apr 2023, 3:01 pm)F114TML wrote The 99's existed in various iterations for years (there's a stop at Seaburn Morrisons, somewhere, with a timetable on it for the 99 that's about 10 years out of date!) It's only been going to the ASDA since GNE dumped the 38 last year (before that it used to go along Premier Way to the Prospect, then back along Durham Road to the Barnes).

Hello all,

I’ve really enjoyed reading your posts about the Nexus changes. With regards to the 99 I had a relative who used to work at Redby. They had a number 9 service which ran from Seaburn Morrisons to Hylton Castle, it used to do quite well from what I was told. In Spring 2007 Redby made big changes and started a x2 circular routes from Seaburn Morrisons - the 9 & 99. The 9 would run from Seaburn to the City Centre via Roker and St Peter’s Campus, then up to the Royal Hospital and round through the Enterprise Park to Hylton Castle, Southwick, Fulwell and Seaburn. The 99 would do the opposite route. They brought in a Flat Fare for Adult Singles of £1 which proved very popular but I’m not sure if the routes were very successful. I heard Stagecoach retimed their buses to operate 10 mins in front of the 9 and 99, I’m not sure if this was true? They leased brand new buses ‘07’ plates for the new routes which were fantastic for the time.

In January 2008, Redby were bought out by GNE and GNE brought back the original 9 route but renumbering it the 99.

On a separate note regarding the current Nexus Service 558 run by Gateshead Central Taxis. The earlier journeys lately from Seaburn towards Heworth have been quite busy partly due to how many issues the Metro has been having between Sunderland and Pelaw.

Thanks.

(17 Apr 2023, 7:29 pm)Jonathan93102 wrote Hello all,

I’ve really enjoyed reading your posts about the Nexus changes. With regards to the 99 I had a relative who used to work at Redby. They had a number 9 service which ran from Seaburn Morrisons to Hylton Castle, it used to do quite well from what I was told. In Spring 2007 Redby made big changes and started a x2 circular routes from Seaburn Morrisons - the 9 & 99. The 9 would run from Seaburn to the City Centre via Roker and St Peter’s Campus, then up to the Royal Hospital and round through the Enterprise Park to Hylton Castle, Southwick, Fulwell and Seaburn. The 99 would do the opposite route. They brought in a Flat Fare for Adult Singles of £1 which proved very popular but I’m not sure if the routes were very successful. I heard Stagecoach retimed their buses to operate 10 mins in front of the 9 and 99, I’m not sure if this was true? They leased brand new buses ‘07’ plates for the new routes which were fantastic for the time.

In January 2008, Redby were bought out by GNE and GNE brought back the original 9 route but renumbering it the 99.

On a separate note regarding the current Nexus Service 558 run by Gateshead Central Taxis. The earlier journeys lately from Seaburn towards Heworth have been quite busy partly due to how many issues the Metro has been having between Sunderland and Pelaw.

Thanks.

Thank you for that, makes sense where the 99 came from then historically and makes an awful lot more sense than the thing that exists nowadays which just seems a pointless to me.

Would make sense with the 558 mind, since it's the only bus service around there which you could really use; quite a detour mind.

(17 Apr 2023, 8:57 pm)Storx wrote Thank you for that, makes sense where the 99 came from then historically and makes an awful lot more sense than the thing that exists nowadays which just seems a pointless to me.

Would make sense with the 558 mind, since it's the only bus service around there which you could really use; quite a detour mind.

I should add the 9 & 99 that Redby introduced ran Monday - Saturday from around 0700-1900. There was no service on a Sunday or Bank Holidays. They even put on an ex London Open Top Bus in London Transport Red over the Summer Holidays which is something we are seeing again now with Stagecoach.

I believe the earlier 9 service which ran between Seaburn and Hylton Castle was strictly Monday - Friday and would not start till 0900 on school days. The buses that were on it would come off Scholar Services straight onto the 9. They also had a so called lunchtime layover in Seaburn Morrisons Car Park of an hour around 1300 I believe. I think this lunchtime layover happened again when GNE took over the route in 2008 as the 99. Redby did used to serve the 9 route 7 days week in the early 2000’s but I’m not sure why it got dropped to Monday - Friday only. They did run services for Stagecoach in Sunderland up until the start of the new circular 9 & 99 routes in Spring 2007, the routes which ran to the Docks.

I’m not sure what things are like down at Seaburn now but I know the area has changed massively since 2007 with the new hotel and restaurants opening up as well as the Seaburn Stack. It would be interesting if GNE would return to the area - I’m not really clued up so could not comment. I do remember GNE used to have a Service 161 which ran from Low Moorsley or Hetton-le-Hole to Seaburn Camp turning circle. That was pre-2008 I believe.

Thanks.

(18 Apr 2023, 7:34 am)Jonathan93102 wrote I should add the 9 & 99 that Redby introduced ran Monday - Saturday from around 0700-1900. There was no service on a Sunday or Bank Holidays. They even put on an ex London Open Top Bus in London Transport Red over the Summer Holidays which is something we are seeing again now with Stagecoach.

I believe the earlier 9 service which ran between Seaburn and Hylton Castle was strictly Monday - Friday and would not start till 0900 on school days. The buses that were on it would come off Scholar Services straight onto the 9. They also had a so called lunchtime layover in Seaburn Morrisons Car Park of an hour around 1300 I believe. I think this lunchtime layover happened again when GNE took over the route in 2008 as the 99. Redby did used to serve the 9 route 7 days week in the early 2000’s but I’m not sure why it got dropped to Monday - Friday only. They did run services for Stagecoach in Sunderland up until the start of the new circular 9 & 99 routes in Spring 2007, the routes which ran to the Docks.

I’m not sure what things are like down at Seaburn now but I know the area has changed massively since 2007 with the new hotel and restaurants opening up as well as the Seaburn Stack. It would be interesting if GNE would return to the area - I’m not really clued up so could not comment. I do remember GNE used to have a Service 161 which ran from Low Moorsley or Hetton-le-Hole to Seaburn Camp turning circle. That was pre-2008 I believe. 

Thanks.

There was also the 164 which ran a similar route to the 194 between Easington Lane/Penshaw Bank Top and then followed the 638 route from there to Sunderland (offering a half hourly service for the residents of Barnwell to/from Sunderland).

Just checked the timetable out in The Bygone Era and it didn't go in to Park Lane TO Seaburn. But did on the return. Used it many times, but can't remember the specifics about it's route in Sunderland City Centre.

Off memory, pretty sure it went a few years prior to the 2006 changes though.

(18 Apr 2023, 7:38 am)Andreos1 wrote There was also the 164 which ran a similar route to the 194 between Easington Lane/Penshaw Bank Top and then followed the 638 route from there to Sunderland (offering a half hourly service for the residents of Barnwell to/from Sunderland).

Just checked the timetable out in The Bygone Era and it didn't go in to Park Lane TO Seaburn. But did on the return. Used it many times, but can't remember the specifics about it's route in Sunderland City Centre.

Off memory, pretty sure it went a few years prior to the 2006 changes though.

The 164 on deregulation in October 1986 also got extended from Sunderland to South Shields operating limited stop. From memory think it only stopped at Wheatsheaf, The Grange Fulwell, Cleadon Pond, Harton Nook, Westoe and Shields Keppel St.   Used it a few times and was a good fast alternative to the all stops 535/536

(18 Apr 2023, 7:38 am)Andreos1 wrote There was also the 164 which ran a similar route to the 194 between Easington Lane/Penshaw Bank Top and then followed the 638 route from there to Sunderland (offering a half hourly service for the residents of Barnwell to/from Sunderland).

Just checked the timetable out in The Bygone Era and it didn't go in to Park Lane TO Seaburn. But did on the return. Used it many times, but can't remember the specifics about it's route in Sunderland City Centre.

Off memory, pretty sure it went a few years prior to the 2006 changes though.

When there diverted the 164 via Chester road and shiney row it was always going to end of the axe of the whole service, practically duplicating long established bus services, should of left it via Durham road, it was a lot better when it was a limited stop service .

Many times caught the 164 to Seaburn , yea Park Lane bus station to Houghton but Vine Place and Fawcett street to Seaburn


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(18 Apr 2023, 8:30 am)ifm001 wrote The 164 on deregulation in October 1986 also got extended from Sunderland to South Shields operating limited stop. From memory think it only stopped at Wheatsheaf, The Grange Fulwell, Cleadon Pond, Harton Nook, Westoe and Shields Keppel St.   Used it a few times and was a good fast alternative to the all stops 535/536

Yea, got changed as soon as possible in the first list of bus changes after dereg in Jan/feb 87 and sent to Seaburn instead, when the 220 sequence got renumbered to the 151/152 sequence at dereg 86 then back to the 220 in Jan/Feb 87 which confused the passengers as you had the northern 151/152 Fawcett street to Murton and the 151/152 Fawcett st to Durham, probably because the bus used to do both routes, bring back the days when passengers were put first instead of profit [emoji23]


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(18 Apr 2023, 8:37 am)cbma06 wrote When there diverted the 164 via Chester road and shiney row it was always going to end of the axe of the whole service, practically duplicating long established bus services, should of left it via Durham road, it was a lot better when it was a limited stop service . 

Many times caught the 164 to Seaburn , yea Park Lane bus station to Houghton but Vine Place and Fawcett street to Seaburn


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Yea, got changed as soon as possible in the first list of bus changes after dereg in Jan/feb 87 and sent to Seaburn instead, when the 220 sequence got renumbered to the 151/152 sequence at dereg 86 then back to the 220 in Jan/Feb 87 which confused the passengers as you had the northern 151/152 Fawcett street to Murton and the 151/152 Fawcett st to Durham, probably because the bus used to do both routes, bring back the days when passengers were put first instead of profit [emoji23]


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Ah I dunno. They must have got about 10 years out of the 164 going via Penshaw. 
Compared to what they give services now, that's quite something!

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(18 Apr 2023, 8:30 am)ifm001 wrote The 164 on deregulation in October 1986 also got extended from Sunderland to South Shields operating limited stop. From memory think it only stopped at Wheatsheaf, The Grange Fulwell, Cleadon Pond, Harton Nook, Westoe and Shields Keppel St.   Used it a few times and was a good fast alternative to the all stops 535/536

Didn't they have a Newcastle 'Express' that was a variation of the 160 or 164 at some point?
Inevitably limited stop via Newcastle Road like the failures both before and after.

If we weren't in an era of perpetual decline, I could see an express along there coming back again for another go!

(18 Apr 2023, 9:53 am)Andreos1 wrote Ah I dunno. They must have got about 10 years out of the 164 going via Penshaw. 
Compared to what they give services now, that's quite something!

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Didn't they have a Newcastle 'Express' that was a variation of the 160 or 164 at some point?
Inevitably limited stop via Newcastle Road like the failures both before and after.

If we weren't in an era of perpetual decline, I could see an express along there coming back again for another go!

I didn’t think it was about 10 years, even though I remember all sorts allocated to the 164, from nationals, double deckers, Marshall darts and metro riders on Chester road.

I remember the 2 cities express x23 then x23/x24 with x24 via cleadon, which eventually replaced with the x61/x64 from Houghton area to Newcastle via Sunderland

Express services these days are not really GNE portfolio, as not stopping at bus stops along the route not picking up potential fare paying passengers for income for a profit business


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(18 Apr 2023, 10:37 am)cbma06 wrote I didn’t think it was about 10 years, even though I remember all sorts allocated to the 164, from nationals, double deckers, Marshall darts and metro riders on Chester road.

I remember the 2 cities express x23 then x23/x24 with x24 via cleadon, which eventually replaced with the x61/x64 from Houghton area to Newcastle via Sunderland 

Express services these days are not really GNE portfolio, as not stopping at bus stops along the route not picking up potential fare paying passengers for income for a profit business


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Don't forget the often talked about (on here anyway) X3 either

Aye, I remember using it early/mid 90s and it mustn't have been until the late 90s/esrly 00s that it went. Possibly the same time Philly depot closed.

Worth pointing out the Coaster appears to be OK now following the change at the end of March. Early teething problems look like they've now gone. Made a few journeys yesterday and not one bus was more than 5 minutes late!

(17 Apr 2023, 3:40 pm)ne14ne1 wrote Is it to do with emissions standards and/or meeting disability requirements, or just generally newer vehicles will be more appealing to customers? 

I haven’t read the detail so I don’t know their requirements but the stricter the requirements the better surely.
Within a few years NSAs will likely (and rightly) be a mandatory requirement too.

Thanks. Yeah I understand there will be requirements for emissions and disabilities etc. It just seems odd to be throwing hundreds of thousands to millions of pounds to fund secured services with new buses when they then cut the services months later because they are making no money on them. I would have thought funding to modify slightly older buses to meet the requirements would cost less. As we all know Nexus services are never going to be profitable and that's why they are funded.

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Agree with those on here suggesting GNE should provide more buses to Seaburn. There's plenty there to attract people now and it would be great for people going there in the school holidays and to the illuminations etc. Would love to have a direct bus there from Washington. Could maybe extend a 56 there once every hour weekends and evenings when the illuminations are on and every half hour during the day on bank holidays and school holidays? Thinking along similar lines to how they've extended the 50 to Marsden on a Sunday

Would a 26/5/27 extension possibly be something good. As on the 56 you would just be looping around Sunderland just to come out the same way you came in.

Possibly the 20/60 could be one.

(18 Apr 2023, 9:20 pm)Washingtonian wrote Thanks. Yeah I understand there will be requirements for emissions and disabilities etc. It just seems odd to be throwing hundreds of thousands to millions of pounds to fund secured services with new buses when they then cut the services months later because they are making no money on them. I would have thought funding to modify slightly older buses to meet the requirements would cost less. As we all know Nexus services are never going to be profitable and that's why they are funded.

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Agree with those on here suggesting GNE should provide more buses to Seaburn. There's plenty there to attract people now and it would be great for people going there in the school holidays and to the illuminations etc. Would love to have a direct bus there from Washington. Could maybe extend a 56 there once every hour weekends and evenings when the illuminations are on and every half hour during the day on bank holidays and school holidays? Thinking along similar lines to how they've extended the 50 to Marsden on a Sunday

In fairness the contracts are only Euro 5 and they've been around since 2009 now.

If some operator can't get a bus past 2009 then there's something seriously wrong and they probably shouldn't be anywhere near running them.

Any which are Euro 6, bar a few exceptions, are because of the LEZ and even those have been around since 2015 now, it's just the issue NE operators haven't bothered to invest lately and for Stagecoach and Arriva it was well before Covid.

Yes I agree with the comments about Seaburn, the area has changed massively in the past 10 years and I honestly think it’s a much more interesting place now with the addition of the Stack.

I think the areas of Seaburn, Whitburn, Cleadon, East Boldon, West Boldon & Fellgate lost a lot of routes when the Metro starting running on the Sunderland extension towards South Hylton.

I was looking at some of the time timetables in the bygone era on this site and was amazed at some of the routes pre 2002.

The 558 ran morning through till night between Seaburn & Heworth.

There was the X97 between Seaburn and Newcastle. I remember going on this regularly and it was ran on those old buses that look a bit like a Pacer train.

With regards to the more recent X3 I caught that a few times from Newcastle and I remember it being completely full most times it left Eldon Square.

Thanks.

(19 Apr 2023, 7:46 am)Jonathan93102 wrote Yes I agree with the comments about Seaburn, the area has changed massively in the past 10 years and I honestly think it’s a much more interesting place now with the addition of the Stack.

I think the areas of Seaburn, Whitburn, Cleadon, East Boldon, West Boldon & Fellgate lost a lot of routes when the Metro starting running on the Sunderland extension towards South Hylton.

I was looking at some of the time timetables in the bygone era on this site and was amazed at some of the routes pre 2002.

The 558 ran morning through till night between Seaburn & Heworth.

There was the X97 between Seaburn and Newcastle. I remember going on this regularly and it was ran on those old buses that look a bit like a Pacer train.

With regards to the more recent X3 I caught that a few times from Newcastle and I remember it being completely full most times it left Eldon Square.

Thanks.

Did the X97 at one time run to Silks worth?

(19 Apr 2023, 8:30 am)Retro Nero wrote Did the X97 at one time run to Silks worth?

I’m not too sure about that, perhaps someone else will know? I did remember an X96 that I think came from Peterlee that went through the Boldon’s, there was also an X95 but I don’t remember where that went.

(19 Apr 2023, 8:30 am)Retro Nero wrote Did the X97 at one time run to Silks worth?

Redby Travel operated the X97 Silksworth-Sunderland-Newcastle, with Northern operated the X91 5 minutes in front of the X97


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(19 Apr 2023, 7:18 pm)Jonathan93102 wrote I’m not too sure about that, perhaps someone else will know? I did remember an X96 that I think came from Peterlee that went through the Boldon’s, there was also an X95 but I don’t remember where that went.

X95 was from Parkside (Seaham) to Newcastle.

(19 Apr 2023, 7:18 pm)Jonathan93102 wrote I’m not too sure about that, perhaps someone else will know? I did remember an X96 that I think came from Peterlee that went through the Boldon’s, there was also an X95 but I don’t remember where that went.

The X95, Parkside, Seaham, Ryhope, Park Lane, Chester Road upto Hastings Hill, Washington Concord bus station, Gateshead ,Newcastle Eldon Square.

X96, Seaham Harbour, Seaham coast road, Ryhope,Park Lane, Newcastle Road, Boldon, Gateshead, Newcastle Eldon Square. Originally the X4 went via Newcastle Road and Boldon before it was re routed via Washington Galleries.

Later in life x96 was extended to Peterlee from Seaham when service northern service 233 was withdrawn between Seaham and Peterlee.


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(20 Apr 2023, 6:18 am)cbma06 wrote The X95, Parkside, Seaham, Ryhope, Park Lane, Chester Road upto Hastings Hill, Washington Concord bus station, Gateshead ,Newcastle Eldon Square.

X96, Seaham Harbour, Seaham coast road, Ryhope,Park Lane, Newcastle Road, Boldon, Gateshead, Newcastle Eldon Square. Originally the X4 went via Newcastle Road and Boldon before it was re routed via Washington Galleries.

Later in life x96 was extended to Peterlee from Seaham when service northern service 233 was withdrawn between Seaham and Peterlee.


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Prior to the X96 at deregulation it was the X37 from Ryhope Green-Sunderland Park Lane- East and West Boldon-Newcastle.

I can't remember the X4 via Boldon after 1986 so must have been before dereg.

X95 always seemed the quickest express from. Park Lane to Newcastle.

(20 Apr 2023, 9:50 am)ifm001 wrote Prior to the X96 at deregulation it was the X37 from Ryhope Green-Sunderland Park Lane- East and West Boldon-Newcastle.

I can't remember the X4 via Boldon after 1986 so must have been before dereg.

Yea well before dereg, does anybody know when Washington galleries was built, maybe the x4 was rerouted when the galleries opened maybe, as Washington Concord bus station was the main town centre a place to go in that era [emoji23]

I think the same as the originally X6 from Sunderland to Consett, used to take an hour from end to end, can’t do that these days even though it went straight along Chester road between Sunderland and Chester-le-street and later diverted to Washington galleries then diverted upto Langley park from Chester


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(20 Apr 2023, 10:50 am)idiot wrote X95 always seemed the quickest express from. Park Lane to Newcastle.

Yea, used to get it a lot from Grindon Mill to Newcastle as when it only stopped at Hastings Hill then Concord then Gateshead then 2 stops in Newcastle , from Park Lane only took about 45 minutes, I think the x96 was similar time aswell, X4 took an hour.


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There was the X92/X93 Newcastle-Murton in the 90's

The old x4 also served castletown .
Newcastle Rd and Boldon was served by the service 130 then quite a few years later came the introduction of the 131 serving Boldon Bank Top and Downhill between Newcastle and Sunderland

(20 Apr 2023, 12:11 pm)V514DFT wrote There was the X92/X93 Newcastle-Murton in the 90's

Originally when northern had the service it used to start from Horden area, I wonder if the service was originally set up as a miners service at the start.


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(20 Apr 2023, 12:30 pm)Retro Nero wrote The old x4 also served castletown .
Newcastle Rd and Boldon was served by the service 130 then quite a few years later came the introduction of the 131 serving Boldon Bank Top and Downhill between Newcastle and Sunderland

The Sunderland to Newcastle 130 was originally the 230 Newcastle-Sunderland-Hartlepool-Middlesbrough many decades ago, the service got cut and United took the Sunderland to Middlesbrough section (don’t know when the Hartlepool to Middlesbrough got cut), the Sunderland to Newcastle went to northern and eventually renumbered 130


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(19 Apr 2023, 7:25 pm)cbma06 wrote Redby Travel operated the X97 Silksworth-Sunderland-Newcastle, with Northern operated the X91 5 minutes in front of the X97


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See growing up in Silksworth all i can remember was the X90 to Ryhope-Newcastle was later extended to Seaham in Early 2000s mainly ran by Optare Spectras and the odd B10M Plaxton Verde, was the X91/97 Ran in the early 90s ?


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