(01 Dec 2024, 5:52 pm)Storx wrote I know this is starting to mix up subsidised and commercial routes now so it's a bit more complicated but for the stuff you mentioned I'd do something like:



X2 (Was 25) - 8 - 50

Reasons for changes:

• Faster 50 route into Washington not around the world.
  
• New link from Washington, CLS and South Birtley to Stadium of Light on the 8
  
• Extension of 82 so it actually goes somewhere rather than terminating in a business park.
  
• Quicker X2 from Washington to Sunderland, should help reduce some loads on Chester Road
  
• New direct links to Newcastle in South Washington without changing
  
• New direct links from Birtley to Sunderland
  
• New direct links to the East from North Chester Le Street and Vigo Lane
  
• Sorts out the absolute mess of the 81/82.
  
• 4 BPH between Castletown, Southwick and Sunderland (combined with 35).
  
• More express buses between Newcastle / QE / Wrekenton and another express route for Birtley avoiding Low Fell.
  

Negatives

• Very small section of Washington loses direct link to Chester Le Street
  
• Picktree loses 2 buses an hour, but there's nothing there anyway
  

This is the sort of stuff where BSIP should be going imo. For the rest of the stuff you mentioned you've got the 2/2A to play around with as they don't really need to do the route they do into Washington anymore as they're covered by the X2 or 8 so there's flexibility to play with them.

Whilst youre at it maybe sort out the 26, 27, 33, 35, 39/A/B, 51/52 57/58, 61 & R2.

(01 Dec 2024, 6:25 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote Whilst youre at it maybe sort out the 26, 27, 33, 35, 39/A/B, 51/52 57/58, 61 & R2.

Ha I wouldn't have a clue, just know Birtley as I used to have a mate who lived nearby so had to get a bus there once in a blue moon.

Personally I think Durham Road is one of the worst corridors in the North East though. Way too many buses on the 21 which force people on the further out areas to suffer horribly long journey times as they're stopping every 50 yards and not enough express services from the likes of Chester Le Street or alternatively places like Waldridge Park and Fencehouses with no service at all without a change.

2 buses an hour on the 21 is enough beyond the Angel imo, if there was a decent express service getting people from Birtley and Chester Le Street to Newcastle where ultimately people want to be. What you do with the other 6 buses is open for debate but removing the duplicates like the 25 and 29 would be a good start.

(01 Dec 2024, 6:25 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote Whilst youre at it maybe sort out the 26, 27, 33, 35, 39/A/B, 51/52 57/58, 61 & R2.

Btw I know you were trying to kill off the Washington Locals before which I agree with personally I'd look at splitting the 56 so you'd end up with three routes like this:



55: Newcastle to Washington
56: Newcastle to Sunderland
57: Washington to Sunderland

Then combine them together to give a 10 minute service on the combined parts with hopefully the extra passengers coming from what is the current Washington 'loop' being enough to make it sustainable.

20 minute is more than enough for the full route, I'd doubt there's that many crossing over Concord.

'Loop' being sarcastic as it turns around in Concord anyway so wouldn't be a change anyway.

(01 Dec 2024, 5:52 pm)Storx wrote I know this is starting to mix up subsidised and commercial routes now so it's a bit more complicated but for the stuff you mentioned I'd do something like:



X2 (Was 25) - 8 - 50

Reasons for changes:

• Faster 50 route into Washington not around the world.
  
• New link from Washington, CLS and South Birtley to Stadium of Light on the 8
  
• Extension of 82 so it actually goes somewhere rather than terminating in a business park.
  
• Quicker X2 from Washington to Sunderland, should help reduce some loads on Chester Road
  
• New direct links to Newcastle in South Washington without changing
  
• New direct links from Birtley to Sunderland
  
• New direct links to the East from North Chester Le Street and Vigo Lane
  
• Sorts out the absolute mess of the 81/82.
  
• 4 BPH between Castletown, Southwick and Sunderland (combined with 35).
  
• More express buses between Newcastle / QE / Wrekenton and another express route for Birtley avoiding Low Fell.
  

Negatives

• Very small section of Washington loses direct link to Chester Le Street
  
• Picktree loses 2 buses an hour, but there's nothing there anyway
  

This is the sort of stuff where BSIP should be going imo. For the rest of the stuff you mentioned you've got the 2/2A to play around with as they don't really need to do the route they do into Washington anymore as they're covered by the X2 or 8 so there's flexibility to play with them.

You could easily shave 40 minutes off the journey time by not having the existing route going through every estate and instead have it run Express between Durham & CLS, CLS & Washington and Washington and Boldon to South Shields, end to end would be 60 minutes rather than a 100 as it is now.

The 82 Extension could be from Waterview Park and have it operate through onto Nissan then operate the northern section of the current 50 route into South Shields, from opposite side of the route from Birtley have it run down into CLS to pick up the western section of the route into Durham

With the X2 I agree there should be an express service, personally I would withdraw the 2A and have the 8 go through Biddick rather than Glebe or have a variation of the 4 cover this section of the route covering through to the top of Penshaw.

I think the Evening/Sunday only Service 81 should run all day 7 days a week with an extension from Gateshead into Newcastle creating a permanent direct link.

You could play the Stagecoach Express Card by having an X56 running from the City Centre via the 56 route then from Town End Farm direct into Gateeshead onto Newcastle via A19/Felling Bypass again like the 50 offering a faster service without going around the houses and shaving around 30 minutes off of the journey.

(01 Dec 2024, 11:34 pm)Malarkey wrote You could easily shave 40 minutes off the journey time by not having the existing route going through every estate and instead have it run Express between Durham & CLS, CLS & Washington and Washington and Boldon to South Shields, end to end would be 60 minutes rather than a 100 as it is now.

The 82 Extension could be from Waterview Park and have it operate through onto Nissan then operate the northern section of the current 50 route into South Shields, from opposite side of the route from Birtley have it run down into CLS to pick up the western section of the route into Durham

With the X2 I agree there should be an express service, personally I would withdraw the 2A and have the 8 go through Biddick rather than Glebe or have a variation of the 4 cover this section of the route covering through to the top of Penshaw.

I think the Evening/Sunday only Service 81 should run all day 7 days a week with an extension from Gateshead into Newcastle creating a permanent direct link.

You could play the Stagecoach Express Card by having an X56 running from the City Centre via the 56 route then from Town End Farm direct into Gateeshead onto Newcastle via A19/Felling Bypass again like the 50 offering a faster service without going around the houses and shaving around 30 minutes off of the journey.

Aye the 50 is long like not sure there'd be much demand non stop though - possibly though.

The X2 was actually numbered for the other side of the route, just a complete fluke that the 2 exists in Sunderland. Just like having clean numbers and the X1/X2 both do Newcastle to Wrekenton rather than a random 25. My idea behind it was to try and get some Birtley people onto it aswell since it's quicker than the 21 aswell, like a mini Birtley express via the QE.

Don't disagree with sending that to Sunderland via the 81 route though to be fair but I do think the Wrekenton to Newcastle via Low Fell bit should be seperate. People from Birtley etc don't want to go on a magical tour of Gateshead imo with it running direct from Birtley to Wrekenton omitting the estate there aswell. Fixes the farce with the 82 to the QE aswell. 

It's better than the 25 to CLS as no-one is going to CLS, so it will run empty since the vast majority of people wanting there will be on the more frequent 21 and who wants to go there anyway, it's crap.

Not sure on the X56 though, is there much demand for it? All the last attempts of it failed pretty badly.

(01 Dec 2024, 6:25 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote Whilst youre at it maybe sort out the 26, 27, 33, 35, 39/A/B, 51/52 57/58, 61 & R2.

For the 39 group, I'd just remove the 39B and have the:

39 between Doxford and Sunderland
39A between Doxford and Pennywell

It looks like GNE are hoping to win the Washington section back by keeping the 39B.

-------------------

I'd say the 33, 35 and the 61 are ok as they are.

(01 Dec 2024, 6:25 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote Whilst youre at it maybe sort out the 26, 27, 33, 35, 39/A/B, 51/52 57/58, 61 & R2.

Watch this Space.......the above services (excluding 27,51/2 ,7,8 & R2) are having a reshuffle in January

(02 Dec 2024, 8:02 pm)Retro Nero wrote Watch this Space.......the above services (excluding 27,51/2 ,7,8 & R2) are having a reshuffle in January

Interesting, I wonder how they'll wreak the routes?



Want to bet the 20 changes - you know after they've just relaunched the brand................ because GNE like doing stuff like that.



Hopefully the 39 is simplified, we could see the 2/2A split at the city centre


-------------

I wonder if these changes are to remove the last 3 Versa from Deptford.


I really don't know what changes they could do tbh

(02 Dec 2024, 8:22 pm)Michael wrote Interesting, I wonder how they'll wreak the routes?



Want to bet the 20 changes - you know after they've just relaunched the brand................ because GNE like doing stuff like that.



Hopefully the 39 is simplified, we could see the 2/2A split at the city centre


-------------

I wonder if these changes are to remove the last 3 Versa from Deptford.


I really don't know what changes they could do tbh

As I say.... watch this Space, but a little teaser...... a few renumbering services and splitting routes.

Hopefully someone has actually sense and renumbered things appropiately.

When you've got a corridor of buses which are the 2/2A/39/39A/60/61 things are really messed up and they all go to same places pretty much. Talk about making things confusing for no reason.

It's much easier for someone to remember the 38/39/40 like on the West Road or 43/44/45 like through Gosforth. Chester Road isn't any better either, nor the 35/56 between Sunderland and Southwick.

Credit it's one thing which did change under Arriva for the better, I believe when Featham was in charge, as the Northumbria network was all over the place numbering wise aswell.

Regarding GoNorthEast North Tyneside network (was butchered down to 4 services now includes the abandoned arriva services). This is how I would improve the North Tyneside Network *without mentioning or altering the coast road (otherwise it gets too repetitive and boring)

This would utilise all of GNEs services and incorporate secured services. This would also extend the 57/57a to improve connections...

1/1a - Frequency = Every 15 Mins combined | PVR=18 (Split between Riverside & Percy Main)
Winlaton | Blaydon | Metrocentre | Gateshead | Newcastle | Byker | Wallsend | Howdon | North Shields | Tynemouth | Marden | Whitley Bay
Winlaton | Shibdon Bank | Metrocentre | Gateshead | Newcastle | Byker | Wallsend | Howdon | North Shields | Tynemouth | Marden | Whitley Bay
*services 1 & 49/49A merged for many reasons (split depot running, no need for Xlines in Dunston sort out deckers issue and improved connections)

41/41A - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=5.5
Wallsend | Battle Hill | Hadrian Park | Howdon | Willington Quay | Royal Quays | North Shields | Preston | Whitley Bay (loop clockwise or opposite)
*41A merged with 317/W1/W2/351, provide lots of new connections, route not made for end-end travel provides better buses in Whitley Estates

42  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins | PVR=4.5
Wallsend | Battle Hill | Hadrian Pk | Cobalt & Silverlink | Northumberland Pk | Backworth | Seaton Delaval | Cramlington | East Hartford/Nelson Village
*41 merged with 19 to reinstate connection Wallsend - Cramlington, terminus alternates 1bph to East Hartford and 1bph to Nelson Vllage

341/342  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=6
Wallsend | Forest Hall | Killingworth | Wideopen | Hazlerigg | Kingston Park | Newbiggin Hall | West Denton | Dumpling Hall | Blaydon
Wallsend | Longbenton | Killingworth | Wideopen | Dinnington | Kingston Pk | Newbiggin Hall | Chapel House | Throckley | Stella | Blaydon
*merged current 342 with old 42/42a to give better frequencies, no longer serving Dudley, and extends from Kingston Park to Blaydon for new links

353  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=4.3
Morpeth | Bedlington | Cramlington | Killingworth | Forest Hall | Northumberland Pk | Cobalt & Silverlink | TTTE | Royal Quays | North Shields
*route replaces current 43 Cramlington-Morpeth, merging with 19 (missing out shiremoor) to better accommodate increased 355 freqs and faster journeys

354  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=5.5
Newcastle | Four Lane Ends | Killingworth | Backworth | Shiremoor | Cobalt | New York | Chirton | North Shields
*route start swapped with 355 and via Killingworth Dr, route changes to 353 will stabilise this route

355
Newcastle | Gosforth | Longbenton | Forest Hall | Holystone | Shiremoor | South Wellfield | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay
*route start swapped with 354, now extended to Whitley Bay; route replaces 351 from Holystone-South Wellfield

356
Killingworth | Backworth | Shiremoor | Murton Village | NT General Hospital | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay
*route is current 359 & W1 merged, route altered to limit 354 duplication

57/57a
Ashington | Bedlington | Cramlington | Anntisford | Seghill | Holywell | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay | Marden | North Shields Ferry
Ashington | Stakeford | Bedlington | Cramlington | East Cramlington Hosp | Holywell | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay | Marden | North Shields Ferry
*route now combined every 30 mins to Bedlington , create more local connections and help with X21/X22 demand Bedlington - Ashington,  now extended to North Shields Ferry to create new connections and improve services to Marden

GNE24_450x450 (2).pdf (Size 1.33 MB | Downloads 7)

(07 Dec 2024, 11:57 pm)logidoodah wrote Regarding GoNorthEast North Tyneside network (was butchered down to 4 services now includes the abandoned arriva services). This is how I would improve the North Tyneside Network *without mentioning or altering the coast road (otherwise it gets too repetitive and boring)

This would utilise all of GNEs services and incorporate secured services. This would also extend the 57/57a to improve connections...

1/1a - Frequency = Every 15 Mins combined | PVR=18 (Split between Riverside & Percy Main)
Winlaton | Blaydon | Metrocentre | Gateshead | Newcastle | Byker | Wallsend | Howdon | North Shields | Tynemouth | Marden | Whitley Bay
Winlaton | Shibdon Bank | Metrocentre | Gateshead | Newcastle | Byker | Wallsend | Howdon | North Shields | Tynemouth | Marden | Whitley Bay
*services 1 & 49/49A merged for many reasons (split depot running, no need for Xlines in Dunston sort out deckers issue and improved connections)

41/41A - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=5.5
Wallsend | Battle Hill | Hadrian Park | Howdon | Willington Quay | Royal Quays | North Shields | Preston | Whitley Bay (loop clockwise or opposite)
*41A merged with 317/W1/W2/351, provide lots of new connections, route not made for end-end travel provides better buses in Whitley Estates

42  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins | PVR=4.5
Wallsend | Battle Hill | Hadrian Pk | Cobalt & Silverlink | Northumberland Pk | Backworth | Seaton Delaval | Cramlington | East Hartford/Nelson Village
*41 merged with 19 to reinstate connection Wallsend - Cramlington, terminus alternates 1bph to East Hartford and 1bph to Nelson Vllage

341/342  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=6
Wallsend | Forest Hall | Killingworth | Wideopen | Hazlerigg | Kingston Park | Newbiggin Hall | West Denton | Dumpling Hall | Blaydon
Wallsend | Longbenton | Killingworth | Wideopen | Dinnington | Kingston Pk | Newbiggin Hall | Chapel House | Throckley | Stella | Blaydon
*merged current 342 with old 42/42a to give better frequencies, no longer serving Dudley, and extends from Kingston Park to Blaydon for new links

353  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=4.3
Morpeth | Bedlington | Cramlington | Killingworth | Forest Hall | Northumberland Pk | Cobalt & Silverlink | TTTE | Royal Quays | North Shields
*route replaces current 43 Cramlington-Morpeth, merging with 19 (missing out shiremoor) to better accommodate increased 355 freqs and faster journeys

354  - Frequency = Every 30 Mins combined | PVR=5.5
Newcastle | Four Lane Ends | Killingworth | Backworth | Shiremoor | Cobalt | New York | Chirton | North Shields
*route start swapped with 355 and via Killingworth Dr, route changes to 353 will stabilise this route

355
Newcastle | Gosforth | Longbenton | Forest Hall | Holystone | Shiremoor | South Wellfield | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay
*route start swapped with 354, now extended to Whitley Bay; route replaces 351 from Holystone-South Wellfield

356
Killingworth | Backworth | Shiremoor | Murton Village | NT General Hospital | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay
*route is current 359 & W1 merged, route altered to limit 354 duplication

57/57a
Ashington | Bedlington | Cramlington | Anntisford | Seghill | Holywell | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay | Marden | North Shields Ferry
Ashington | Stakeford | Bedlington | Cramlington | East Cramlington Hosp | Holywell | Monkseaton | Whitley Bay | Marden | North Shields Ferry
*route now combined every 30 mins to Bedlington , create more local connections and help with X21/X22 demand Bedlington - Ashington,  now extended to North Shields Ferry to create new connections and improve services to Marden

I assume this is after franchising as the 43, 57 and 57a are commercial services?

Must say can't I agree with some of these though. It's creating a lot of dog leg routes for little benefit. 

You'd be better creating some form of North Tyneside loop imo rather than very long routes going all over the place. 

The 57/57a in an ideal world should be split at Cramlington aswell as the route is too long and extremely unreliable as a result. The vast majority of people don't want to cross over Cramlington. Same with the 43 from Morpeth to Cramlington imo.

Ideally you would have, using the 19. 

R1: Cramlington - Dudley - Fern Drive - Seghill - Seaton Delaval - Monkseaton - Whitley Bay - 317 to North Shields Ferry

R2: Cramlington - High Pit - East Cram Hospital - Seaton Delaval - Seghill - Northumberland Park - Open doors after here

Both half hourly in the Seaton Valley area.