Alex Fletcher > Go North East 2 hours ago
near Burnopfield ·
Have just got on the 43 durham from burnopfield to tanfield and got a return, and have been told than once past tantobie you can only purchase a return from durham bus station. Why is this? As durham
bus station is a hell of a lot further than tanfield. £4.40 from burnopfield to tanfield and back is disgusting its 5 minutes up the road! Like Daniel Kelly likes this.

Go North East > Hi Alex - as our fares are simplified the return price is the same from Durham. Apologies for the confusion
caused by this.
Like · 2 hours ago

Alex Fletcher > No confusion just disgusted cause durham is so much further than tanfield and i spend a lot with this company. Thanks for your help but i have made a complaint.
Like · 52 minutes ago

Can anyone justify a short return journey like this, costing the same amount as it would if you were continuing the journey to Durham?

Short blog about pricing www.passengerfocus.org.uk/blog/2013/07/12/bus-passengers-or-the-lack-of-them-the-nub-of-the-problem/

It is very true, especially closer to home in Middlesbrough - where the council has free town centre parking.

(10 Jul 2013, 3:06 pm)Andreos1 wrote Alex Fletcher > Go North East 2 hours ago
near Burnopfield ·
Have just got on the 43 durham from burnopfield to tanfield and got a return, and have been told than once past tantobie you can only purchase a return from durham bus station. Why is this? As durham
bus station is a hell of a lot further than tanfield. £4.40 from burnopfield to tanfield and back is disgusting its 5 minutes up the road! Like Daniel Kelly likes this.

Go North East > Hi Alex - as our fares are simplified the return price is the same from Durham. Apologies for the confusion
caused by this.
Like · 2 hours ago

Alex Fletcher > No confusion just disgusted cause durham is so much further than tanfield and i spend a lot with this company. Thanks for your help but i have made a complaint.
Like · 52 minutes ago

Can anyone justify a short return journey like this, costing the same amount as it would if you were continuing the journey to Durham?

The lad has a point there. Anyone looking at the situation logically would say that it's out of order. 'Simplified or not'.

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(12 Jul 2013, 12:32 pm)Andreos1 wrote Short blog about pricing www.passengerfocus.org.uk/blog/2013/07/12/bus-passengers-or-the-lack-of-them-the-nub-of-the-problem/

It is very true, especially closer to home in Middlesbrough - where the council has free town centre parking.

If travelling from Washington, even driving to and parking in Newcastle for example is cheaper if there's at least two of you travelling.

The Passenger Focus website has some interesting stuff on it, but I tend not to read too much into their work as their return rate is only around 20%. I've only had the form given to me twice, and both times it was a case of "here's a form". No explanation, details, talk about it, or nowt. Most people are going to get off the bus and bin it.

http://www.passengerfocus.org.uk/researc...march-2013

Hahaha, hope that isn't you questioning the integrity of a Passenger Focus survey - an impartial, independent Government Organisation (apparently).

I wasn't accusing them, but got hauled over the coals by someone accusing me, just the other day in the Press Cuttings thread

(12 Jul 2013, 1:27 pm)Andreos1 wrote Hahaha, hope that isn't you questioning the integrity of a Passenger Focus survey - an impartial, independent Government Organisation (apparently).

I wasn't accusing them, but got hauled over the coals by someone accusing me, just the other day in the Press Cuttings thread

I think they have the building blocks to do a lot of good, but they really need to analyse what they're doing and dramatically improve it. A government minister (Damien Green) said not so long ago that 20% was "no mandate". So their words - not mine.

Page 20 to 27 in the PDF document on the link I posted previously shows an example of the form that's given out to passengers. The survey has no fewer than 46 questions for a start. It's unrealistic to expect someone to spend the time to complete such a survey when they're not being given a proper explanation of it when it's handed to them. Whilst I understand they need to be specific to do a report, they could actually get a lot of answers for themselves without asking it on a survey.

Has anyone seen this? Some interesting comparisons regarding pricing www.passengertransport.co.uk/2013/07/exploiting-the-power-of-pricing-strategies/ from a professionals point of view.

Needing to travel between Washington and Houghton? Needing a return?

Just got this from the GNE facebook page.

Washington - Houghton (X1) = £5.50
Washington - Houghton (M1) = £3.60

Make what you will of that...

What?! That's ridiculous that difference! Suppose the arguements could be said for a quicker journey time, but £2 difference for the same A-B?!

There has already been discussion on the X1 being dearer than local services between Wrekenton and Gateshead/Newcastle - but now there is the price mentioned above, which is two times as much.

If a single between those points are so different, it makes a mockery of the day, week and month buzzfare tickets.

Can anyone confirm the price of a single/return on the 56 between Concord and Tyneside?

(03 Aug 2013, 6:00 pm)Andreos1 wrote Can anyone confirm the price of a single/return on the 56 between Concord and Tyneside?

It's £2.60 (single)/£4.40 (return) between Sulgrave and Wrekenton if that's any help to you.

Weren't these originally marketed as cheap day returns?

Out of interest, does anyone know the difference in price between say the Arriva X2 and GNE 21? Single & return between Chester and Newcastle? Or anything else like that running in direct competition?

(03 Aug 2013, 8:01 pm)aureolin wrote Weren't these originally marketed as cheap day returns?

Out of interest, does anyone know the difference in price between say the Arriva X2 and GNE 21? Single & return between Chester and Newcastle? Or anything else like that running in direct competition?

I'm very unscientific but when GNE was £2.30 from Birtley, Arriva was £2.10. I think they may be much of a muchness now though Arriva used to be much much cheaper but its seems to have risen when they added more local stops on the route North of Chester le Street

Using that Durham Saver ticket makes Arriva far cheaper though

(03 Aug 2013, 8:01 pm)aureolin wrote Out of interest, does anyone know the difference in price between say the Arriva X2 and GNE 21? Single & return between Chester and Newcastle? Or anything else like that running in direct competition?

Newcastle to Chester is £2.70(single)/£4.80(return) on the X2; and either £3.15 or £3.95(single)/£5.50(return) on the 21/28/28a.

EDIT: Re: Concord and Tyneside - Just found out that a return on the 56 to Newcastle and back is £4.40. This means the single price will more than likely be £3.15.

(03 Aug 2013, 8:37 pm)AdamY wrote

(03 Aug 2013, 8:01 pm)aureolin wrote Out of interest, does anyone know the difference in price between say the Arriva X2 and GNE 21? Single & return between Chester and Newcastle? Or anything else like that running in direct competition?

Newcastle to Chester is £2.70(single)/£4.80(return) on the X2; and either £3.15 or £3.95(single)/£5.50(return) on the 21/28/28a.

There should never only be 60p difference between that return and a 2 zone day ticket. The way the singles and returns seem to be structured across the network, they're essentially forcing people out of the single/return fare market. Basing that on the fact you are very lucky if you can get from A to B these days, without having to change at C and D.

I'm surprised at the difference between GNE and Arriva in price too. It's not competitive at all. If anything, it goes in favor of what I was saying about people being forced out of the single/return market. People will generally have multi trip tickets anyway.

(03 Aug 2013, 8:46 pm)aureolin wrote . If anything, it goes in favor of what I was saying about people being forced out of the single/return market. People will generally have multi trip tickets anyway.

I don't think GNE even attempt to hide the fact their strategy is fully aimed at forcing you into Key tickets and buzzfares through interchanges

Why is the 21 and 28 the same price when they go different routes and have very little in the way of a common path - whilst the X1 is double the price of the M1 or the X1 being more expensive than a 56 between Wrekenton and Gateshead?

I would love to sit down in front of the person/people to come up with these strategies and listen to them as they try and justify it.

(03 Aug 2013, 8:53 pm)Andreos1 wrote I would love to sit down in front of the person/people to come up with these strategies and listen to them as they try and justify it.

Easy. It's the 'simplified fare structure' innit?

(03 Aug 2013, 8:53 pm)Andreos1 wrote Why is the 21 and 28 the same price when they go different routes and have very little in the way of a common path - whilst the X1 is double the price of the M1 or the X1 being more expensive than a 56 between Wrekenton and Gateshead?

I would love to sit down in front of the person/people to come up with these strategies and listen to them as they try and justify it.

Guessing the 21 as high frequency across lucrative Durham Rd corridor can afford to be priced like that? Can't explain the rest I'm afraid!

@AdamY - Wonder if the GNE Facebook bod understands the 'simplified pricing structure', as another answer is copied and pasted to a puzzled punter?

@GTomlinson - Wonder if the X25 charge the same fares? Or if the 28, 34 and 8 charge the same amounts from Pelton to Chester. The GNE Facebook bod has actually started asking additional questions on the page, clarifying which service the passenger is referring to when they query a fare between two points.

Wonder if they could explain how a single from Houghton to Chester on the 71 (which goes through two buzzfare zones) is a similar price for a return on the M1 between Houghton and Washington (two buzzfare zones) or how it is half the price of an X1 between the two points (which is also the same fare for a return between Easington Lane and Newcastle - and is 3 zones).

GNE have mentioned before that they plan to post all their fare tables online so customers can view in advance. I'm not sure whether this is still the plan though? Does anyone else do this - NE or otherwise?

That'll be interesting. Forget advanced Chinese Arithmetic, I'm going to try to solve the enigmatic GNE faretable conundrum. It will make the Enigma machine look like a simple Wordsearch in comparison.

It could be something which is added to timetables.

Even if a fare increase clashes with a timetable change, the guidance they give about certain fare's increasing by 5p, others by 10p etc, shouldn't cause that many problems - as passengers 'should' know the new fare.

Tyne and Wear PTE Fare Revisions Circa 1977



The child fares are interesting. I always thought that Tyne and Wear had a flat child fare since 1974. It must have came in when the Metro was finally operational.

Yeah, same here - always thought there had been a flat childs fare.
Going back to the early 80s, I can remember handing over my 5p (or 10p if I needed a transfare)

Mind, that 30p Childs fare would have been quite an amount back to pay out back then.
Saying that, it could explain why people would ask for 'an adult and half to x'

I particularly like this bit of the document.

THE NEW FARES
In recent years the Passenger Transport Executive has moved towards a uniform scale of fares for the whole of Tyne and Wear County. In this revision this process is completed, thus removing the anomaly whereby journeys of a similar length cost different amounts in different areas of the county. In some cases the more expensive fares are reduced or remain unchanged.

Now there's progression towards a simplified fare structure which a certain multi-coloured bus company could learn from.

Thanks for sharing. Hyperlinks are automatically created if something in a URL format is pasted into a post

Single from Durham to Barley Mow on the 21 is the same price as Durham to Newcastle. Bloke holding this bus up arguing about it.

(05 Aug 2013, 4:42 pm)aureolin wrote Single from Durham to Barley Mow on the 21 is the same price as Durham to Newcastle. Bloke holding this bus up arguing about it.

He has a valid point. Somebody on the bus should present the following hypothesis to the poor bus driver: if there is no difference between the fare from Durham to either Barley Mow and Newcastle, then, based on that premise, there should be no charge for travelling between Barley Mow and Newcastle.

(05 Aug 2013, 4:58 pm)AdamY wrote

(05 Aug 2013, 4:42 pm)aureolin wrote Single from Durham to Barley Mow on the 21 is the same price as Durham to Newcastle. Bloke holding this bus up arguing about it.

He has a valid point. Somebody on the bus should present the following hypothesis to the poor bus driver: if there is no difference between the fare from Durham to either Barley Mow and Newcastle, then, based on that premise, there should be no charge for travelling between Barley Mow and Newcastle.

If I put a search into East Coast, it is the same price from Durham to London and Newcastle to London, so are you saying there should be no charge between Durham and Newcastle by train?

Heworth - Gateshead/Newcastle
27 - £1.95/£2.50
52 - £1.45/£1.95 ('Orbit Switcha')