(18 Dec 2015, 5:58 pm)Greg in Weardale Quite a few young people on this forum lamented the passing of the OK Expressway livery and Northern, Venture and Diamond all refer to historic operators around the area now served by the brands. There's nowt wrong with having some traditionally named brands and liveries along with some modern, trendy ones. The X21 is now an ideal case for the former. And several brands (some good, some not) have been replaced recently eg Highwayman to Green Arrow, (quite liked both), Laser (so so) to See it, do it (naff), Lime (stupid name) to Coast & Country (not bad) etc. Pronto is a pretty silly name and not a brilliant livery. The Bishop - Newcastle route was the main line of OK (for both constituent companies, Emerson and Howe) so there's a relevance there, (which there wasn't with the OK1 route) and it was a brilliant livery. I hope Prince Bishops will be kept as it's a good brand (being pedantic, it would have more relevance to a Durham (Cathedral) to Bishop Auckland (home of the Bishop) route, but the name does cover the whole area as the "Land of the Prince Bishops" because in mediaeval times the Bishop ruled what is now County Durham and Northumberland in the name of the King (end of history lesson).
(18 Dec 2015, 6:05 pm)S813 FVK Some brands just don't work without vinyls going over the windows with the Prince Bishops being one of them. Contravision is easy to see out of in the day when it is light and, to be honest, it doesn't matter when it is dark as you won't be able to see much anyway.
(18 Dec 2015, 5:58 pm)Greg in Weardale Quite a few young people on this forum lamented the passing of the OK Expressway livery and Northern, Venture and Diamond all refer to historic operators around the area now served by the brands. There's nowt wrong with having some traditionally named brands and liveries along with some modern, trendy ones. The X21 is now an ideal case for the former. And several brands (some good, some not) have been replaced recently eg Highwayman to Green Arrow, (quite liked both), Laser (so so) to See it, do it (naff), Lime (stupid name) to Coast & Country (not bad) etc. Pronto is a pretty silly name and not a brilliant livery. The Bishop - Newcastle route was the main line of OK (for both constituent companies, Emerson and Howe) so there's a relevance there, (which there wasn't with the OK1 route) and it was a brilliant livery. I hope Prince Bishops will be kept as it's a good brand (being pedantic, it would have more relevance to a Durham (Cathedral) to Bishop Auckland (home of the Bishop) route, but the name does cover the whole area as the "Land of the Prince Bishops" because in mediaeval times the Bishop ruled what is now County Durham and Northumberland in the name of the King (end of history lesson).
(18 Dec 2015, 6:05 pm)S813 FVK Some brands just don't work without vinyls going over the windows with the Prince Bishops being one of them. Contravision is easy to see out of in the day when it is light and, to be honest, it doesn't matter when it is dark as you won't be able to see much anyway.
(18 Dec 2015, 5:21 pm)R852 PRG I agree with what Adrian says in a way; but ''Northern'' was far more of a household name in the region than ''OK'' was. In my opinion, the former deserves to hold, albeit a limited, name within the company nowadays, while ''OK'' was just amalgamated into Go Ahead Northern upon acquisition. Another point is that the current usage of ''Northern'' as a brand for the OmniDekkas on the 6, X70 and X71 is that it has been applied to vehicles that are 11/12 years old and will be removed from service within the next five years if their expected shelf live is acknowledged. With the case of reviving ''OK'' for some brand new vehicles, which are at the top of their range, it wouldn't be right in my opinion to apply the livery of something so far into the past onto something brand new. It would be like giving an iPhone 6S to a man still living in the 1950s.
(18 Dec 2015, 5:21 pm)R852 PRG I agree with what Adrian says in a way; but ''Northern'' was far more of a household name in the region than ''OK'' was. In my opinion, the former deserves to hold, albeit a limited, name within the company nowadays, while ''OK'' was just amalgamated into Go Ahead Northern upon acquisition. Another point is that the current usage of ''Northern'' as a brand for the OmniDekkas on the 6, X70 and X71 is that it has been applied to vehicles that are 11/12 years old and will be removed from service within the next five years if their expected shelf live is acknowledged. With the case of reviving ''OK'' for some brand new vehicles, which are at the top of their range, it wouldn't be right in my opinion to apply the livery of something so far into the past onto something brand new. It would be like giving an iPhone 6S to a man still living in the 1950s.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:14 pm)Andreos1 Diamond and Venture were taken over a long while before OK were, yet we see their names used - including Venture on brand new vehicles.
Heck, that fella still living in the 1950's may struggle to remember Venture!
I have stated many a time that I am not a fan of branding. It doesn't do much for me.
I couldn't give two hoots whether OK is brought back, however if there is a choice between OK or the current brand, OK would win hands down - if only because of the relevance to the route.
Northern may be recognised more in its traditional heartlands, but not sure about some areas like Wearside and North Tyneside, who were used to Sunderland and District or Tynemouth etc plying their trade.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:14 pm)Andreos1 Diamond and Venture were taken over a long while before OK were, yet we see their names used - including Venture on brand new vehicles.
Heck, that fella still living in the 1950's may struggle to remember Venture!
I have stated many a time that I am not a fan of branding. It doesn't do much for me.
I couldn't give two hoots whether OK is brought back, however if there is a choice between OK or the current brand, OK would win hands down - if only because of the relevance to the route.
Northern may be recognised more in its traditional heartlands, but not sure about some areas like Wearside and North Tyneside, who were used to Sunderland and District or Tynemouth etc plying their trade.
(18 Dec 2015, 6:05 pm)S813 FVK Some brands just don't work without vinyls going over the windows with the Prince Bishops being one of them. Contravision is easy to see out of in the day when it is light and, to be honest, it doesn't matter when it is dark as you won't be able to see much anyway.
(18 Dec 2015, 6:05 pm)S813 FVK Some brands just don't work without vinyls going over the windows with the Prince Bishops being one of them. Contravision is easy to see out of in the day when it is light and, to be honest, it doesn't matter when it is dark as you won't be able to see much anyway.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:22 pm)Michael Its just like Busway's will never come back, neither will Wear Buses etc.I am not sure it is about pleasing enthusiasts.
I hope they don't bring it back, why should they bring it back just to please enthusiasts? Its in the past, move on.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:22 pm)Michael Its just like Busway's will never come back, neither will Wear Buses etc.I am not sure it is about pleasing enthusiasts.
I hope they don't bring it back, why should they bring it back just to please enthusiasts? Its in the past, move on.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:39 pm)Andreos1 I am not sure it is about pleasing enthusiasts.
Were the OK, Venture and Diamond brands brought back to appease enthusiasts or because of a marketing executive who thought it would be a good idea?
(18 Dec 2015, 7:39 pm)Andreos1 I am not sure it is about pleasing enthusiasts.
Were the OK, Venture and Diamond brands brought back to appease enthusiasts or because of a marketing executive who thought it would be a good idea?
(18 Dec 2015, 7:42 pm)Michael Not sure, they might of been, but why keep going back to the roots, when they can have new brands?Naming a brand, to suit a small proportion of its customer base (enthusiasts), isn't going to make much business sense.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:42 pm)Michael Not sure, they might of been, but why keep going back to the roots, when they can have new brands?Naming a brand, to suit a small proportion of its customer base (enthusiasts), isn't going to make much business sense.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:47 pm)Andreos1 Naming a brand, to suit a small proportion of its customer base (enthusiasts), isn't going to make much business sense.
Nicked this from wiki, but basic marketing rules, like the following:
A key ingredient in launching a successful company is the selection of its name. Product names that are considered generally sound have several qualities in common.
They strategically distinguish the product from its competitors by conveying its unique positioning
They hold appeal for the product’s target audience
They imply or evoke a salient brand attribute, quality or benefit.
They are available for legal protection and "trademark".
They allow companies to bond with their customers to create loyalty.
They have a symbolic association that fortifies the image of a company or a product to the consumers.
They help motivate customers to buy the product.
They can be legally acquired and developed
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_naming
In the case of Venture, Diamond and OK - then they tick a number of those boxes.
Would a brand new brand tick as many?
(18 Dec 2015, 7:47 pm)Andreos1 Naming a brand, to suit a small proportion of its customer base (enthusiasts), isn't going to make much business sense.
Nicked this from wiki, but basic marketing rules, like the following:
A key ingredient in launching a successful company is the selection of its name. Product names that are considered generally sound have several qualities in common.
They strategically distinguish the product from its competitors by conveying its unique positioning
They hold appeal for the product’s target audience
They imply or evoke a salient brand attribute, quality or benefit.
They are available for legal protection and "trademark".
They allow companies to bond with their customers to create loyalty.
They have a symbolic association that fortifies the image of a company or a product to the consumers.
They help motivate customers to buy the product.
They can be legally acquired and developed
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_naming
In the case of Venture, Diamond and OK - then they tick a number of those boxes.
Would a brand new brand tick as many?
(18 Dec 2015, 7:47 pm)Andreos1 Naming a brand, to suit a small proportion of its customer base (enthusiasts), isn't going to make much business sense.
Nicked this from wiki, but basic marketing rules, like the following:
A key ingredient in launching a successful company is the selection of its name. Product names that are considered generally sound have several qualities in common.
They strategically distinguish the product from its competitors by conveying its unique positioning
They hold appeal for the product’s target audience
They imply or evoke a salient brand attribute, quality or benefit.
They are available for legal protection and "trademark".
They allow companies to bond with their customers to create loyalty.
They have a symbolic association that fortifies the image of a company or a product to the consumers.
They help motivate customers to buy the product.
They can be legally acquired and developed
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_naming
In the case of Venture, Diamond and OK - then they tick a number of those boxes.
Would a brand new brand tick as many?
(18 Dec 2015, 7:47 pm)Andreos1 Naming a brand, to suit a small proportion of its customer base (enthusiasts), isn't going to make much business sense.
Nicked this from wiki, but basic marketing rules, like the following:
A key ingredient in launching a successful company is the selection of its name. Product names that are considered generally sound have several qualities in common.
They strategically distinguish the product from its competitors by conveying its unique positioning
They hold appeal for the product’s target audience
They imply or evoke a salient brand attribute, quality or benefit.
They are available for legal protection and "trademark".
They allow companies to bond with their customers to create loyalty.
They have a symbolic association that fortifies the image of a company or a product to the consumers.
They help motivate customers to buy the product.
They can be legally acquired and developed
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_naming
In the case of Venture, Diamond and OK - then they tick a number of those boxes.
Would a brand new brand tick as many?
There's a limit to the number of different brand names and some are scraping the bottom of the barrel, so why not have a mix of old and new. Northern is being removed from the spare red vehicles, but is now a new brand covering part of the original Northern General area. And we've got that, Diamond and Venture, both in their original areas, so why not OK (on more than the two vehicles for the 18)? There's not many other parts of the old company that you could use - Tynemouth, Tyneside, Gateshead - not particularly inspiring - and what about .... Sunderland District Omnibus Co, about as catchy as See it Do it Sunderland, I suppose. Or even Jarrow & District Electric Traction Co. You could possibly call a brand Invincible (Hall Bros. of Seaham, taken over 1925), but out of the other 40 or so companies taken over by NGT between 1913 and 1995 there's few which would have any relevance as a brand, most just being the owners name. However OK does stand out and even people who don't remember bus travel before 1995 when it was taken over - and the name was kept on for a bit, (GOOK didn't quite work!) - would be bound take notice of the name, which is the aim of a brand, to stand out, make people aware. But it would also have historical relevance to anyone over 25 who remembers it and many in the Bishop Auckland area have fond memories of it. A good local launch with a name people recognise would be bound to increase usage
If they brand the X21 OK Express I'll even forgive GNE for getting Streetdecks for it instead of the fantastic Enviro 400s ..... as long as the windows aren't covered by branding of course!
(18 Dec 2015, 7:55 pm)Adrian Interestingly they let the 'Go OK Travel' name drop back in 2008: https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00002159964Interesting.
It's also worth noting that the red/white/blue 'Go' livery has also dropped, so it'll allow buses to be preserved into that livery, without threat of legal action: https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00002158426
(18 Dec 2015, 7:56 pm)Michael The FAB 56, Red Arrows, Angel just name a few?
All of them do well without them being a previous company in the NE?
I know what you're saying, don't get me wrong but i'm trying to get my point across but i can't explain it, if you know what i mean.
(18 Dec 2015, 7:55 pm)Adrian Interestingly they let the 'Go OK Travel' name drop back in 2008: https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00002159964Interesting.
It's also worth noting that the red/white/blue 'Go' livery has also dropped, so it'll allow buses to be preserved into that livery, without threat of legal action: https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00002158426
(18 Dec 2015, 7:56 pm)Michael The FAB 56, Red Arrows, Angel just name a few?
All of them do well without them being a previous company in the NE?
I know what you're saying, don't get me wrong but i'm trying to get my point across but i can't explain it, if you know what i mean.
(18 Dec 2015, 9:12 pm)Andreos1 Interesting.
Always wondered what the arrangement was, with regard to using a copyrighted design on a preserved vehicle.
Whey, apart from being inspired to use brand names introduced by another operator...
(18 Dec 2015, 9:12 pm)Andreos1 Interesting.
Always wondered what the arrangement was, with regard to using a copyrighted design on a preserved vehicle.
Whey, apart from being inspired to use brand names introduced by another operator...
"Jarrow & District Electric Traction Co."
When I am a rock star, this is what I want my band to be called.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/bazza90/23...ed-public/ - 7120 seen in Newcastle on Driver Familiarisation
(18 Dec 2015, 7:27 pm)Michael Ye, the Prince Bishops brand will be rubbish if the crown part didn't go up to top of the window.
I see his point about nearly all the windows getting covered but when its just 2 (1 on each side) then it shouldn't be a problem, just don't sit where its covered..........
(18 Dec 2015, 7:27 pm)Michael Ye, the Prince Bishops brand will be rubbish if the crown part didn't go up to top of the window.
I see his point about nearly all the windows getting covered but when its just 2 (1 on each side) then it shouldn't be a problem, just don't sit where its covered..........
