(26 Jul 2020, 12:25 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]I don't get why they kept the Green Arrow brand. It sort of made sense when they had the Blue and Red Arrow, but now they're both dead it feels a bit pointless. It's not as if it even had that much of a history, it felt tacked on as it was.
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Probably the "Green" was kept because of the environmentally friendly buses that are now on the 97?
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(26 Jul 2020, 2:44 pm)big mac wrote [ -> ]Probably the "Green" was kept because of the environmentally friendly buses that are now on the 97?
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Yeah, but as I said above they're not really 'green' in comparison to the EVs they have coming, plus they're just as green as the Streetlites they've had on other routes for years now.
(26 Jul 2020, 2:49 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]Yeah, but as I said above they're not really 'green' in comparison to the EVs they have coming, plus they're just as green as the Streetlites they've had on other routes for years now.
They'll be greener than the collective emissions produced by all the cars they would take off the road providing people made the switch as desired by managers.
Comparing bus emissions with other buses is never going to be on the list of marketing points aimed at the car user.
I have said it previously but if we're talking about brands to drop, the Q1 and Q2 don't go to the quayside on evenings and Sundays, so I'd say there's an argument to drop Quaylink from that route. I think if the name of the brand relates to the route, then the service should serve the place at all times.
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(26 Jul 2020, 4:56 pm)big mac wrote [ -> ]I have said it previously but if we're talking about brands to drop, the Q1 and Q2 don't go to the quayside on evenings and Sundays, so I'd say there's an argument to drop Quaylink from that route. I think if the name of the brand relates to the route, then the service should serve the place at all times.
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Same could be said for Cobalt and Coast, only a third of services serve Cobalt or the Coast!
(26 Jul 2020, 6:27 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]They all serve Coast Road. 
Maybe it should be renamed as Cobalt-ish and Coast Road, not quite as catchy though
(26 Jul 2020, 12:25 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]I don't get why they kept the Green Arrow brand. It sort of made sense when they had the Blue and Red Arrow, but now they're both dead it feels a bit pointless. It's not as if it even had that much of a history, it felt tacked on as it was.
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Because the green theme relates to the eco-friendly vehicles that were given to it.
(26 Jul 2020, 4:28 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]Not immediately. They'll be used for familiarisation for a couple of days first (on paper, at least).
Chester-le-Street have float OmniDekka 6143 covering for 6331 and the usual school holidays PVR reduction provides an OmniDekka to replace 6332.
Sounds like the full allocation of B5s will be appearing on X21 very soon
take it 6301-6303 will be heading onto X5/X15
(27 Jul 2020, 10:49 am)JP6004 wrote [ -> ]Sounds like the full allocation of B5s will be appearing on X21 very soon take it 6301-6303 will be heading onto X5/X15
But what would be the 4th bus as I'm sure the PVR increased to 4 when the Shotley Bridge extension was added ?
(27 Jul 2020, 8:03 pm)Olympian3521 wrote [ -> ]But what would be the 4th bus as I'm sure the PVR increased to 4 when the Shotley Bridge extension was added ?
I thought someone said it was still 3
(27 Jul 2020, 8:09 pm)JP6004 wrote [ -> ]I thought someone said it was still 3
PVR is definitely 4 with the Shotley Bridge circular, 3 without.
(27 Jul 2020, 8:09 pm)JP6004 wrote [ -> ]I thought someone said it was still 3
Its definitely 4 since the Shotley Bridge Extension and I think the X5 and X15 are standalone and dont interwork now (but not 100% on that)
(27 Jul 2020, 8:13 pm)S813 FVK wrote [ -> ]PVR is definitely 4 with the Shotley Bridge circular, 3 without.
Still enough Streetdecks to cover PVR, however not enough to include spares with 4 of the original order going to Hexham. Still might use some B9s as spares if Streetdecks are allocated to X5/X15
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(27 Jul 2020, 8:19 pm)JP6004 wrote [ -> ]Still enough Streetdecks to cover PVR, however not enough to include spares with 4 of the original order going to Hexham. Still might use some B9s as spares if Streetdecks are allocated to X5/X15
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Just out of curiosity, what is the PVR of the Angel services v actual streetdecks allocated to it? I'm just wondering if one would come from there to join the 2 (?) Spare E400's at Consett to make 3 spares in total?
(27 Jul 2020, 8:25 pm)Olympian3521 wrote [ -> ]Just out of curiosity, what is the PVR of the Angel services v actual streetdecks allocated to it? I'm just wondering if one would come from there to join the 2 (?) Spare E400's at Consett to make 3 spares in total?
Believe its 15. Not sure they would sacrifice another streetdeck to Consett leaving only 2 spare for PVR of 22. Also 1 of the older E400 going to Hexham as spare for X84/X85
(27 Jul 2020, 8:41 pm)JP6004 wrote [ -> ]Believe its 15. Not sure they would sacrifice another streetdeck to Consett leaving only 2 spare for PVR of 22. Also 1 of the older E400 going to Hexham as spare
If the 4 15 plate red kite B9's were to stay and be refurbed to X lines standard that would solve the Durham services and ease the spares issue. Not sure if plans have changed recently as they were earmarked for East Yorkshire
(27 Jul 2020, 8:25 pm)Olympian3521 wrote [ -> ]Just out of curiosity, what is the PVR of the Angel services v actual streetdecks allocated to it? I'm just wondering if one would come from there to join the 2 (?) Spare E400's at Consett to make 3 spares in total?
At the moment, the current PVR is 15 but if 6118-21 are still going to East Yorkshire, then it's likely given the drop in passenger numbers post Covid-19 (and subject to social distancing etc) that the Newcastle to CLS section would reduce to every 10 minutes. That would leave a PVR of 13 meaning the following could happen give or take the exact fleet numbers.
Hexham:
- 4x NEW ADL E400MMC - XLines X84/X85
- 1x 2014 ADL E400MMC - XLines X84/X85
***1x spare for Hexham***
- 1x 2014 ADL E400MMC - XLines
Riverside (Incl Hexham TVT's):
- Volvo B9TL 6001-6007 - Crusader 26/27
- Volvo B9TL 6045-6047 - Tyne Valley Ten
- Volvo B9TL 6048 - GoNE Spare
- Volvo B9TL 6049-6055 - Crusader 26/27
- Volvo B9TL 6071-6083 - Tyne Valley Ten
- 7x 2015 Volvo B11R Coaches - XLines X9/X10
***5x spares for Riverside (Incl Hexham TVT's)***
- Volvo B9TL 6043-6044 - GoNE
- Volvo B9TL 6048 - GoNE
- Volvo B9TL 6099 (will still be 2x spare at PM for Cobalts and 2x spare B5LH at PM for Coaster) - GoNE
- 1x NEW Wright StreetDeck OM936 - XLines
Consett:
- 11x NEW ADL E400MMC - XLines X30/X70/X71 & XLines X31
- 1x 2019 ADL E400MMC - XLines X30/X70/X71 & XLines X31
- 6x NEW Wright StreetDeck - XLines X45/X46/X47
- Wright StreetDeck 6328-6333 - XLines X45/X46/X47
- Wright StreetDeck 6306-6307 - XLines X45/X46/X47
- Wright StreetDeck 6302-6305 - XLines X5/X15
***2x spares for Consett***
- 2x 2019 ADL E400MMC - XLines
Chester Le Street:
- Wright StreetDeck 6315-6327 - Angel 21 (service reduced to every 10 mins between Newcastle and Chester Le Street reducing PVR to 13x but still continuing to Durham half hourly)
- Volvo B5TL 6308-6314 - XLines X21
- 1x 2013/14 Volvo B5TL - XLines X21
***2x spares for Chester Le Street***
- 1x 2013/14 Volvo B5TL - XLines
- Wright StreetDeck 6301 - GoNE
Washington:
- 14x NEW Wright StreetDeck - XLines X1
***1x spare for Washington***
- 1x NEW Wright StreetDeck - XLines
Furthermore, if the Fab56 frequency remained at every 15 minutes, 6096-6098 (perhaps refurbished) could also be released to make up some extra spares at Chester Le Street, Consett and Washington if required as their primary role would be to provide a backup for Newcastle routes (X1/X21/21/X45/X46/X47) thus not breaching any Euro 6 funding rules and a B9TL could also be allocated to any X31 boards (likely that it will go standalone and extend to Consett hourly) which don't interwork with the X30.
(27 Jul 2020, 8:47 pm)Olympian3521 wrote [ -> ]If the 4 15 plate red kite B9's were to stay and be refurbed to X lines standard that would solve the Durham services and ease the spares issue. Not sure if plans have changed recently as they were earmarked for East Yorkshire
They could well stay, The Ex EY Gemini 3s and MMC 400s were all previously allocated to the X46 which is now receiving new vehicles, so potentially.
(27 Jul 2020, 10:49 am)JP6004 wrote [ -> ]Sounds like the full allocation of B5s will be appearing on X21 very soon take it 6301-6303 will be heading onto X5/X15
I might be totally barking up the wrong tree but would it not be less of a job to put some of the new ones on the X5/X15 if they are going into X-Lines and keep 6301-03 as spares since they're already corporate?
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(27 Jul 2020, 11:03 pm)6049 wrote [ -> ]I might be totally barking up the wrong tree but would it not be less of a job to put some of the new ones on the X5/X15 if they are going into X-Lines and keep 6301-03 as spares since they're already corporate?
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With the 16 plates being historically the least reliable of the Streetdecks, having them on a less demanding route makes sense; you wouldn't want to be broken down on the A69. I'm sure there has been meticulous planning involved in these allocations.....all will become apparent as we get to see more of the bigger picture going forward.
(28 Jul 2020, 12:01 am)JP6004 wrote [ -> ]With the 16 plates being historically the least reliable of the Streetdecks, having them on a less demanding route makes sense; you wouldn't want to be broken down on the A69. I'm sure there has been meticulous planning involved in these allocations.....all will become apparent as we get to see more of the bigger picture going forward.
Likelihood based on the Angel frequency reducing will mean the X45/X46/X47 will most likely be made up of new & 67 plate StreetDecks with perhaps 2x 16 plate StreetDecks making up the PVR.
The rest of the 16 plate StreetDecks will likely make up the X5 & X15 (PVR 4) with the remaining one as spare either at Consett or CLS.
(27 Jul 2020, 8:58 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]At the moment, the current PVR is 15 but if 6118-21 are still going to East Yorkshire, then it's likely given the drop in passenger numbers post Covid-19 (and subject to social distancing etc) that the Newcastle to CLS section would reduce to every 10 minutes. That would leave a PVR of 13 meaning the following could happen give or take the exact fleet numbers.
Hexham:
- 4x NEW ADL E400MMC - XLines X84/X85
- 1x 2014 ADL E400MMC - XLines X84/X85
***1x spare for Hexham***
- 1x 2014 ADL E400MMC - XLines
Riverside (Incl Hexham TVT's):
- Volvo B9TL 6001-6007 - Crusader 26/27
- Volvo B9TL 6045-6047 - Tyne Valley Ten
- Volvo B9TL 6048 - GoNE Spare
- Volvo B9TL 6049-6055 - Crusader 26/27
- Volvo B9TL 6071-6083 - Tyne Valley Ten
- 7x 2015 Volvo B11R Coaches - XLines X9/X10
***5x spares for Riverside (Incl Hexham TVT's)***
- Volvo B9TL 6043-6044 - GoNE
- Volvo B9TL 6048 - GoNE
- Volvo B9TL 6099 (will still be 2x spare at PM for Cobalts and 2x spare B5LH at PM for Coaster) - GoNE
- 1x NEW Wright StreetDeck OM936 - XLines
Consett:
- 11x NEW ADL E400MMC - XLines X30/X70/X71 & XLines X31
- 1x 2019 ADL E400MMC - XLines X30/X70/X71 & XLines X31
- 6x NEW Wright StreetDeck - XLines X45/X46/X47
- Wright StreetDeck 6328-6333 - XLines X45/X46/X47
- Wright StreetDeck 6306-6307 - XLines X45/X46/X47
- Wright StreetDeck 6302-6305 - XLines X5/X15
***2x spares for Consett***
- 2x 2019 ADL E400MMC - XLines
Chester Le Street:
- Wright StreetDeck 6315-6327 - Angel 21 (service reduced to every 10 mins between Newcastle and Chester Le Street reducing PVR to 13x but still continuing to Durham half hourly)
- Volvo B5TL 6308-6314 - XLines X21
- 1x 2013/14 Volvo B5TL - XLines X21
***2x spares for Chester Le Street***
- 1x 2013/14 Volvo B5TL - XLines
- Wright StreetDeck 6301 - GoNE
Washington:
- 14x NEW Wright StreetDeck - XLines X1
***1x spare for Washington***
- 1x NEW Wright StreetDeck - XLines
Furthermore, if the Fab56 frequency remained at every 15 minutes, 6096-6098 (perhaps refurbished) could also be released to make up some extra spares at Chester Le Street, Consett and Washington if required as their primary role would be to provide a backup for Newcastle routes (X1/X21/21/X45/X46/X47) thus not breaching any Euro 6 funding rules and a B9TL could also be allocated to any X31 boards (likely that it will go standalone and extend to Consett hourly) which don't interwork with the X30.
The X30/X31/X70/X71 PVR is going to be 11 not 12.
"The new vehicle allocations reflect the position once new, hopefully more efficient, interworking patterns are implemented. Exact details of this are being finalised now, but has been prompted as a result of the expected longer-term loss of patronage of 15-20%. Clearly if any efficiencies are made by interworking other services with the X30, then they need to be low-height double-decks which is the main reason for the change."
You missed that bit, you could easily cut the X5/X15 back at Consett which has been mentioned a few times aswell. Then you would have enough buses for the PVR of Consett without taking 2 buses from CLS cutting the frequency of the Angel which wouldn't cope with a 10 minute frequency with social distancing if numbers got back up.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EOCoJrUU0AElYoL.jpg - The X5/X15 doesn't go past Consett... Also there's the colours of the X-Lines buses.
Also it makes no sense for the B9TL's to be at Consett or Washington since they won't have any at their depots so it's just pointless driver training and you might aswell use them on the 25 in place for the ex London deckers.
If the X5/X15 were removed from Shotley Bridge another service would need to be rerouted down there as the extension is Council funded due to a new housing area iirc.
Aside from the through connections to Durham, the services were a good choice due to their separate service numbers making it easier to distinguish the clockwise and anti clockwise journeys.
(28 Jul 2020, 8:44 am)S813 FVK wrote [ -> ]If the X5/X15 were removed from Shotley Bridge another service would need to be rerouted down there as the extension is Council funded due to a new housing area iirc.
Aside from the through connections to Durham, the services were a good choice due to their separate service numbers making it easier to distinguish the clockwise and anti clockwise journeys.
The V3/V4 could be slightly re-routed. Think the initial extension was made to keep a bus busy in between scholars. X5/X15 extension doesn't carry that many in all honesty (from my observation anyway).
(28 Jul 2020, 8:24 am)Storx wrote [ -> ]The X30/X31/X70/X71 PVR is going to be 11 not 12.
"The new vehicle allocations reflect the position once new, hopefully more efficient, interworking patterns are implemented. Exact details of this are being finalised now, but has been prompted as a result of the expected longer-term loss of patronage of 15-20%. Clearly if any efficiencies are made by interworking other services with the X30, then they need to be low-height double-decks which is the main reason for the change."
You missed that bit, you could easily cut the X5/X15 back at Consett which has been mentioned a few times aswell. Then you would have enough buses for the PVR of Consett without taking 2 buses from CLS cutting the frequency of the Angel which wouldn't cope with a 10 minute frequency with social distancing if numbers got back up.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EOCoJrUU0AElYoL.jpg - The X5/X15 doesn't go past Consett... Also there's the colours of the X-Lines buses.
Also it makes no sense for the B9TL's to be at Consett or Washington since they won't have any at their depots so it's just pointless driver training and you might aswell use them on the 25 in place for the ex London deckers.
Unless the X30 & X31 got cut to both hourly, then all 4x services could not interwork without going near or exceeding driving hours.
The X30/X70/X71 would be a PVR of 8x with layover at Consett. The X31 would be a PVR of 4x with a 1x continuing to Consett hourly replacing the X30 extension.
(28 Jul 2020, 9:47 am)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Unless the X30 & X31 got cut to both hourly, then all 4x services could not interwork without going near or exceeding driving hours.
The X30/X70/X71 would be a PVR of 8x with layover at Consett. The X31 would be a PVR of 4x with a 1x continuing to Consett hourly replacing the X30 extension.
That's from Dan, not me guessing -
https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forum/showt...p?tid=2600&pid=245035#pid245035.
11 new buses for the X30/X31/X70/X71. There isn't any, 'plus from existing fleet' with the 'improved and more efficent' interworking patterns comment below. Moving the PVR from one route to another isn't improving efficency.
![[Image: OX-901-fullybranded-170720-OBC.jpg]](https://www.oxford-chiltern-bus-page.co.uk/Pictures%20for%20113/OBC/OX-901-fullybranded-170720-OBC.jpg)
![[Image: TT-905-osf-Cowley-depot-190720-J-Cooper.jpg]](https://www.oxford-chiltern-bus-page.co.uk/Pictures%20for%20114/J%20Cooper/TT-905-osf-Cowley-depot-190720-J-Cooper.jpg)