Unfortunately passengers very rarely have the choice of going to get the expensive bus or the cheap bus eezypeazy.
The retail world is full of competition, the bus world (particularly in the North East) isn't.
Apart from the Co-op and Poundland, you have other places where you can purchase your favourite cereal bars and at times, those cereal bars will be on offer, be put on promotion or be sold out.
Comparing one sector to another isn't the most convincing argument you have made, nor a relevant one, as Daniel said above, contributors are discussing the confusing nature of the pricing and zonal structure - not that one operator is cheaper than the other.
Years ago I used to go to Shiney Row College and got a 55-56-57 zone pass for free. One week I couldn't afford to upgrade it (beer and student night outs came first!)
My friend lived in Ryhope and I try to meet her on the #141 and got told at the point might of been Mcdonalds at the Toll Bar (memory a bit sketchy) and had to pay my fare.
Thing what used to annoy me is the #161 and #163 (especially the latter) was rammed and you often won't get on it.
Anyone else think that a standard fare system would be brilliant? An example shown
here on Lothian Buses' website.
Lothian have AIRLINK 100. Go North East's alternative to exclude from this new system (it would never go ahead, but for the purpose of the argument) would be the likes of Tyne Tees Xpress, TEN, Angel (maybe?) etc.
Of course, arguments would arise to argue that TEN and the new X84/X85 should not be different. Wear Tees Xpress vs Tyne Tees Xpress. I guess that's why it can't really be done here because GNE has such a large network in comparison.
Is there many other operators that don't have change?! Imagine GNE did that - there FB page would be in uproar!
Whether it is a standard fare or a system, which is up front, honest, clear and easily understood - something needs doing.
The proposal that Nexus have put forward, falls into both of those categories.
The structure in Edinburgh is also good - particularly the day & night tickets, which will encourage passengers to use the night buses, rather than the system we have, which forces us to pay EXTRA above and beyond anything purchased already.
Customers are extremely discouraged to use Night Buses here. I can't help but feel that if more were introduced and cheaper fares that worked alongside day tickets, more people would be encouraged to use them - as opposed to the current extremely high single fares only, where a taxi alternative could potentially be cheaper if more than one person is travelling.
Of course running costs are higher because you'd have to pay the driver more, but GNE must realise that Night Buses are failing? They're slowly being withdrawn one by one...
I wonder if they have carried out a basic SWOT analysis of the Night Bus operations (or even their daytime services)?
They must have.... Surely?
As noted in earlier posts, I'm very much in favour of a flat-fare system like the one Daniel has pointed to in Edinburgh or, to use another example London. I believe with an Oyster Card, the flat-fare is £1.40 in London with a daily cap of £4.40. For that you can travel on trams and buses comprising the entire area covered by TfL.
(23 Aug 2013, 8:54 am)AdamY wrote [ -> ]As noted in earlier posts, I'm very much in favour of a flat-fare system like the one Daniel has pointed to in Edinburgh or, to use another example London. I believe with an Oyster Card, the flat-fare is £1.40 in London with a daily cap of £4.40. For that you can travel on trams and buses comprising the entire area covered by TfL.
Touching on the London thing, they have zones there, but it looks on the whole - to be a fair system.
The zones radiate out of the 'City', so the further you travel, the more you pay.
Chances are that there will be the odd anomaly, but it is set up in a clear manner, which visitors and residents can understand.
(23 Aug 2013, 9:00 am)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]Touching on the London thing, they have zones there, but it looks on the whole - to be a fair system.
The zones radiate out of the 'City', so the further you travel, the more you pay.
Chances are that there will be the odd anomaly, but it is set up in a clear manner, which visitors and residents can understand.
I spent quite a lot of time in London last summer travelling to The National Archives at Kew from a range of destinations such as Clapham, Gunnersbury, Ealing and Wimbledon. I have an Oyster Card and I found it extremely easy to understand and use.
![[Image: 1739.gif]](http://www.simplygo.com/uploads/ImageRoot/originals/1739.gif)
Looking at the zone map, the Cherry Zone(Derwentside Area) should be expanded to Hexham and Matfen, taking the Hexham and Corbridge area out of the Orange Area completely.
Would it not be better have a couple County Zones e.g
County Durham/South of Tyne(South side of the Tyne down to Teesside, across to Bishop Auckland),
North of Tyne/Northumberland(Newcastle, Hexham and stretching up to Blyth, with a
Regionwide Card covering everything
You mean like how it used to be....
I was trying to find a jpeg of how the zones were previously arranged. I thought I found something but it ended up being a link to a Facebook post by GNE about the revised buzz-fare zones after the Hexham depot purchase.
A poster from this site, who will remain anonymous for now, contributes quite a bit to the conservation from 2010. I think some of his point are still valid and relevant to the debate today...
https://www.facebook.com/simplyGNE/posts/416539660827
(23 Aug 2013, 9:34 pm)AdamY wrote [ -> ]You mean like how it used to be....
I was trying to find a jpeg of how the zones were previously arranged. I thought I found something but it ended up being a link to a Facebook post by GNE about the revised buzz-fare zones after the Hexham depot purchase.
A poster from this site, who will remain anonymous for now, contributes quite a bit to the conservation from 2010. I think some of his point are still valid and relevant to the debate today...
https://www.facebook.com/simplyGNE/posts/416539660827
A certain person who still contributes, seems to like the fact the fares are increasing!
(23 Aug 2013, 9:45 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]A certain person who still contributes, seems to like the fact the fares are increasing!
Yeah, I noticed that too.
(23 Aug 2013, 9:45 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]A certain person who still contributes, seems to like the fact the fares are increasing!
You expect price rises, but take 2012 for example. RPI/CPI vs Fare Increases in the same year. Funnily enough, those who can least afford it (Under 16s & Students) are hit the hardest.
RPI -
2.50%
CPI -
2.83%
BuzzFare
1 Zone tickets:
1 Day -
6.67%
1 Week -
6.86%
4 Weeks -
1.67%
2 Zone tickets:
1 Day -
6.78%
1 Week -
7.66%
4 Weeks -
3.85%
3 Zone+ tickets:
1 Day -
6.85%
1 Week -
7.36%
4 Weeks -
2.06%
Get Around
1 Day -
8.57%
1 Week -
6.71%
4 Weeks -
10.00%
16 Weeks -
9.98%
(24 Aug 2013, 10:49 am)aureolin wrote [ -> ]You expect price rises, but take 2012 for example. RPI/CPI vs Fare Increases in the same year. Funnily enough, those who can least afford it (Under 16s & Students) are hit the hardest.
RPI - 2.50%
CPI - 2.83%
BuzzFare
1 Zone tickets:
1 Day - 6.67%
1 Week - 6.86%
4 Weeks - 1.67%
2 Zone tickets:
1 Day - 6.78%
1 Week - 7.66%
4 Weeks - 3.85%
3 Zone+ tickets:
1 Day - 6.85%
1 Week - 7.36%
4 Weeks - 2.06%
Get Around
1 Day - 8.57%
1 Week - 6.71%
4 Weeks - 10.00%
16 Weeks - 9.98%
That is a massive increase.
Looking at the data on the website, fuel costs increased by 20% between the FY' 12 and FY' 13.
I can't find data for the increase between FY'11 and FY' 12. It should be available somewhere.
However the increase in fuel between 2012 and 2013, was tempered by the massive cost savings mentioned in another thread with insurance costs etc.
Between FY' 13 and FY' 14, fuel costs are increasing by approx 5%.
Their policy states that fuel is... 'fully hedged for the next financial year three months before the start of that year, at which point we aim to have also fixed at least 50% of the following year and 25% of the year after that. This hedging profile is then maintained on a quarterly basis.' quote from Go-ahead website.
Not sure which conclusion to look at.
Profits increased, fares increased, shareholder dividends increased, fuel costs increased, insurance dropped and services were consolidated, cut or reduced.
It's not just weekly/monthly tickets that increased either.
Most single fares (the infamous 5p rises) equate to a 3.7% rise and on some routes a 7% increase in fares
Just been planning a journey from Newcastle City Centre to Newcastle Airport and I was amazed at the price differences.
Nexus Metro £3.20 (someone travelling from South Hylton to The Airport would pay the same fare)
Stagecoach X77 £2.20
Go North East 74A £1.95
That makes Metro 64% more expensive than Go North East. If Nexus takes control of local buses no doubt my bargain £1.95 fare will increase to £3.20.
(25 Aug 2013, 12:29 pm)GuyParkRoyal wrote [ -> ]Just been planning a journey from Newcastle City Centre to Newcastle Airport and I was amazed at the price differences.
Nexus Metro £3.20 (someone travelling from South Hylton to The Airport would pay the same fare)
Stagecoach X77 £2.20
Go North East 74A £1.95
That makes Metro 64% more expensive than Go North East. If Nexus takes control of local buses no doubt my bargain £1.95 fare will increase to £3.20.
What are the return prices like?
(25 Aug 2013, 12:41 pm)Daniel wrote [ -> ]What are the return prices like?
I have not validated these prices with the operators but if my memory serves me correctly the cost of my previous return journeys were:
Metro £4.40
Stagecoach £3.80
Go North East £3.40
So the difference on the return journey for the average commuter or shopping trip is not as extreme as the single journeys. For anyone heading to the Airport to catch a flight the single fare looks the only option, although it’s still a lot cheaper than paying the parking fees to take a car to the Airport.
(04 Sep 2013, 5:17 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]What a bargain!
Reckon if I am ever over that way and needing to head to Sunderland.... That will be my bus!
How much do you reckon the 56 is from Concord to Sunderland, when the 939 goes to Sunderland from Team Valley via Concord and costs £2.80?
I'm thinking about £4.50... Simplified pricing structure.
(04 Sep 2013, 5:20 pm)Daniel wrote [ -> ]How much do you reckon the 56 is from Concord to Sunderland, when the 939 goes to Sunderland from Team Valley via Concord and costs £2.80?
I'm thinking about £4.50... Simplified pricing structure.
Having never used a workers service before, I'm wondering if Nexus have set the prices, especially as there are a number of operators contracted to them.
It would have been towards the end of my Secondary Education, but on one of my morning Scholars buses (normally a Wear Buses ECW Olympian), several members of the public used to get on.
That particular bus, was never crowded, but served 2-3 schools across Washington - meaning it served a big chunk of the town, serving regular bus stops along the way, whilst never entering school grounds.
Thinking back, I'm wondering if they braved the school bus, just to save a few quid and it is a little known secret that Nexus contracted services are cheaper than the commercial services which operate the same route?
There was the regular 194 and 294, which covered more or less the same route into Washington from Fatfield (where these passengers always got on) - so why get the 452 (or whatever number it was)?
(04 Sep 2013, 5:40 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]Having never used a workers service before, I'm wondering if Nexus have set the prices, especially as there are a number of operators contracted to them.
It would have been towards the end of my Secondary Education, but on one of my morning Scholars buses (normally a Wear Buses ECW Olympian), several members of the public used to get on.
That particular bus, was never crowded, but served 2-3 schools across Washington - meaning it served a big chunk of the town, serving regular bus stops along the way, whilst never entering school grounds.
Thinking back, I'm wondering if they braved the school bus, just to save a few quid and it is a little known secret that Nexus contracted services are cheaper than the commercial services which operate the same route?
There was the regular 194 and 294, which covered more or less the same route into Washington from Fatfield (where these passengers always got on) - so why get the 452 (or whatever number it was)?
Wasn't the old 461 or 462 from Biddick was it? Although I recall Kingsleys doing at least the latter for a while There again it was always 25p to go anywhere
(04 Sep 2013, 6:19 pm)aureolin wrote [ -> ]Wasn't the old 461 or 462 from Biddick was it? Although I recall Kingsleys doing at least the latter for a while There again it was always 25p to go anywhere
25p?! Haha, I had gone by then I think - although I can remember my mother kicking off when the fares went up to 20p from 15p in the mid-90's. She even rang the bus company to double check!
It might have been those numbers to be honest, although Kingsleys didn't operate it when I got it.
I remember years ago that part of the Conditions of Carriage of a PSV driver that there have to have a paper copy to hand of the faretable for the bus service that there in service with, and have to be shown to the customer if asked for. Don't know if the rules have been changed or relaxed, or is there a bus driver on here that has there updated Conditions of Carriage with them and quickly go through the booklet to confirm or not to confirm.
It was a requirement of the Traffic Commissioners that a fare table be carried and available for inspection upon request. These days, my understanding is that having the fares programmed into a ticket machine is accepted by the TC as sufficient - which, I suppose, makes sense. Some companies ask their drivers to carry a Stage List - a list of fare stages and an indication of which direction is 'inbound' and which is 'outbound.' These lists sometimes include an indication of which fare stages are in which fares zone (eg, GNE colour zones and T & W fare zones - required for Transfares and NTL product validity). Drivers should also be aware of such things as PlusBus validity and oddities such as Hadrian's Wall Day Ticket. (Hopefully, when everything goes 'Smart', the machine will know all this, too!).
Add in his duty board, cash dispenser, hi viz vest, wallets for paper weekly tickets and a diary in which to write his shifts, and it's no wonder that most companies provide some sort of satchell!