North East Buses

(18 Oct 2020, 9:36 pm)Jordan2104 wrote [ -> ]Seen an e200 on 32a today instead of breadvan

(18 Oct 2020, 10:42 am)Dan wrote [ -> ]I note that SF14HAA and SF14HAO, which are two Bluebirds normally allocated to the 'R' services, were seemingly not allocated yesterday. I wonder if it has anything to do with my mention earlier this week that their MOTs had expired?

(13 Oct 2020, 12:19 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]

• SF14HAA - MOT expired 4 October 2020
  
• SF14HAO - MOT expired 1 October 2020
  

• SL16YPE - MOT expired 18 August 2020, but photos on Facebook show the vehicle in service on 20 August, 27 August and 3 September 2020 - attached is the example uploaded by Ian Hardie on the North East Bus Enthusiasts Facebook group, showing the vehicle in service on 3 September 2020?
  

(24 Oct 2020, 4:34 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]It seems three vehicles were all put through MOT this week, on 19 and 20 October, confirming that there was no delay at the DVSA.

SF14HAA and SL16YPE both failed their first tests on 20 October (the former due to exhaust emissions, and the latter for 'Interior/Entrance/Exit/Platfs' as well as 'Brake Systems and Components'). Slightly concerning that these vehicles were all on the road, in public service, without an MOT... Seemingly only being MOT'd after it was noticed..!

(24 Oct 2020, 4:51 pm)Michael wrote [ -> ]Wonder if NEXUS will take action?, could they be fined, if so how much?, its something they wouldn't want, with everything happening atm with COVID.

(24 Oct 2020, 4:34 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]It seems three vehicles were all put through MOT this week, on 19 and 20 October, confirming that there was no delay at the DVSA.

SF14HAA and SL16YPE both failed their first tests on 20 October (the former due to exhaust emissions, and the latter for 'Interior/Entrance/Exit/Platfs' as well as 'Brake Systems and Components'). Slightly concerning that these vehicles were all on the road, in public service, without an MOT... Seemingly only being MOT'd after it was noticed..!

(30 Oct 2020, 6:15 pm)Michael wrote [ -> ]White Enviro on the 73, just left Sunderland.

(31 Oct 2020, 2:28 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]Gateshead Central Taxis have received two ADL E200s on loan from Mistral - YX18KUD and YW68PBY.

Gateshead Central Taxis Newest Addition Is YX18 KUD Which Is A Enviro 200 Which Can Be Seen At Shiney Row While Working Service 37 To Doxford Park by thomasbooth030705, on Flickr


The Other New Bus For Gateshead Central Taxis Is Envrio200MMC YW68 PBY Which Can Be Seen At Heworth Interchange After Working The 558 From Dene Eatate by thomasbooth030705, on Flickr

(31 Oct 2020, 2:28 pm)IDan wrote [ -> ]Gateshead Central Taxis have received two ADL E200s on loan from Mistral - YX18KUD and YW68PBY.

Gateshead Central Taxis Newest Addition Is YX18 KUD Which Is A Enviro 200 Which Can Be Seen At Shiney Row While Working Service 37 To Doxford Park by thomasbooth030705, on Flickr


The Other New Bus For Gateshead Central Taxis Is Envrio200MMC YW68 PBY Which Can Be Seen At Heworth Interchange After Working The 558 From Dene Eatate by thomasbooth030705, on Flickr

(31 Oct 2020, 5:30 pm)ThomasSpare wrote [ -> ]Using My photos agian??

(31 Oct 2020, 6:20 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]Something for you to be happy about - we're providing a link to your photos on Flickr, which in turn means your photos are viewed and appreciated by more enthusiasts.

(02 Nov 2020, 10:21 pm)Economic505 wrote [ -> ]Still a Micky mouse operator. Nexus must be desperate to award them contracts.

(03 Nov 2020, 9:56 pm)Big O wrote [ -> ]Shows the lack of ambition that Nexus have towards Buses in Newcastle. Not sure why Stanley Travel and A-line who are actually decent, cannot pick up more work. It shouldn't always be about cost because a bread van will always be cheaper than a Solo.

(03 Nov 2020, 10:07 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote [ -> ]Nexus are morons! Go North East should operate all of the bus services in the North East!

Stanley Travel were decent on the 84A I used to use, Gateshead Central Taxis...need I say more?
A-line seem decent, but haven't used them yet.

GCT operate all of their services badly! Well, apart from the 516 in South Shields (other than when they first stole it from GNE and the Streetlite didn;t have a working front destination!).

The bread vans are not too bad. Phoenix have one for the 808/15. Is the 32A going to be operated with Enviros on a Sunday again, or permanently back to bread vans?  Gutted I missed the Enviros on the 32A!

(03 Nov 2020, 10:14 pm)Adrian wrote [ -> ]That would result in nothing but even less value for money for customers. The North East is already too much of a monopoly for three principle operators.

(04 Nov 2020, 1:21 am)OrangeArrow49 wrote [ -> ]Go North East is amazing value for money, and they are my favourite operator.

1 bus operator means one ticket (unless needing a Metro). Simply ticket structure, one comprehensive network.

Definitely GCT should go. Weardale should too. A-line, Stanley Travel and Phoenix are good operators.

(03 Nov 2020, 10:07 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote [ -> ]Nexus are morons! Go North East should operate all of the bus services in the North East!

Stanley Travel were decent on the 84A I used to use, Gateshead Central Taxis...need I say more?
A-line seem decent, but haven't used them yet.

GCT operate all of their services badly! Well, apart from the 516 in South Shields (other than when they first stole it from GNE and the Streetlite didn;t have a working front destination!).

The bread vans are not too bad. Phoenix have one for the 808/15. Is the 32A going to be operated with Enviros on a Sunday again, or permanently back to bread vans?  Gutted I missed the Enviros on the 32A!

(04 Nov 2020, 7:13 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]I disagree on GoNorthEast should run all the bus services by Nexus as it just gives them an excuse to give up more services on the Evenings and Sundays. They've already done enough already yet other operators can run similar routes commercially.

Also what's wrong with Weardale they're quite a good little operator imo especially over Bishop / Weardale way.

(04 Nov 2020, 8:39 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote [ -> ]Go North East has always been my favourite operator! Nexus services could be operated by Stanley Travel/A-line/Phoenix but for ticket acceptance it's best if a major operator run them, or ticket acceptance be in place on smaller operators. 

Competition is dead. Someone on here said recently (streetdeckfan?) they refuse to use Stagecoach (I use them reluctantly and refuse to use Arriva!). In the West End, Stagecoach is the most frequent, but expensive and restrictive in destinations, and I prefer GNE.  GNE operate the most places in the North East, so offer the best value. Yes, they are more expensive in GNE-only territory, but competition is dead, buried and not coming back. Stagecoach only run locally for the most part, Arriva is mostly rural, neither would be missed.  

Never used Weardale, but their buses are really old!

(04 Nov 2020, 10:09 pm)Adrian wrote [ -> ]The majority of the region has no choice to what operator they use, because there is very little in the way of competition outside of City Centres and key corridors. Derwentside for example, you have no choice but to use Go North East, so they can charge whatever they want. Where I live in Durham has the same problem - we have a GNE bus a couple of times on a Sunday, but its a 100% Arriva monopoly outside of that - and they do charge what they want, for a pretty appalling service.

When buses were deregulated by Maggie Thatcher, the idea was that competition will lead to the best results. The reality is that we've seen very little in the way of competition - just one huge turf war. Buses are ran for profit, not for those using them.

(05 Nov 2020, 1:00 am)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]The issue is it's basically impossible to have 'full competition'. If every operator operated in every area, there wouldn't be enough passengers to go around.

I also think having buses being nationalised is a horrific idea. All it does is give the monopoly to the government rather than a private company. Then it'll go from it being all about profit, to it costing as little as possible to run. At least when you're doing it for profit, there's an incentive to improve the service. When you're running something as a 'public service', it just has to fulfil the bare minimum of being able to move people around, anything beyond that is a waste.
Just look how much nicer the buses are up here compared to likes of London!

I live in Bishop, so it's mainly Arriva with GNE just running the X21, and I honestly don't have an issue with that. My main issue with the public transport here is the lack of multi-operator tickets, compared to T&W (which could be argued is down to the lack of competition), but there's also the fact that there is such a hard border between the 'territories'.

For example If I want to travel from Bear Park to Langley Park, a distance of about 3 miles, I'd have to buy both an Arriva and GNE ticket, or a Network One Explorer at £10.90 for the day, but have to go via Durham so the journey would take an hour instead of the 7 minutes in the car
But in Tyne and Wear, you can travel from Seaton Burn to Easington Lane, a distance of around 24 miles, using both GNE and Arriva for only £7.80 using a Network One Day Rover ticket.

If I could get a reasonably priced ticket to use on both GNE and Arriva down here, I'd be all over it. It'd mean I wouldn't have to plan things to make sure that when I get an Arriva ticket, I'm visiting all the places that are Arriva only in that one day.

(05 Nov 2020, 1:00 am)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]I also think having buses being nationalised is a horrific idea. All it does is give the monopoly to the government rather than a private company. Then it'll go from it being all about profit, to it costing as little as possible to run. At least when you're doing it for profit, there's an incentive to improve the service. When you're running something as a 'public service', it just has to fulfil the bare minimum of being able to move people around, anything beyond that is a waste.
Just look how much nicer the buses are up here compared to likes of London!

Whilst 'profit' isn't a dirty word, the pursuit of it also encourages cost cutting (maybe even corner cutting, since we're on the Gateshead Central thread....).  'Public Service' doesn't necessarily have to be the bare minimum at all.  I wouldn't class the services and facilities on offer at my local hospital, for example, as being the 'bare minimum'.  In regards to London, yes it comes at a cost but I'm sure Londoners are happier with their network ticketing and coverage as opposed to laminate flooring and disco lights.

(05 Nov 2020, 12:06 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]You need to look into bus companies ran by governments more than that. Dublin Bus and Lothian are 2 companies you should be comparing to not London Buses which is franchised which is something different again. I'd rather than money went back into the governments hands than some big wig in an office somewhere. Technically one of the 3 bus companies is the North East is ran by the government anyway just the shame it's the German one and not ours. You don't have to have it ran by the government directly as a public service. LNER and Northern Trains are an example of public ran transport and they're both better than the private companies than ran it before there which surprisingly are 2 of the big 4 in the UK not to mention the bombshell with Thameslink Southern (GoAhead). To be fair though so is the Metro with Nexus so it all comes down who's running the show in a similar sense with private companies.

To be fair though I can't imagine there being much difference for the passenger who runs it with the same problems, we may have a few more evening and Sunday services though but that'll be about it and again it comes to runs it, if it's someone like Lothian then it could be good. If it's Nexus then I'm sure GCT will run the 21 and 308 well...

(05 Nov 2020, 5:06 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]But Lothian still has competition, it may be owned by the LA, but they still have to compete with other operators as if they were running like any other commercial operator. The closest we really have to a government ran public transport network is TFL, they're just choosing to contract out the operations rather than run them in house.

To me, it's not about the owner, but about the system behind it.

Like I said, having all the buses ran by the government just moves the monopoly from a company owned by shareholders to a company owned by the government. At least with privatisation, there's an opportunity for competition, even if it's not well executed.

One thing I think we can all agree on, is that if NEXUS managed to get their hands on the buses, it'd be a much bigger shitshow than it is now!

(05 Nov 2020, 6:19 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]There's very little competition in Edinburgh especially in the East side of the city, Nottingham and Blackpool are both the same aswell. I know your bringing up the competition up here competition doesn't really bring better buses for the majority of users.

The things you described above such as the mod cons don't exist where there's competition and the 3 operators I've listed above overall provide a much better service across the board compared to the big 3 up here.

Competition isn't a good thing, there's 4 big areas with massive competition around here. Hartlepool, North Tyneside, South Shields and Sunderland. South Shields is by far Stagecoach's weakest area with Hartlepool a very close second. North Tyneside is by far GNE's worst area (everything is subsidised one way or another) with Sunderland not far behind with them pretty much abandoning South Shields (depot closed years ago) and North Tyneside is also arguably Arriva's weakest area aswell.

On the other hand the best 3 areas in terms of service though are for Arriva is SE Northumberland, GNE is Derwentside and Stagecoach is Newcastle's West End. There's one thing in common between all 3, they're all monopolies.

Bus companies are unique in the sense they will always have competition, the difference is there competition is different types of transport rather than other bus companies. If they don't provide a good enough service then the majority of customers will eventually just move to driving. The difference between having a public company running the service is the £500k profit lets say they make (made up) at Percy Main and Jesmond wouldn't be going to some shareholders they'd be invested in running the 19, 41, 42, W1, W2, W3, 319, 335, 359 and so on under the same standards all day and evenings rather than the mess we have now with GCT running them to the ground and that's the biggest problem. Not to mention the fact that the tax payer is paying directly for some shareholders bonuses.

(05 Nov 2020, 5:06 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]But Lothian still has competition, it may be owned by the LA, but they still have to compete with other operators as if they were running like any other commercial operator. The closest we really have to a government ran public transport network is TFL, they're just choosing to contract out the operations rather than run them in house.

To me, it's not about the owner, but about the system behind it.

Like I said, having all the buses ran by the government just moves the monopoly from a company owned by shareholders to a company owned by the government. At least with privatisation, there's an opportunity for competition, even if it's not well executed.

One thing I think we can all agree on, is that if NEXUS managed to get their hands on the buses, it'd be a much bigger shitshow than it is now!

(05 Nov 2020, 8:45 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote [ -> ]The West End of Newcastle overall has more Stagecoach buses than anything else, but it's not a monopoly. Throckley/Denton Burn has Arriva/GNE/Stagecoach/GCT. In Gosforth it's mostly Arriva, with GNE and Stagecoach running less frequently. In Westerhope/Slatyford there is the GNE 74 and in the latter and Fenham there is the GCT 84A (and 84 in Benwell). Kingston Park has the 42A every hour (GNE Mon-Sat, GCT evenings and Sundays). Not a monopoly, just mostly Stagecoach. As someone who lives in the West End, I can absolutely say without hesitation Stagecoach is shit! GNE is by far the best, if less frequent. Saying the West End is a monopoly is rather sweeping!

Derwentside has Weardale, but not a comprehensive network, so is a GNE monopoly.  SE Northumberland is only Arriva, I believe.

Stagecoach has plenty of service in Shields. GNE in North Tyneside is fine, besides the creation of GCT secured journeys.