North East Buses

(22 Aug 2022, 11:04 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]I thought GNE had the following policies pre-covid for standing?

- No standing allowed on X9/X10

- Any X21 journeys with standees non-stop via Birtley rather than A1M

Saying that......not much different to Arriva who allow standing on the X15/X18/X20 with fast sections of road.

Seemed to vary on driver as to if they actually enforced this or not.

The X9/X10 became difficult to enforce this on when Citaros were making semi-regular appearances and it became a case of let people stand or turn round and tell them they cannot get on and have to wait at least another half hour (or an hour).

I only encountered the issue with standees on the X21 once and the driver did make a fuss at making everyone sit down because of this apparent rule/guideline but there was still standees after Low Fell so it was all for nothing and he still ended up going down the A1(M) to CLS with standees on-board so the only achievement was me having a long wait in Durham as this delayed the X21 by 10-15 minutes resulting in a missed connection.

(22 Aug 2022, 11:55 pm)Jimmi wrote [ -> ]I only encountered the issue with standees on the X21 once and the driver did make a fuss at making everyone sit down because of this apparent rule/guideline but there was still standees after Low Fell so it was all for nothing and he still ended up going down the A1(M) to CLS with standees on-board so the only achievement was me having a long wait in Durham as this delayed the X21 by 10-15 minutes resulting in a missed connection.

See, the X21 probably spends about the same time if not less than Arriva's X14/X15/X18/X20 on 50+ MPH dual carriageways / motorways.

I'd imagine especially on match days Arriva carry standing loads between Clifton and Gosforth Park on the A1, sometimes up to 62MPH. I don't think any Arriva drivers would divert via Stannington, Plessey Checks, Snowy Owl and Wideopen unless it was a bit gusty.

(23 Aug 2022, 8:10 am)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]See, the X21 probably spends about the same time if not less than Arriva's X14/X15/X18/X20 on 50+ MPH dual carriageways / motorways.

I'd imagine especially on match days Arriva carry standing loads between Clifton and Gosforth Park on the A1, sometimes up to 62MPH. I don't think any Arriva drivers would divert via Stannington, Plessey Checks, Snowy Owl and Wideopen unless it was a bit gusty.

Maybe it's just me, but I'd be far more wary of standing on a bus on a bumpy and twisty A/B road than I would be standing on a dual carriageway or motorway as they're a constant speed

(23 Aug 2022, 8:23 am)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]Maybe it's just me, but I'd be far more wary of standing on a bus on a bumpy and twisty A/B road than I would be standing on a dual carriageway or motorway as they're a constant speed

Do that at 50.mph on the A19 in winter when a sudden hail storm hits and someone joining at one of the  many dangerous junctions that the A19 has loses control in front of you (this has happened to us in our car)  and you're through the front windscreen.

QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.

(23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote [ -> ]QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.

Why half the frequency between Great Park & St Peters.

(23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote [ -> ]QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.

Think I'll stick to the 44 although I hear jesmond is nice on a friday night around 8 and Fawdons  a party place after dark!

To Answer the question the X9/10 was always busy whenever i used it. Even a few weeks ago when I got on at Peterlee they was hardly any seats left and that was at about 12ish. I can see them needing to do something soon.

Following up from my rant about the 309/310/311 a few weeks back, here is my suggestion timetable for the evening journeys.

[attachment=10204]

Other than a bit of 'tidying up' and re-timing the later 309 journeys to better serve Cobalt Park and create some form of even headway with Arriva's 308 ex Newcastle, the only major change is Sunday evenings after 20:00 which to be honest, would be a sensible set of cuts (although no cuts are exactly good). 

Although some rota changes would be required, run-in times (give or take) shouldn't be too different.

Current last run-in times (from terminus)
Mon-Sun - Norham Road / Verne Road - 00:04
Mon-Sun - Norham Road North - 23:59
Mon-Sun - Whitley Bay Cemetery - 23:13
Mon-Sat - Blyth - 21:23
Sun - Blyth - 19:23

New last run-in times (from terminus)
Mon-Sat - Norham Road / Verne Road - 00:04
Sun - Norham Road / Verne Road - 23:39
Mon-Sat - Whitley Bay Cemetery - 23:38
Mon-Sat - Norham Road North - 23:23
Sun - Norham Road North - 23:03
Mon-Sat - Blyth 21:47
Sun - Blyth - 20:43
Sun - Blyth - 19:43

(24 Aug 2022, 7:34 pm)col87 wrote [ -> ]To Answer the question the X9/10 was always busy whenever i used it. Even a few weeks ago when I got on at Peterlee they was hardly any seats left and that was at about 12ish.  I can see them needing to do something soon.

Maybe numbers didn't recover back in January.

Big issue now if numbers re-grow and even if driver retention is sorted, would be what vehicles to allocate if X9 brought back?

Not enough 'new' spare E400MMC at Consett with 13 out of 14 - 69, 20, 70 plates being used on X30's/X45/X70's

However, would the 6 moving to Consett not justify re-opening the bait room at Stanley? X30/X31 going standalone would reduce the 'low height' requirement at Consett overnight and that would at least free three up if needed. I'm not going to bother working a full allocation out but that would be a starting point.

Send the Q3 from Jesmond to Regent Centre via a new bus gate on Salters Bridge and Hollywood Avenue, allowing the 46/46A to be withdrawn. Q3 then can also go along Polwarth Drive and Greenfield Road too. Only areas that lose out are Featherstone Grove and Gosforth high street.

(29 Aug 2022, 9:52 pm)omnicity4659 wrote [ -> ]Send the Q3 from Jesmond to Regent Centre via a new bus gate on Salters Bridge and Hollywood Avenue, allowing the 46/46A to be withdrawn. Q3 then can also go along Polwarth Drive and Greenfield Road too. Only areas that lose out are Featherstone Grove and Gosforth high street.

Not sure that's a good idea as your removing the Jesmond and Great Park to Gosforth links.

Doing the route you suggested there, there's very little reason to go via Jesmond as most people use the Metro anyway and Salter's Bridge is knackered. The only reason they shut the bridges is to save money maintaining them, blaming it as environmental reasons instead.

(29 Aug 2022, 9:58 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Not sure that's a good idea as your removing the Jesmond and Great Park to Gosforth links.

Doing the route you suggested there, there's very little reason to go via Jesmond as most people use the Metro anyway and Salter's Bridge is knackered. The only reason they shut the bridges is to save money maintaining them, blaming it as environmental reasons instead.

Wasn't aware of the bridge situation, although I had a feeling the rat-run excuse wasn't the reason why it closed to vehicles.

Not sure how many people get on along Hollywood Avenue, so it could be a sacrifice to just keep the Q3 as it is but just run it via Polwarth Drive instead to bin off the 46.

(29 Aug 2022, 10:15 pm)omnicity4659 wrote [ -> ]Wasn't aware of the bridge situation, although I had a feeling the rat-run excuse wasn't the reason why it closed to vehicles.

Sure that, at least over the last couple of years before it was closed, it had been signed as a weak bridge and weight restricted.

84/85/93/94 

THey should become actual loops. 

I just realised this a few days ago and its another failure from management imo. 

At this current time the 93&94 interwork meaning while they are loops they are very badly designed as if you want to get to Bensham, from Gateshead Stadium you would either need to slog 45 mins on 93 or 20 mins on 94, however to save 25 mins you would need to pay double the fares so why don't GNE just have the 93 stay on the 93 all day so you can go past the terminus Gateshead e.g Heworth to Bensham qucker than having to go the long way around. Samr for 84/85.

I don't know why they don't do it this way.

(29 Aug 2022, 11:08 pm)Unber43 wrote [ -> ]84/85/93/94 

THey should become actual loops. 

I just realised this a few days ago and its another failure from management imo. 

At this current time the 93&94 interwork meaning while they are loops they are very badly designed as if you want to get to Bensham, from Gateshead Stadium you would either need to slog 45 mins on 93 or 20 mins on 94, however to save 25 mins you would need to pay double the fares so why don't GNE just have the 93 stay on the 93 all day so you can go past the terminus Gateshead e.g Heworth to Bensham qucker than having to go the long way around. Samr for 84/85.

I don't know why they don't do it this way.

I’ve added “failure from management” onto your Bingo card. It appears daily at the moment!


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(30 Aug 2022, 5:22 am)Dan wrote [ -> ]I’ve added “failure from management” onto your Bingo card. It appears daily at the moment!


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What can I say it's a common occurrence

(30 Aug 2022, 5:22 am)Dan wrote [ -> ]I’ve added “failure from management” onto your Bingo card. It appears daily at the moment!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

When will the new updated bingo cards be released?

Will they interwork with the various other bingo cards floating around on here? And will it be available at a certain butcher shop in Jacky White's Market?

(30 Aug 2022, 5:22 am)Dan wrote [ -> ]I’ve added “failure from management” onto your Bingo card. It appears daily at the moment!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

How many bingo cards do you have in circulation now?

What's to bet they're currently trying to slide into the DMs of the new management?

Keep seeing people moaning about the 65 being constantly delayed and it got me thinking how could you improve it and came up with these new routes.

60 - Permanently dropped to every 15 minutes.
61 - Withdrawn
X6 - As is (Hourly)
X7 - Same route as X6 to Dalton Park extended, 65 route through Murton, extended to Peterlee hourly via 61 route, every hour
X8 - Same route as X6 to Dalton Park extended around the 61 Murton loop, every 30 minutes
35 - Current route, every 30 minutes extended to Durham via the 65 route, hourly
36 - Current 65 route, every hour.

Overall the PVR would be the same / possibly slightly reduced it's just moving resources to give better service to more areas and a new express service to Seaham rather than the 61 duplicating numerous services and a bus spending it's time going around in circles around Murton.

With these common sections

22/23/60 - Every 7.5 Minutes
X6/X7/X8 - Every 15 Minutes
35/36 - Every 30 Minutes

The X6 only takes 1 minute longer than the 61 does and Hetton etc get a quicker direct service to Sunderland without a mystery tour around Murton and removes duplicate services through the West side of Seaham and fixes the driver issues with the 35/36 interworking.

(12 Sep 2022, 9:53 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Keep seeing people moaning about the 65 being constantly delayed and it got me thinking how could you improve it and came up with these new routes.

60 - Permanently dropped to every 15 minutes.
61 - Withdrawn
X6 - As is (Hourly)
X7 - Same route as X6 to Dalton Park extended, 65 route through Murton, extended to Peterlee hourly via 61 route, every hour
X8 - Same route as X6 to Dalton Park extended around the 61 Murton loop, every 30 minutes
35 - Current route, every 30 minutes extended to Durham via the 65 route, hourly
36 - Current 65 route, every hour.

Overall the PVR would be the same / possibly slightly reduced it's just moving resources to give better service to more areas and a new express service to Seaham rather than the 61 duplicating numerous services and a bus spending it's time going around in circles around Murton.

With these common sections

22/23/60 - Every 7.5 Minutes
X6/X7/X8 - Every 15 Minutes
35/36 - Every 30 Minutes

The X6 only takes 1 minute longer than the 61 does and Hetton etc get a quicker direct service to Sunderland without a mystery tour around Murton and removes duplicate services through the West side of Seaham and fixes the driver issues with the 35/36 interworking.

So Seaham to Durham would be hourly, when the Seaham - Hetton part is the part with the most traffic, aswell its either Arriva or GNE, for most people so therefore it would be every 15 mins with the 60, with the 61 cancellation. 

Every 15 min link between Seaham and Dalton Park on GNE is gone, to every hour. There is no integration with Arriva & GNE, especially people who buy day tickets and single Arriva is cheaper. 

60 should return to every 12 mins especially with the 61 drop in frequency. The 61 should be permanently re-routed on the 61A Route. 

X6 - Sunderland - Seaham - Dalton Park - Peterlee - Easington - Murton - Dalton Park - Seaham - Doxford Park - Sunderland. 
X7 - Sunderland - Doxford Park - Seaham - Dalton Park - Murton - Easington - Peterlee - Dalton Park - Seaham - Sunderland 

I don't know how that would work, but it would keep the 61 at every 30 mins with an express service to peterlee and a slow service.

---

Tbf if anything GNE should run the 22.

(12 Sep 2022, 10:04 pm)Unber43 wrote [ -> ]So Seaham to Durham would be hourly, when the Seaham - Hetton part is the part with the most traffic, aswell its either Arriva or GNE, for most people so therefore it would be every 15 mins with the 60, with the 61 cancellation. 

Every 15 min link between Seaham and Dalton Park on GNE is gone, to every hour. There is no integration with Arriva & GNE, especially people who buy day tickets and single Arriva is cheaper. 

60 should return to every 12 mins especially with the 61 drop in frequency. The 61 should be permanently re-routed on the 61A Route. 

X6 - Sunderland - Seaham - Dalton Park - Peterlee - Easington - Murton - Dalton Park - Seaham - Doxford Park - Sunderland. 
X7 - Sunderland - Doxford Park - Seaham - Dalton Park - Murton - Easington - Peterlee - Dalton Park - Seaham - Sunderland 

I don't know how that would work, but it would keep the 61 at every 30 mins with an express service to peterlee and a slow service.

---

Tbf if anything GNE should run the 22.

To those,

Murton to Seaham would upped to every 15 minutes with the 36, X7 and X8
Seaham to Dalton Park would also be every 15 minutes with the X6, X7 and X8
The 60 is mostly covered, it's only section in the West of Seaham which isn't, the 2, 2A, 39, 39A all over other parts of the route and having one awkward 12 minute service with 2 15 minute services makes it hard to interwork.

Maps of those routes above I think you got confused by the routes:
X6 - Same as now
X7 - https://www.google.com/maps/dir/54.90201...762441!3e0
X8 - https://www.google.com/maps/dir/54.90201...07!1m0!3e0
35 - https://www.google.com/maps/dir/54.90201...1e!1m0!3e0
36 - Same as 65

Minus Doxford Park, the X6/X7 are pretty much doing that anyway there.

(12 Sep 2022, 10:31 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]To those,

Murton to Seaham would upped to every 15 minutes with the 36, X7 and X8
Seaham to Dalton Park would also be every 15 minutes with the X6, X7 and X8
The 60 is mostly covered, it's only section in the West of Seaham which isn't, the 2, 2A, 39, 39A all over other parts of the route and having one awkward 12 minute service with 2 15 minute services makes it hard to interwork.

Murton to Seaham is currently at every 20 mins, was every 15. 

From Ryhope - New Seaham towards DP wouldn't have a service, and New Seaham to Dalton park would only be hourly. 

23/22 and 60/61 will never interwork, also there is no ticket acceptance. 22/23 pick up no one between Dalton Park and Sunderland. Which is why imo 22 should be ran by GNE.

And as stated previously this hourly 36 isn't going to work the 65 biggest traffic is people getting on/off at Seaham to Hetton & Durham

(12 Sep 2022, 10:43 pm)Unber43 wrote [ -> ]Murton to Seaham is currently at every 20 mins, was every 15. 

From Ryhope - New Seaham towards DP wouldn't have a service, and New Seaham to Dalton park would only be hourly. 

23/22 and 60/61 will never interwork, also there is no ticket acceptance. 22/23 pick up no one between Dalton Park and Sunderland. Which is why imo 22 should be ran by GNE.

tbf. that's more ticketing issues though. There should be ticketing between 2 and the BSIP should sort that out. There's too many buses on that corridor and the 61 is the one that's getting the bullet with frequency reductions. In an ideal world the fact it's Arriva / GNE needs to be made irrelevant.

Having 2 operators on one corridor never benefits anyone though really, it's the same with the Coast Road. It's ridiculous how many buses there are between Ryhope/Leechmere and Sunderland though, there's no need for 19 buses an hour in parts which I believe it is in normal times excluding the Stagecoach 10/11 and X6. 

Similar there's no need for 11 buses from West Seaham to Sunderland either.

(12 Sep 2022, 10:56 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]tbf. that's more ticketing issues though. There should be ticketing between 2 and the BSIP should sort that out. There's too many buses on that corridor and the 61 is the one that's getting the bullet with frequency reductions. In an ideal world the fact it's Arriva / GNE needs to be made irrelevant.

Having 2 operators on one corridor never benefits anyone though really, it's the same with the Coast Road. It's ridiculous how many buses there are between Ryhope/Leechmere and Sunderland though, there's no need for 19 buses an hour in parts which I believe it is in normal times excluding the Stagecoach 10/11 and X6. 

Similar there's no need for 11 buses from West Seaham to Sunderland either.

I think there is only 9, 5 60's, 2 61's, 1 22, 1 23. 

Like I stated before 22/23 don't pick up anyone between Dalton Park and Sunderland. so really its 7. 

Clearly there is a need for the 60/61 at 6, Hopefully back upto 7 per hour at the end of October. I don't think the 22/23 will go back upto every 15 mins, I think the 22 Might, but not the 23. Realistically 22/23/24 would all be ran by GNE. Especially the Sunderland to Durham part

(12 Sep 2022, 9:53 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Keep seeing people moaning about the 65 being constantly delayed and it got me thinking how could you improve it and came up with these new routes.

60 - Permanently dropped to every 15 minutes.
61 - Withdrawn
X6 - As is (Hourly)
X7 - Same route as X6 to Dalton Park extended, 65 route through Murton, extended to Peterlee hourly via 61 route, every hour
X8 - Same route as X6 to Dalton Park extended around the 61 Murton loop, every 30 minutes
35 - Current route, every 30 minutes extended to Durham via the 65 route, hourly
36 - Current 65 route, every hour.

Overall the PVR would be the same / possibly slightly reduced it's just moving resources to give better service to more areas and a new express service to Seaham rather than the 61 duplicating numerous services and a bus spending it's time going around in circles around Murton.

With these common sections

22/23/60 - Every 7.5 Minutes
X6/X7/X8 - Every 15 Minutes
35/36 - Every 30 Minutes

The X6 only takes 1 minute longer than the 61 does and Hetton etc get a quicker direct service to Sunderland without a mystery tour around Murton and removes duplicate services through the West side of Seaham and fixes the driver issues with the 35/36 interworking.

Have you seen how busy the 60 gets. I needs the every 12 minute frequency back, so does the 20 tbh.

It's a suggestions thread,not actual reality

(13 Sep 2022, 5:18 am)Unber43 wrote [ -> ]I think there is only 9, 5 60's, 2 61's, 1 22, 1 23. 

Like I stated before 22/23 don't pick up anyone between Dalton Park and Sunderland. so really its 7. 

Clearly there is a need for the 60/61 at 6, Hopefully back upto 7 per hour at the end of October. I don't think the 22/23 will go back upto every 15 mins, I think the 22 Might, but not the 23. Realistically 22/23/24 would all be ran by GNE. Especially the Sunderland to Durham part

See if there as only one operator somehow or ticketing works that there's only one operator and it's all shared evenly (not going to happen obviously) I'd go even further imo this would be the best then, numbers would probably need changing.

22: Sunderland - Express via X6 route - Seaham - Express via X6 route - Doxford Park - Current 22 Route, every 30 minutes

23: Current Route, every 30 minutes
61: Current Route, terminating at Murton, every 30 minites
---
Combined Every 15 Minutes

60: Current Route, every 15 minutes
---
Combined with above, Every 7.5 Minutes

35: Current route, extended to Durham, hourly
36: Current 35 route to Hetton, extended to Peterlee, hourly
37: Current 65 route, hourly
38: Current 65 route to far side Murton, extended to Peterlee via 61 route, hourly
---
All areas combined to give 30 minutes services between the main points, there's only Low Moorsley to Murton on the Sunderland leg with a worse service than now. It would also mean that all the villages around there are connected without changing, albeit only hourly.

With the rotas working, 35 -> 37 -> 38 -> 36 (or reverse).

X6: Withdrawn

(12 Sep 2022, 10:56 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]tbf. that's more ticketing issues though. There should be ticketing between 2 and the BSIP should sort that out. There's too many buses on that corridor and the 61 is the one that's getting the bullet with frequency reductions. In an ideal world the fact it's Arriva / GNE needs to be made irrelevant.

Having 2 operators on one corridor never benefits anyone though really, it's the same with the Coast Road. It's ridiculous how many buses there are between Ryhope/Leechmere and Sunderland though, there's no need for 19 buses an hour in parts which I believe it is in normal times excluding the Stagecoach 10/11 and X6. 

Similar there's no need for 11 buses from West Seaham to Sunderland either.

Currently 2x 2, 2x 2A, 1x 22, 1x 23, 4x 39s, 4x 60, 2x 61; so 16 buses per hour - HOWEVER, that is only true for a few stops (Ocean Road - Vilette Road). The 2 joins at Toll Bar Road, 2A at Grangetown, and the 2, 2A and 39s leave at Vilette Road. Equally, is there much need for Old Durham Road to have 14 bph into Newcastle (18 if you add the X1)? I don't know the area too much but it seems a pretty similar situation to me, yet I don't see many people bringing it up. Thing is, all those services connect Sunderland with somewhere else and it just happens that in most cases, Ryhope Road is the quickest and most convenient route. Having said that, diverting some journeys on the 60 (as a 60A or 62 also going to Murton) via QA Road to the Hospital wouldn't hurt anyone, and frankly a direct bus from Murton/Seaham to the hospital would be very useful. Also the 60 needs to be at least every 12 minutes, it's just too busy otherwise, especially if there's a cancellation.

(13 Sep 2022, 5:18 am)Unber43 wrote [ -> ]I think there is only 9, 5 60's, 2 61's, 1 22, 1 23. 

Like I stated before 22/23 don't pick up anyone between Dalton Park and Sunderland. so really its 7. 

Clearly there is a need for the 60/61 at 6, Hopefully back upto 7 per hour at the end of October. I don't think the 22/23 will go back upto every 15 mins, I think the 22 Might, but not the 23. Realistically 22/23/24 would all be ran by GNE. Especially the Sunderland to Durham part

Might be true from what you've seen but it isn't - there's been a couple of times I've been on a 61 playing leap frog with an arriva bus.