(24 Oct 2021, 10:15 am)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]I can't remember it going down Durham Road to be honest, but it did benefit me going down Chester Road.
Not sure it was ever likely to be a massive money spinner on either route to be honest.
Alongside the 16x services, it had the 220/222 and 535/536.
Chester Road had all of the local stuff, plus the 638, 777, X6, 775 and 778 for distance work.
Originally I’m sure the 164 originally went to South Shields before that section got cut in favour of the Sunderland to Seaburn extension, I remember when the 164 only ran every 2 hours during daytime and was an express service only stopping at certain points between Sunderland and Hetton, when ok got purchased and the 535/536 took over the 161 route and eventually became the 35/35a/36 and killed that service aswell, nothing left much now , ashame it’s all for profit now than providing a bus service to passengers, and passengers having to get 3 or 4 bus services now than rather just one journey
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(24 Oct 2021, 11:06 am)cbma06 wrote [ -> ]Originally I’m sure the 164 originally went to South Shields before that section got cut in favour of the Sunderland to Seaburn extension, I remember when the 164 only ran every 2 hours during daytime and was an express service only stopping at certain points between Sunderland and Hetton, when ok got purchased and the 535/536 took over the 161 route and eventually became the 35/35a/36 and killed that service aswell, nothing left much now , ashame it’s all for profit now than providing a bus service to passengers, and passengers having to get 3 or 4 bus services now than rather just one journey
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Would taking on the 79/79A and Extending to Sunderland Work then.
(25 Oct 2021, 2:15 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]Would taking on the 79/79A and Extending to Sunderland Work then.
Already plenty of services going to Sunderland, I would split the 71, and have service 79 extended from Hall lane estate to Seaham, and have the Houghton to Chester section ran by new service 704 and incorporate with the 701/702/703 pvr
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(25 Oct 2021, 2:39 pm)cbma06 wrote [ -> ]Already plenty of services going to Sunderland, I would split the 71, and have service 79 extended from Hall lane estate to Seaham, and have the Houghton to Chester section ran by new service 704 and incorporate with the 701/702/703 pvr
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I'd have had the peak 71 serve Rainton Bridge and Doxford Park myself.
Like it does around Seaham Enterprise Park.
Still have it run Chester - Seaham, but play about with the timings so that it is timed to connect with the trains at Seaham and open up a stack of new links at the same time. I'd have also played around with the timings, so the headway with the 78 was a bit more of a clock face.
You can probably see Seaham from Doxford Park, but there's not much chance of getting a bus between the two.
Instead punters were travelling in to Sunderland and back out again or clogging up one of the other bus routes around Silksworth, Ryhope or on the A19.
Ditto Chester and the business park (major source of employment for those in the Chester area) at Rainton Bridge.
Get an hourly bus and hope for a connection (not too bad heading there - awful heading back), use the car or take a look at the improved offering which offers direct links, but from an ops perspective it also has the potential to remove a load of traffic stuck at Woodstone Village and Fencehouses - easing pressure on the inevitably delayed and stuck 4 and 78.
Me being me, I'd have promoted it via free and paid for advertising. Can't whack a positive relationship with a business park and a load of free advertising. Multiply that by three business parks... And well all of a sudden thousands of people are aware of the service and the chances are that a proportion of them start using it.
71: as is during the day but with improved timetabling.
71P: am and pm peaks on a 30min frequency. Chester - Great Lumley - Fencehouses - Rainton Bridge - Houghton - Dox Park - A19 - Seaham (and station) - Seaham Enterprise Park.
Win win on so many levels.
They can have that suggestion on me.
(25 Oct 2021, 5:01 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]I'd have had the peak 71 serve Rainton Bridge and Doxford Park myself.
Like it does around Seaham Enterprise Park.
Still have it run Chester - Seaham, but play about with the timings so that it is timed to connect with the trains at Seaham and open up a stack of new links at the same time. I'd have also played around with the timings, so the headway with the 78 was a bit more of a clock face.
You can probably see Seaham from Doxford Park, but there's not much chance of getting a bus between the two.
Instead punters were travelling in to Sunderland and back out again or clogging up one of the other bus routes around Silksworth, Ryhope or on the A19.
Ditto Chester and the business park (major source of employment for those in the Chester area) at Rainton Bridge.
Get an hourly bus and hope for a connection (not too bad heading there - awful heading back), use the car or take a look at the improved offering which offers direct links, but from an ops perspective it also has the potential to remove a load of traffic stuck at Woodstone Village and Fencehouses - easing pressure on the inevitably delayed and stuck 4 and 78.
Me being me, I'd have promoted it via free and paid for advertising. Can't whack a positive relationship with a business park and a load of free advertising. Multiply that by three business parks... And well all of a sudden thousands of people are aware of the service and the chances are that a proportion of them start using it.
71: as is during the day but with improved timetabling.
71P: am and pm peaks on a 30min frequency. Chester - Great Lumley - Fencehouses - Rainton Bridge - Houghton - Dox Park - A19 - Seaham (and station) - Seaham Enterprise Park.
Win win on so many levels.
They can have that suggestion on me.
Since the 71 is secured and DCC provides the route and timetable, there must be a reason why the council hasn’t timed with the arrival of trains at Seaham etc…
There maybe an option between Doxford and Seaham , depending on demand for passengers, maybe extend service 37 from Doxford Park to Seaham via Burdon road and Burdon Lane and potentially withdrawl the 71 between Houghton and Seaham , depends if many from Seaham shop at Houghton , then the new 704 replace the 71 between Houghton and Chester
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(25 Oct 2021, 5:30 pm)cbma06 wrote [ -> ]Since the 71 is secured and DCC provides the route and timetable, there must be a reason why the council hasn’t timed with the arrival of trains at Seaham etc…
There maybe an option between Doxford and Seaham , depending on demand for passengers, maybe extend service 37 from Doxford Park to Seaham via Burdon road and Burdon Lane and potentially withdrawl the 71 between Houghton and Seaham , depends if many from Seaham shop at Houghton , then the new 704 replace the 71 between Houghton and Chester
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DCC only secure it because GNE can't (or won't) make a commercial go of it. Whether it be the 238 or the 71 - they send a bus over the hill on an hourly frequency and somehow expect the population to come to it and grace the service with their presence.
Except they didn't and now DCC are having to bail them out.
If they made something of it and created a service which could flourish, DCC could maybe spend the money on something else.
I'd also argue that persevering as is with a Chester - Houghton service is as sensible as buying a boat load of igloos to sell to camels living in the Saraha.
Anything they try on that corridor needs to be different to what they're offering now. It might work with it being different. It's not going to work doing the same old over and over again. I'd have thought they'd have learned that now.
(25 Oct 2021, 6:01 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]DCC only secure it because GNE can't (or won't) make a commercial go of it. Whether it be the 238 or the 71 - they send a bus over the hill on an hourly frequency and somehow expect the population to come to it and grace the service with their presence.
Except they didn't and now DCC are having to bail them out.
If they made something of it and created a service which could flourish, DCC could maybe spend the money on something else.
I'd also argue that persevering as is with a Chester - Houghton service is as sensible as buying a boat load of igloos to sell to camels living in the Saraha.
Anything they try on that corridor needs to be different to what they're offering now. It might work with it being different. It's not going to work doing the same old over and over again. I'd have thought they'd have learned that now.
For me looking at the route of the 71 I think it would be best to cut it Houghton-Le-Spring as from getting on the service a few weeks back it's not commercially viable to run when those who are using it are concessionary pass holders, it might pick up the odd fare but I doubt it makes above £500 in a day with a PVR of 2.
Personally if I was DCC I would do the following and put it out to tender:
168/169 - Houghton-Le-Spring - Seaton Station - New Seaham Mill Inn - Northlea - Seaham Byron Place - Castlereagh Aged Miners - Spectrum Business Park - Dalton Park Outlet - Murton - Easington Lane - Hetton-Le-Hole - Peat Carr Estate - Hetton-Le-Hole Interchange - Hetton Park Estate - East Rainton - Rainton Bridge - Dairy Lane - Houghton-Le-Spring.
As for the main section of the 71 from Houghton-Le-Spring to Chester-Le-Street i'd merge this with the 28 have it run through to Newcastle, or you could keep the 71 as it is now and still merge with the 28 and have as one through service on an Hourly Basis.
Are there any non-expresses that would benefit from peak only express variatons
(26 Oct 2021, 7:59 am)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]Are there any non-expresses that would benefit from peak only express variatons
27 and 56 particularly south of the Tyne
(26 Oct 2021, 8:58 am)54APhotography wrote [ -> ]27 and 56 particularly south of the Tyne
X56? all stops between park lane and concord then the old X95 route to Newcastle with stopping at Heworth, Gateshead interchange and Eldon square
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(26 Oct 2021, 7:59 am)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]Are there any non-expresses that would benefit from peak only express variatons
The 25, something like
click me
Running all stops to Chester Le Street then NON STOP -> Lambton Worm -> NON STOP -> Vigo Lane -> All stops to A1(M) -> NON STOP -> Harlow Green -> Stone Trough -> NON STOP -> Cannon -> NON STOP -> Gateshead
Would give a much quicker service to Waldridge Park etc which is way too slow atm and take some pressure off the 21 and 25 (could even replace one or two). Could even run it in front of the X21 and try and release some capacity on there for people going to Durham and beyond.
(26 Oct 2021, 9:31 am)cbma06 wrote [ -> ]X56? all stops between park lane and concord then the old X95 route to Newcastle with stopping at Heworth, Gateshead interchange and Eldon square
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Perhaps, selected stops to Washington then A195
27 is a desperate journey, X27 would go straight out of Shields onto A185 to Jarrow, Hebburn (Victoria Road), Pelaw and Heworth then non stop to Gateshead
(26 Oct 2021, 9:44 am)54APhotography wrote [ -> ]Perhaps, selected stops to Washington then A195
27 is a desperate journey, X27 would go straight out of Shields onto A185 to Jarrow, Hebburn (Victoria Road), Pelaw and Heworth then non stop to Gateshead
I would like to see a 4X or a 16X, I think those could work.
I'm also in the middle of creating a timetable for an 8X.
(26 Oct 2021, 9:44 am)54APhotography wrote [ -> ]Perhaps, selected stops to Washington then A195
27 is a desperate journey, X27 would go straight out of Shields onto A185 to Jarrow, Hebburn (Victoria Road), Pelaw and Heworth then non stop to Gateshead
I would do all stops between park lane to concord , if it was just selective bus stops then there be no passengers on the x56 to pay for use of the bus and drivers wages, GNE still need to make money and can’t do that if there’s potential passengers wanting to board the bus and the bus goes past them
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(26 Oct 2021, 10:27 am)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]I would like to see a 4X or a 16X, I think those could work.
I'm also in the middle of creating a timetable for an 8X.
What’s a 4X,16X and a 8X?
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(26 Oct 2021, 12:47 pm)cbma06 wrote [ -> ]I would do all stops between park lane to concord , if it was just selective bus stops then there be no passengers on the x56 to pay for use of the bus and drivers wages, GNE still need to make money and can’t do that if there’s potential passengers wanting to board the bus and the bus goes past them
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You could say the same thing about the 21/X21.
(26 Oct 2021, 1:01 pm)Keeiajs wrote [ -> ]You could say the same thing about the 21/X21.
Not really, the X21, for all intents and purposes is an entirely separate route that happens to run along the same corridor between Durham and CLS.
What you have to remember with the X21 is literally half of the route is after the 21 ends
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(26 Oct 2021, 12:47 pm)cbma06 wrote [ -> ]I would do all stops between park lane to concord , if it was just selective bus stops then there be no passengers on the x56 to pay for use of the bus and drivers wages, GNE still need to make money and can’t do that if there’s potential passengers wanting to board the bus and the bus goes past them
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What’s a 4X,16X and a 8X?
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4X - Fast Version of Connections4
8X- Fast Version of County Ranger 8 or 78
16X - Fast Version of Durham Diamond 16/16A
(26 Oct 2021, 2:32 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]4X - Fast Version of Connections4
8X- Fast Version of County Ranger 8 or 78
16X - Fast Version of Durham Diamond 16/16A
Surely the fast version of the 16 is the X5/X15. Not sure I agree any of them need fast versions tbh.
A fast version would only work where everyone is going to point A via B from C (being 55 minutes away). If say 20 people get on at C, 25 at B. You might want to run an express in the morning from C possibly extending to area D which is underserved, skipping B and C (or parts of anyway) altogether.
The Blyth X12 is a prime example of that with Cramlington being point B, Newcastle point A and Blyth point C. The X36 / old X7 used to be the same from Seaton Valley but failed sadly.
(26 Oct 2021, 2:32 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]4X - Fast Version of Connections4
8X- Fast Version of County Ranger 8 or 78
16X - Fast Version of Durham Diamond 16/16A
X4 Double Decker Possible extend it to Sunderland - Houghton - Fatfield (just before the bridge) - Non Stop Washington - Concord - Heworth - gateshead - Eldon Square every 30 mins. Could be a possible route for the X56, as that has been brought up.
16X wouldn't really be needed, as if there was a fast Country Ranger route that would go between Consett and Stanley.
(26 Oct 2021, 12:47 pm)cbma06 wrote [ -> ]I would do all stops between park lane to concord , if it was just selective bus stops then there be no passengers on the x56 to pay for use of the bus and drivers wages, GNE still need to make money and can’t do that if there’s potential passengers wanting to board the bus and the bus goes past them
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People know the difference between a 'X' and a standard bus, the selected stops would omit one on Southwick Road, one on Hylton Road North, and one on Washington Road. After that the bus would stop Nissan, Seven Houses then straightline to Concord omitting Sulgrave.