(08 Mar 2016, 7:43 pm)X8X9X10 wrote [ -> ]The X7/X8 don't exist to cater to the every whim of Quorum workers though. Creating further delays and elongated timetabling would just result in passengers already on the services from Blyth, Cramlington and Seaton Sluice having their journeys take longer just because it would be slightly more convenient for Quorum.
To be fair, that's like saying stopping at the Regent Centre is inconvenient for passengers travelling from Morpeth and heading to the town.
Or for the X12 stopping at Gateshead Interchange when all passengers from Durham want to do, is get to Eldon Square.
Then there are the Coast Road slip road stops.
(08 Mar 2016, 7:39 pm)X8X9X10 wrote [ -> ]Regarding the X7/X8, why not extend the 554 to Haymarket or have some equivalent shuttle service similar to the X6 to meet morning/evening demand inside the business parks?
I don't know about the X7, but I know the X8 already suffers huge delays (areas like Moor Farn roundabout near Annitsford and Cramlington serve as significant bottlenecks) at peak times to the extent that further extending the service without extra vehicles or timetable frequency would be a really bad idea.
If Blyth wanted to sort issues out with the X7 / X8 with no PVR increase whatsoever, they could do this with evening and Sunday journeys remaining the same on all routes. Extra time would be given to all services mentioned bar services X6 / X9. Monday to Saturday journeys would be like this:
- Current X6 renumbered to 9X. No other changes.
- Current X9 renumbered X6. No other changes.
- No route change to service X7 but with extra time added in timetable to improve reliability.
- Current X8 during Monday to Saturday daytime only running between Newcastle and Cramlington. Evening and Sunday journeys continuing to Blyth via normal route. Extra time added in timetable to improve reliability. X7 / X8 interwork in Newcastle.
- NEW X9 replaces northern section of the X8 between Blyth and Cramlington before continuing to Newcastle via the same routes as the X10 / X11. Extra time added on both sections of route to improve reliability. Buses running every 30 minutes during Monday to Saturday.
- X10 / X11 reduced to every 30 minutes each with extra time added to improve reliability. Evening and Sundays unchanged for both.
- X9 / X10 / X11 would run:
* Every 8-12 minutes from Blyth like this: 00:00; 00:10; 00:18; 00:30; 00:40; 00:48
* Every 15 minutes from Newsham in both directions like this (X10 / X11): 00:00; 00:15; 00:30; 00:45 very similar to the way that the 10/10B worked to and from Prudhoe when the TEN group of services were first revised.
* Every 9-11 minutes between Parkside and Newcastle in both directions like this: 00:00; 00:10; 00:21; 00:30; 00:40; 00:51
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(08 Mar 2016, 7:46 pm)S813 FVK wrote [ -> ]There are plenty more options to go to Blyth, Cramlington and Seaton Sluice, most of which are MAX, too.
There's pretty substantial areas in those towns where the nearest stop for the X9/X10/X11 is quite a distance away without having to connect. For example, in east areas of Cramlington near Klondyke and High Pit, the only service to Newcastle is the half-hourly X8. On the other hand, Quorum is served by the X7 too (meaning twice as many MAX Arriva buses) and Stagecoaches' X63 (quarter-hourly). Throw on the 52 and there's an extra two buses an hour. If one bus is delayed, it doesn't have such a substantial knock on effect.
My point being there are people who use and rely on the X7/X8 that can't feasibly use other Blyth-Newcastle MAX routes and it's not fair to elongate/delay those routes just to serve more of Quorum when the current setup, according to previous posters in this thread, is still accessible.
(08 Mar 2016, 7:50 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]To be fair, that's like saying stopping at the Regent Centre is inconvenient for passengers travelling from Morpeth and heading to the town.
More like taking the existing services that stop there and adding a bunch of unnecessary delay to their timetables so they can loop around inside Regent Centre proper because Regent Centre's workers are too inconvenienced by a couple minutes' walk.
(08 Mar 2016, 10:05 pm)X8X9X10 wrote [ -> ]More like taking the existing services that stop there and adding a bunch of unnecessary delay to their timetables so they can loop around inside Regent Centre proper because Regent Centre's workers are too inconvenienced by a couple minutes' walk.
But you say that, whilst arguing that other users of the X7/X8 would be inconvenienced by the minute and a half it'd take to serve the Quorum loop?
Guys, the simple problem with the X8 is the lack of time the service gets between Blyth and Quroum because of the following:
- Bebside
- Shankhouse / Three Horse Shoes / Horton Road
- Cramlington
- Moor Farm (F*****g nightmare that one is)
- Annitsford Roundabout
- West Moor / Camperdown / A189
If extra time was added with the route running between Newcastle and Cramlington only during Monday to Saturday with the section between Blyth and Cramlington covered by a sister service to the X10 / X11, it would solve many of the issue with all of Blyth's services (bar the 308 and the Blyth / Wansbeck / Morpeth locals) with no PVR increase.
(08 Mar 2016, 10:19 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote [ -> ]Guys, the simple problem with the X8 is the lack of time the service gets between Blyth and Quroum
The X12 had similar issues, and those between Sedgefield and Durham suffered as a result, losing a third of their hourly services.
You can only cut so much, before you lose sight of your purpose as a business - to serve the customer.
(08 Mar 2016, 10:19 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote [ -> ]Guys, the simple problem with the X8 is the lack of time the service gets between Blyth and Quroum because of the following:
- Bebside
- Shankhouse / Three Horse Shoes / Horton Road
- Cramlington
- Moor Farm (F*****g nightmare that one is)
- Annitsford Roundabout
- West Moor / Camperdown / A189
If extra time was added with the route running between Newcastle and Cramlington only during Monday to Saturday with the section between Blyth and Cramlington covered by a sister service to the X10 / X11, it would solve many of the issue with all of Blyth's services (bar the 308 and the Blyth / Wansbeck / Morpeth locals) with no PVR increase.
I think there needs to be a simplification of the X8 service, perhaps:
Run it Blyth to Bebside ASDA as it usually does, then straight down the Spine Road to the Moor Farm roundabout, and continue the usual route from there?
The 43 can take passengers from Shankhouse etc to Newcastle, where they can change onto a bus to Quorum?
(08 Mar 2016, 10:25 pm)Adrian wrote [ -> ]The X12 had similar issues, and those between Sedgefield and Durham suffered as a result, losing a third of their hourly services.
You can only cut so much, before you lose sight of your purpose as a business - to serve the customer.
But if people want to go south of Cramlington on the X8 route from Blyth during the day, they can easily get the X9 (or even the X6/X10/X11) to Cramlington then change. Splitting the route would solve many of the reliability issues and even open an opportunity to improve the other services too.
No route would be cut as such, it would just be split to improve the reliability with added time given.
Look at the old Diamond routes that GNE had and yes, there is teething issues with the Northern 6 which GNE should address during the April changes. The 43/44 ran fine between Durham and Stanley but anything North of Stanley was making the route out to become a Bermuda Triangle. GNE tried and tried and tried adding time to the 43/44/44A but they got to a stage that no matter what they did, the reliability wasn't going to improve with all the traffic blackspots between Stanley and Newcastle with the passengers between Stanley and Durham having to face major delays as a result of such incidents.
(08 Mar 2016, 10:28 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]I think there needs to be a simplification of the X8 service, perhaps:
Run it Blyth to Bebside ASDA as it usually does, then straight down the Spine Road to the Moor Farm roundabout, and continue the usual route from there?
The 43 can take passengers from Shankhouse etc to Newcastle, where they can change onto a bus to Quorum?
The actual section between Cramlington and Newcastle would certainly improve with extra time given to cope with the blackspots such as Moor Farm Roundabout. But the Northern section needs absorbed into another service for this to happen which would mean no PVR increase at all.
(08 Mar 2016, 10:28 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]I think there needs to be a simplification of the X8 service, perhaps:
Run it Blyth to Bebside ASDA as it usually does, then straight down the Spine Road to the Moor Farm roundabout, and continue the usual route from there?
The 43 can take passengers from Shankhouse etc to Newcastle, where they can change onto a bus to Quorum?
So you're suggesting the X8 omits Cramlington and have the 43 pick up the slack, but ignoring the fact that the 43 follows the same route as X10/X11 from Cramlington Shops out of the town meaning there'd then be no Newcastle service at all for the areas where only the X8 serves?
(08 Mar 2016, 10:50 pm)X8X9X10 wrote [ -> ]So you're suggesting the X8 omits Cramlington and have the 43 pick up the slack, but ignoring the fact that the 43 follows the same route as X10/X11 from Cramlington Shops out of the town meaning there'd then be no Newcastle service at all for the areas where only the X8 serves?
I'm sure that, for the bits of Cramlington that the X8 currently serves, at least one other bus serves them?
The 57 serves Klondyke, the X9 and 57 serve High Pit.
Changing buses is something lots of people have to do on a daily basis
(08 Mar 2016, 10:39 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote [ -> ]The actual section between Cramlington and Newcastle would certainly improve with extra time given to cope with the blackspots such as Moor Farm Roundabout. But the Northern section needs absorbed into another service for this to happen which would mean no PVR increase at all.
I think you're overall idea seems sound and with some tweaking in conjunction with the 57/57A, they could probably even get rid of the 58 which might free up a driver (though I may be being too optimistic there).
You could have the X8 go Cramlington-Quorum-Newcastle, even taking the time to make the Quorum loop while the X7 ignores it.
I'd suggest though that, even in the current X8 route, services could omit Moor Farm entirely by passing the turn onto the roundabout and continuing up to Dudley Lane roundabout on the A1171 (where the X10/X11 go onto the A19) and then looping back on themselves past the Business Park and McDonalds, into Annitsford on the B1505.
(08 Mar 2016, 10:56 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]I'm sure that, for the bits of Cramlington that the X8 currently serves, at least one other bus serves them?
The 57 serves Klondyke, the X9 and 57 serve High Pit.
Changing buses is something lots of people have to do on a daily basis
Okay, so say you have people in these areas use other services like the 57A to change at Cramlington Shops onto the X9/X10/X11, what is the net gain for your proposed changes? It would eliminate a route that is certainly used through Cramlington for, what, to further convenience Quorum users who are served by many more buses/hour than stops affected by your proposed cuts.
If anything, why not have the non-express services like the 52 and 54 serve more of Quorum and leave the express services how they are? The 52/54 would provide a connection to and from Newcastle four times an hour (the current frequency of the X7/X8), give a direct journey to those travelling to Cramlington via Burradon, and allow those wanting to travel into Blyth an opportunity to connect to a MAX service at either Burradon or Cramlington.
There's really no need to be cutting huge chunks of the X8 route out with a "just connect and deal with it" attitude just to try and slightly improve service to an area being serviced by the 554, 555, 52, 54, X7, X8 and StageCoach's X63.
(08 Mar 2016, 10:56 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]I'm sure that, for the bits of Cramlington that the X8 currently serves, at least one other bus serves them?
The 57 serves Klondyke, the X9 and 57 serve High Pit.
Changing buses is something lots of people have to do on a daily basis
Having to change bus can turn a 30 minute journey into a hour. That's 5 hours a week lost for someone working full time with the possibility of more expensive travel.
(08 Mar 2016, 11:46 pm)BusLoverMum wrote [ -> ]Having to change bus can turn a 30 minute journey into a hour. That's 5 hours a week lost for someone working full time with the possibility of more expensive travel.
Have to agree here, the amount of time that can be added onto journeys with having to connect between two or more buses can be significant even on services with fairly high frequencies, even on my journeys home from New College Durham at Framwellgate Moor - Newton Aycliffe when the 7 started terminating at Durham Bus Station instead of Framwellgate Moor (except a few peak runs) My journey times saw an increase from 55 minutes to around 1 hour, 30 minutes, some nights it was closer to two hours! This was all down to bad connection times between buses and the 64 being a pile of garbage as it was always late or never turned up!
(08 Mar 2016, 11:46 pm)BusLoverMum wrote [ -> ]Having to change bus can turn a 30 minute journey into a hour. That's 5 hours a week lost for someone working full time with the possibility of more expensive travel.
(08 Mar 2016, 11:55 pm)Jimmi wrote [ -> ]Have to agree here, the amount of time that can be added onto journeys with having to connect between two or more buses can be significant even on services with fairly high frequencies, even on my journeys home from New College Durham at Framwellgate Moor - Newton Aycliffe when the 7 started terminating at Durham Bus Station instead of Framwellgate Moor (except a few peak runs) My journey times saw an increase from 55 minutes to around 1 hour, 30 minutes, some nights it was closer to two hours! This was all down to bad connection times between buses and the 64 being a pile of garbage as it was always late or never turned up!
Exactly!
If the X8 were to omit Cramlington (as has been suggested here), there would be ridiculous connection times. It's not as simple as saying "oh the 57/57A exists, you can just connect there" considering that service runs hourly in the evenings and is even being reduced further due to the Northumberland council cuts.
By not having the X8 serve at least Cramlington Whitelea through to Annitsford, you'd have
no services at all for a substantial residential area past about 8pm (whereas the X8 currently serves here until 11:10pm). So Quorum workers can't walk five minutes to the stop outside but existing X8 users just need to suck up the potential half-hour work every night?
I used to live in East Cramlington and was a regular user of the old x25/x26 (x5/x6) now numbered x8, it used to provide a direct service into Newcastle operating directly via the spine road and South Gosforth after serving Annitsford. However Arriva then started messing around with the route, as well as the service number sending it around everywhere adding easily another 20 minutes to the journey time. It has since been sped up missing out some of the longer diversions, like the freeman, but I now find it much quicker and easier to drive to Ilford road and get the metro.
Most areas not to sure so may not get it exactly wright.
X17. Newcastle -kingston park-Ponteland -morpeth-ashington -wansbeck hospital
Monday to sunday
Mon to sat every hour
Sunday every 2 hours
The whole route would take around 1 hour 25 mins so a bit longer than the x21.
This route will run to kingston park providing a link to northumberland then the 79 route this would mean more frequent service in morpeth the service will run direct to Ashington handy for commuters then down to wansbeck hospital with the service extending to the hospital one 1 will ternamate at Ashington.
Mon to sat the service could be ran by ashington using mpds
Sunday jesmond could run it using a solo but interworking with another service.
With this service introduced the 1 will decrease by 1 vehcile
(27 Mar 2016, 8:39 pm)biglugs@yahoo.com wrote [ -> ]Most areas not to sure so may not get it exactly wright.
X17. Newcastle -kingston park-Ponteland -morpeth-ashington -wansbeck hospital
Monday to sunday
Mon to sat every hour
Sunday every 2 hours
The whole route would take around 1 hour 25 mins so a bit longer than the x21.
This route will run to kingston park providing a link to northumberland then the 79 route this would mean more frequent service in morpeth the service will run direct to Ashington handy for commuters then down to wansbeck hospital with the service extending to the hospital one 1 will ternamate at Ashington.
Mon to sat the service could be ran by ashington using mpds
Sunday jesmond could run it using a solo but interworking with another service.
With this service introduced the 1 will decrease by 1 vehcile
Newcastle Airport-Morpeth was poorly used on the 100. I can't see it making a comeback.
What MPDs are available like? Only got five at Ashington, 4 on the 57s and one spare.